MJ's 75 Gallons of Schnozberries

[opy01]

Yea, you could go rubbemade for the sump and put the skimmer in there. I wouldnt think you would need a devider in there either if you put the drain on one side and the pump on the other and the skimmer in the middle. The 15G could be the fuge with a 2" section for the drain to pour the water in then have a bubble trap then a HUGE fuge area with calerpa and such then about a 6" area for the return pump.

 

The only thing about that setup is you'd have to have 2 overflows and 2 returns. I would not drill the rubbermade and plumb it into the 15G because you risk flooding. Unless you have the fuge higher than the rubbermade and have the tank drain into the fuge then the fuge into the bubbermade so the fuge alwasy has the same amount of water in it. Then you risk pods getting sucked up into the skimmer which would probly happen anyways.

[Militant Jurist]

Here's what I had in mind. I think if I drilled the rubbermaid and then used a bulkhead for aquariums, it should hold. I could also use some superglue to make a more permanent seal.

 

[spanko]

So is the Rubbermaid there to hold additional live rock because you are going minimalist on rock in the display?

 

I think the drawing plan will work fine. Filter sock - or - eggcrate platform to hold floss or pads where the water comes from the display will be necessary me thinks.

[Militant Jurist]

So is the Rubbermaid there to hold additional live rock because you are going minimalist on rock in the display?

 

Yup! I've only got 55 or so lbs in the 75 atm, and the LR from the 20L will only contribute another 10 or 15. I also like it because I can toss random critters (crabs, etc) in there without killing them.

 

I think the drawing plan will work fine. Filter sock - or - eggcrate platform to hold floss or pads where the water comes from the display will be necessary me thinks.

 

I've got a filter sock ready. I might also DIY or buy a phosban style reactor for running carbon and some kind of GFO.

[opy01]

the problem is when you shut the pump off the tank drains into the sump that in turn drains into the fuge possibly flooding your floor.

 

This would be better since you always want your fuge to be full but not overfill. If the tank drains into it and it drains into the sump then the sump will catch water when the pumps are turned off and also it will be the lowest part of the tank to control ATO. You would just need to build a cheap platform for the fuge.

 

[spanko]

I guess I am just stupid here, but if it will work one way, why won't it work the other? Isn't it all about location of drain hole both in the tank and the Rubbermaid as to how much water will eventually reach the refugium?

Just seems like it can be setup correctly to accommodate power outages and such either way to me.

[opy01]

The sump will drain everything as high or higher than the drain into the fuge. If the tank drains into the sump the sump will continue to drain into the fuge until water stops draining. If the fuge is tall enough then thats fine but if the rubbermade is that much taller than the fuge then the fuge will overflow.

 

The other issue is ATO. The sump will always have the same amount of water in it if it drains into the fuge. The fuge will get low and you will need to run the ATO out of it. One of the main reasons for the sump is to have extra water in and be able to run the ATO out of it. The way I posted the fuge will always be full and the rubbermade will get low from evap.

[Militant Jurist]

I see what you are saying about the rubbermaid: essentially, when the pump is off, the 15 will be left to hold all of the water from the DT, since the rubbermaid will always have a constant water level. The only downside to your revision is that it would require me to drill the tank, which I'm not a big fan of doing if I don't have to.

 

I think I'm going to have to see how high I can keep the waterline using the LifeReef overflow. We'll have also have to get Richie to weight in about how much water he keeps in his sump/fuge. I think I can solve the problem just by lowering the running water level of the 15. Another option would be to also add a valve to the sump/fuge line, so that once the fuge hits a certain water level, I can close the valve and force the rubbermaid to take up the rest.

[opy01]

What about a HOB overflow for the fuge and just have the fuge a bit higher than the rubbermade? Although I would recomend going to any glass place like AAA Glass and having them drill it for a few bucks. They drilled my BC29 in 30 seconds lol.

[Militant Jurist]

What about a HOB overflow for the fuge and just have the fuge a bit higher than the rubbermade? Although I would recomend going to any glass place like AAA Glass and having them drill it for a few bucks. They drilled my BC29 in 30 seconds lol.

 

Well, I guess if I'm going the 15 route, I would just be taking the piece of glass, rather than the entire tank. That would allow both the sump and fuge to equally take up the drain water when the pump is off.

[arwndsh]

Why not just sit the 15 on a stand to make it the same height as the rubbermaid?

 

Also we used a 20L as the sump and it never overflowed. We kept it about half full.

[opy01]

So you are building the 15G from scratch?

[Militant Jurist]

Why not just sit the 15 on a stand to make it the same height as the rubbermaid?

 

Also we used a 20L as the sump and it never overflowed. We kept it about half full.

 

That's what I'm thinking about doing. There is a false floor in the stand, which I'm replacing. I'm thinking of only putting in a false floor for the area under the 15, and allowing the rubbermaid to sit on the floor. That should balance things out (I hope!)

 

So you are building the 15G from scratch?

 

Yup! I got pre-cut glass and trim from Chris Marks a while back.

[opy01]

Why not just sit the 15 on a stand to make it the same height as the rubbermaid?

 

Also we used a 20L as the sump and it never overflowed. We kept it about half full.

Isnt that what I said above and demonstrated in my pic?

 

Yup! I got pre-cut glass and trim from Chris Marks a while back.

Well then definately go get that one piece drilled.

[Militant Jurist]

That's actually one thing I'm contemplating: keeping the 20L or 15g with a lower operating water volume. I run about half full on the 10g with the 29, and it works just fine. I could do the same with the 15 or 20, and as long as I run the overflow at it's maximum height, I don't think it will drop that much water.

 

I'm back visiting my parents for the weekend, so I can't say for sure, but I can't imagine more than a 2" drop from the tank water level to the bottom of the overflow teeth. However, even with 2" over the roughly 48" x 18" surface area, we're talking less than 7.5 gallons. At that amount, I'd need to go with Opy's drilled suggestion. However, if it's more like an inch to an inch and a half of drop, we're talking only 4 to 6 gallons, which I think that the 15 gallon could handle in the original schematic. Plus, I could put a valve in the drain line, so that it's a controlled drain once the pump is off. I could use the drain line to retain any excess water.

 

Hm.... I actually like that idea! I could shut off the return pump, but still keep the full water level of the DT, rather than having the sump/fuge absorb it! Heck, if I remember right, most return pumps can have a valve turned to stop the flow, rather than disconnecting the power, right? I could rig up a system where turning one valve would manually turn the other as well, to avoid forgetful "accidents."

 

Thoughts? Have I gone crazy and this idea won't work?

[Needreefunds]

I was told early on that valves in the drain were a no-no, and I would have to agree. While being able to adjust flow is nice, or even for servicing, it does increase the risk of a clog. But taking your valve ideas a bit further- it's not so much for servicing or the "forgetful" accidents, but the drain back during a power outage that always concerns me.

 

I have plenty of room to hold the drain back in my little sump. Water level is held at optimum skimming level by my bubble trap. Evap shows up in the fuge and return area. I have yet to set up an ato

[Militant Jurist]

I was told early on that valves in the drain were a no-no, and I would have to agree. While being able to adjust flow is nice, or even for servicing, it does increase the risk of a clog. But taking your valve ideas a bit further- it's not so much for servicing or the "forgetful" accidents, but the drain back during a power outage that always concerns me.

 

I have plenty of room to hold the drain back in my little sump. Water level is held at optimum skimming level by my bubble trap. Evap shows up in the fuge and return area. I have yet to set up an ato

 

Hm.... I guess I'll need to put some more thought into that. I've used a check valve on the 29, to prevent the flow-back through the return with success though!

[Needreefunds]

Hm.... I guess I'll need to put some more thought into that. I've used a check valve on the 29, to prevent the flow-back through the return with success though!

Didn't realize we were talking check valve. I saw valve and thought ball valve.... still -I'm not a big fan lol.

Perhaps a nice safety feature, but I would still want ample room in the sump to hold the required extra volume.

 

Just me.

[Militant Jurist]

Didn't realize we were talking check valve. I saw valve and thought ball valve.... still -I'm not a big fan lol.

Perhaps a nice safety feature, but I would still want ample room in the sump to hold the required extra volume.

 

Just me.

 

Well, I was initially talking the "turn off the water" kind of valve in the initial post, but after reading yours, thought I should also mentioned the planned use of a check valve as well.

[bitts]

valves on the return line can be real bad news. would avoid the check valve like the plage and postion the siphion breaks in way to prevent back flow as much as posable instead.

 

 

i like your ideas about the sump & fuge. but wondering about why your doing a large tub or rock instead of a 30/40 breader with the rock to increase volume on the fuge. small sump with skimmer chamber & return chamber sized to acomadate backflow when pumps shut off. using a small powerhead to feed the fuge, then allowing it to overflow into the return chamber.

[Militant Jurist]

would avoid the check valve like the plage and postion the siphion breaks in way to prevent back flow as much as posable instead.

 

Really? I had thought that check valves were the way to go. The only problem I see with siphon breaks is that they can be a spraying mess when the return pump is fired back up.

 

 

i like your ideas about the sump & fuge. but wondering about why your doing a large tub or rock instead of a 30/40 breader with the rock to increase volume on the fuge. small sump with skimmer chamber & return chamber sized to acomadate backflow when pumps shut off. using a small powerhead to feed the fuge, then allowing it to overflow into the return chamber.

 

Well, my only real reason is that I already have the 15g and 20L aquariums on hand, as well as the rubbermaid. I may have to be on the look out for a cheap breeder for sale, because that certainly would reduce the complexity of the sump/fuge build.

[bitts]

one of the best parts of doing it this way is you could do the sump now. with a footprint sized to fit the 40in the stand as well. run what ever sump you have untill you have the chance to upgrade. i think your stand would fit a 40 & bigger is better.

[Militant Jurist]

I'll have to start checking craigslist and the local forums for a 40b then. I'm going to check out at least adding my little rubbermaid as a sump for now, since I have a lot of LR in it. I just want to make sure the water level will stay where I want it. I should be able to adjust the lifereef overflow to make it work.

[Needreefunds]

IIRC, I couldn't fit a 30 or 40b in my stand...really wanted one tho.

[arwndsh]

I believe a 20L was the widest we could fit in our stand.