Kinda's Large Tank Adventure (LTA)

[seabass]

6 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

There are still some dinos in the tank. I did now get a proper UV yet. The ones I see are expensive plus you need a pump.

Do you still have the Green Killing Machine?  You might just decide to use what you have.  UV is a tool, not a guaranteed quick cure (even the better ones).  Sure powerful UV with proper flow is better than weaker UV with more flow.  However, most of us have some budget restrictions.  You might even try a micron polishing filter in addition to you Green Killing Machine.

 

11 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

Po4 is 0.13

Keep it up there (and stable).  Phosphate doesn't kill dinos; it simply helps support other photosynthetic life (and the life which feeds on it).  This other life will provide competition for the dinos.  You mentioned culturing pods again; that's probably a good idea.

 

15 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

I'm planning on adding the rocks, snails and hermits from the sea to the display today. Any advices before I do?

I can't remember how long ago you collected these rocks.  Keep in mind that fish parasites can exist on rocks taken from the wild.  Keeping them fallow for a couple of months should almost guarantee that they have died off (and are safe to add to a display with fish).

 

I know that adding snails in the presence of dinos can result in dead snails.  Just keep that in mind.

 

20 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

I also have vermetid snails and I did not know they were a problem but my candy cane have some on it and it doesn't seems to like it. I cut them but they are everywhere in the tank...

That's another fairly difficult pest to eradicate.  Some say bumblebee snails will help (not sure about controlling a large population).  I've also read that calcium carbonate dosing can clog their tubes and kill them:  https://humble.fish/community/index.php?threads/calcium-carbonate-mix-to-kill-vermitid-snails.7126/.  You can also superglue their tubes shut, or even scrape them off at the base and remove them.

 

[Kindanewtothis]

15 minutes ago, seabass said:

Do you still have the Green Killing Machine?  You might just decide to use what you have

I do and it is in the display. However, I'm not sure it is working anymore. The LED indicator that tells you if the lamp is still working won't turn on... with a new bulb...

 

15 minutes ago, seabass said:

can't remember how long ago you collected these rocks.

December 14th. So too soon?

 

15 minutes ago, seabass said:

You can also superglue their tubes shut, or even scrape them off at the base and remove them

I won't be able to get all of them. Many are on rocks I cannot take out of the tank.

 

Edit: for the candy cane, what about dip? Would it kill the vermetids?

[seabass]

3 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

The LED indicator that tells you if the lamp is still working won't turn on... with a new bulb...

  I would assume the LED isn't burned out, and indicates a problem with the unit.  Those units are almost considered as being disposable.  It's a shame, 'cause they are sold at a pretty good price point.  You might have to get another; or decide that you want to run UV more often, and invest in something more reliable.

 

23 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

December 14th. So too soon?

It's still a risk.  I might wait 'til Valentine's Day.

 

25 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

I won't be able to get all of them. Many are on rocks I cannot take out of the tank.

That's why I said that they are difficult to eradicate.

 

26 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

Edit: for the candy cane, what about dip? Would it kill the vermetids?

I'm not aware of a dip to kill them.  However, if you can dip them, then you can remove the coral and clean them off (and the surrounding area) with a dental scaler.

[Kindanewtothis]

8 minutes ago, seabass said:

dental scaler

I add to google that one! 

 

Thanks for this advices.

 

I will wait for the rocks taken in the wild. I will try dipping the candy cane if I can get it out (just remember it was glued because my urchin was always taking it with him when passing by...)

[Kindanewtothis]

30 minutes ago, seabass said:

However, if you can dip them, then you can remove the coral and clean them off

That did not go well...

 

My 4 heads candy cane is now 2 x 2 heads...

 

 

[seabass]

You might end up calling that a happy accident.

[Kindanewtothis]

6 hours ago, seabass said:

It's still a risk.  I might wait 'til Valentine's Day

Will do.

 

This is what will be transfered. Just put some food in there:

 

 

[seabass]

Nice!

 

Have you identified those hermits?  They might be more aggressive than Scarlet Reef Hermits, or Blue Leg Hermits.

[Kindanewtothis]

11 minutes ago, seabass said:

Nice!

 

Have you identified those hermits?  They might be more aggressive than Scarlet Reef Hermits, or Blue Leg Hermits.

I was sure it was blue leg hermits

[mcarroll]

On 1/28/2023 at 9:03 AM, Kindanewtothis said:

There are still some dinos in the tank. I did now get a proper UV yet. The ones I see are expensive plus you need a pump.

If you go by the sizing "rule of thumb" that has accumulated on the dino thread I linked, (maybe 2 gallons per watt?  now I forget!) there may be a cheapie unit that will work for you.  

 

Remember, for optimal effectiveness you really want it operating directly in the display tank.  Calculate your UV size just based on the actual water volume in your display....just make sure you still optimize for parasites, which requires a high-dose.....if you're running a unit optimized for algae control, that means you want a smaller overall volume of water to treat OR it needs to have the ability to change the flow rate through it somehow....slower flow = higher UV dose, but for smaller treatment area.

 

Another alternative that gets less attention is micron filtration like the Marineland Polishing filter...usually around $80-90:

 

Run it in micron-filter mode (you can even use with diatom powder if you're willing to google the process, but not strictly necessary) and it will filter out spore-level items like dino's.  

 

It's not too hard to clean either....a bleach soak (follow their directions; don't overdo it!) will completely sanitize it; but a light pressure wash in the sink or out in your yard with the garden hose will clean most of the junk off for every-day cleanings.  I use a fitting like this on my utility sink hose to clean mine, and I don't have to turn it on very strong, nothing fancy: 

 

On 1/28/2023 at 9:03 AM, Kindanewtothis said:

Po4 is 0.13, I have some GHA but really not much.

This is optimal as far as the dino's go – even the little bit of hair algae.

 

On 1/28/2023 at 9:03 AM, Kindanewtothis said:

I'm planning on adding the rocks, snails and hermits from the sea to the display today. Any advices before I do?

Don't wait? 😉 

 

On 1/28/2023 at 9:03 AM, Kindanewtothis said:

I also have vermetid snails and I did not know they were a problem but my candy cane have some on it and it doesn't seems to like it. I cut them but they are everywhere in the tank...

I doubt they will prove to be more than a momentary irritation for those corals as long as all else is going well.

 

That said, I've heard on the internet that Bumblebee Snails might keep your vermitids from spreading anymore.   Try it out – and tell us how it goes if you do!

 

Don't feel overly pressured to try it IMO.  Vermitids do make the rocks harder to handle FOR ME 🩸, but in all the years I've hard em, they've never seemed to actually harm any coral....even corals that had to grow with/around a Vermitid tube.  The coral had a peculiar form since they base over things like that, but the corals smiled while they did it, as far as I could tell. 😉

[Kindanewtothis]

29 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

If you go by the sizing "rule of thumb" that has accumulated on the dino thread I linked, (maybe 2 gallons per watt?  now I forget!

They usually say 3 gallons per watt for dinos

[Kindanewtothis]

43 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

That said, I've heard on the internet that Bumblebee Snails might keep your vermitids from spreading anymore.   Try it out – and tell us how it goes if you do!

I might try, will look for these snails. I'll let you guys know.

[mcarroll]

8 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

They usually say 3 gallons per watt for dinos

...and that's for low-end, algae-optimized units that are only rated by tank size (eg GKM's).  And they do work when used as the folks in the thread do.

 

But if you want to look at AquaUV, for another example (maybe more reliable, definitely a better investment), they are a lot more expensive.  But a small part of the reason for that is that these units are all calibrated and rated...something that's actually very useful for us...

 

So say you have a 120 Gallon....maybe 100 gallons of actual water....given the way you will run it (direct in display) and their sizing guide, it looks like you could get away with any of their smallest units.  I think the Advantage 8 watt is their most economical.  

 

Again referring to their sizing guide, if you pump no more than 214 GPH through it, it'll whip the snot out of some dino's.  I'm not even using a metaphor there!! 😉 

 

You have to supply a pump, but even including that you can still set one of these up for ≤$200.  Not bad, depending on your point of view!   There's always the GKM!!

 

[Kindanewtothis]

12 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

...and that's for low-end, algae-optimized units that are only rated by tank size (eg GKM's).  And they do work when used as the folks in the thread do.

 

But if you want to look at AquaUV, for another example (maybe more reliable, definitely a better investment), they are a lot more expensive.  But a small part of the reason for that is that these units are all calibrated and rated...something that's actually very useful for us...

 

So say you have a 120 Gallon....maybe 100 gallons of actual water....given the way you will run it (direct in display) and their sizing guide, it looks like you could get away with any of their smallest units.  I think the Advantage 8 watt is their most economical.  

 

Again referring to their sizing guide, if you pump no more than 214 GPH through it, it'll whip the snot out of some dino's.  I'm not even using a metaphor there!! 😉 

 

You have to supply a pump, but even including that you can still set one of these up for ≤$200.  Not bad, depending on your point of view!   There's always the GKM!!

 

https://www.dyno.ca/produit/ultraviolet-sterilizer-3/?lang=en

 

This is the one I was considering. Will look at the one you linked.

[mcarroll]

8 hours ago, Kindanewtothis said:

https://www.dyno.ca/produit/ultraviolet-sterilizer-3/?lang=en

 

This is the one I was considering. Will look at the one you linked.

That's a good option too!!

 

I haven't seen the instructions for these.  If they are flow rated, I bet you can get by with either of the smaller units....but you have to know the GPH required.  The monster size that you linked would surely nail it.  👍

Edited January 30, 2023 by mcarroll
funny spellcheck-induced typo

[Kindanewtothis]

guillard's f/2 fertilizer and 2 bottles of pods.

 

I'm re-starting the pods culture with one and adding to other to the display.

 

Edit: in case someone doesn't know, the fertilizer is for my phytoplankton culture 

 

 

[Kindanewtothis]

On 1/29/2023 at 11:32 AM, mcarroll said:

You have to supply a pump, but even including that you can still set one of these up for ≤$200.  Not bad, depending on your point of view!  

What kind of pump do I need to run a UV? I'd like something I can use in the display for now but when dinos will be gone I would install it in the sump. Any recommandations ?

[mcarroll]

11 hours ago, Kindanewtothis said:

What kind of pump do I need to run a UV? I'd like something I can use in the display for now but when dinos will be gone I would install it in the sump. Any recommandations ?

Any pump will work if you size it correctly.  Pump size will be dictated by the flow rate recommended for the specific UV unit you end up with.

 

Adding a ball valve to control flow (or using a flow-adjustable pump) will probably be a must.

 

You have to replace the bulb every 6 months to 1 year (read the unit specs) so keeping them running 24/7/365 even when there's no trouble seems "extra".  But while you're still adding new fish (velvet is a dino) maybe keep it running that long + 6 months or something?

 

If you think you'll still want to run UV even after that, the first thing you'll want to do is ask yourself Why.  If it's for algae, then an in-line installation might work fine...maybe even with the unit you buy for the display...depends on the unit.  

 

It's possible you might even just move the UV installation from the display down to the sump as one piece and turn the flow up – simple if your have the room for it.

 

For a real in-line installation I think you'll want at least (eg) an AquaUV Classic 8 watt.  Even at 500 GPH you'll get an adequate UV dose for most algae.  There's an 8-watt Advantage model that's slightly less expensive with barb fittings, if you have that kind of plumbing.  Going 15-watt would give you a little more headroom to turn up the flow/hit larger organisms.  Seems like 25-watt is AquaUV's recommendation for a fully-capable sump installation that can get tough stuff like dino's.

 

IMO for long term use, a pleated canister filter is a bit more cost effective, as long as you make it easy for you to maintain.  (At least as "easy" as swapping UV bulbs.....or easier.). Marineland and Lifeguard make good ones...Marineland's Polisher is very compact(looks like they have a new "mag200" model that's even more compact), has a pump built in and would do well in the tank or in the sump, as-needed....Lifeguard's is built for in-line installation with standard plumbing fittings.  Prolly other micron filters out there you might want to consider too.

 

 

[Kindanewtothis]

33 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

It's possible you might even just move the UV installation from the display down to the sump as one piece and turn the flow up – simple if your have the room for it.

 

That sounds like a plan. For the display installation I'm just wondering how to set it up as I don't want livestock to get sucked in (including the anemone)

[mcarroll]

2 minutes ago, Kindanewtothis said:

That sounds like a plan. For the display installation I'm just wondering how to set it up as I don't want livestock to get sucked in (including the anemone)

IMO check out the Polishing filter/Magnum 200.  

 

It's not impossible to anemone-proof a pump intake tho....just adds a little bulk.   Any intake screen+sponge combination should work.

[Kindanewtothis]

2 hours ago, mcarroll said:

IMO check out the Polishing filter/Magnum 200.  

 

It's not impossible to anemone-proof a pump intake tho....just adds a little bulk.   Any intake screen+sponge combination should work.

The Magnum 200 is not expensive. I might get one with or without an UV.

[Kindanewtothis]

On 1/29/2023 at 10:43 AM, mcarroll said:

Another alternative that gets less attention is micron filtration like the Marineland Polishing filter...usually around $80-90

Just ordered it on Amazon. About 75 $ CAD. It's on sale! Will receive it sunday.

 

Anyone know how many microns is the filter? 

[Kindanewtothis]

On 1/29/2023 at 10:43 AM, mcarroll said:

you can even use with diatom powder if you're willing to google the process, but not strictly necessary

https://lareefclub.com/community/threads/diatom-filter-for-clearing-cloudy-water.48962/

 

Seems easy enough. I think I found the right stuff too: https://a.co/d/iFzA1ka

 

 

[mcarroll]

On 2/3/2023 at 3:37 PM, Kindanewtothis said:

Anyone know how many microns is the filter? 

I think 25µ.   Good enough for most things already.  

 

Unless you're working in the short-short term, regular "dirt" will slowly clog the pores of the filter almost like diatom powder will....so while flow drops, the filtration gets better and better (lower micron-µ) as the cartridge gets dirtier and dirtier.

 

Although a DE treatment might not hurt....there might be no need for diatom powder in your case.

 

14 hours ago, Kindanewtothis said:

https://lareefclub.com/community/threads/diatom-filter-for-clearing-cloudy-water.48962/

 

Seems easy enough. I think I found the right stuff too: https://a.co/d/iFzA1ka

 

 

That's food grade.

 

I think the pool grade is processed so that it's all jagged.  Better for filtering, not for eating tho!

 

Quote

Pool grade (also called filter grade) diatomaceous earth is treated with very high heat in a process called calcination, which changes the silicon dioxide into crystalline silica. Pool grade DE is toxic and should only be used in filtration.

 

You want something like this:

https://a.co/d/0CkEmpB

 

Any pool supply stores in your area?

[Kindanewtothis]

8 hours ago, mcarroll said:

I think 25µ.   Good enough for most things already.  

 

Unless you're working in the short-short term, regular "dirt" will slowly clog the pores of the filter almost like diatom powder will....so while flow drops, the filtration gets better and better (lower micron-µ) as the cartridge gets dirtier and dirtier.

 

Although a DE treatment might not hurt....there might be no need for diatom powder in your case.

 

That's food grade.

 

I think the pool grade is processed so that it's all jagged.  Better for filtering, not for eating tho!

 

 

You want something like this:

https://a.co/d/0CkEmpB

 

Any pool supply stores in your area?

So food grade is not good?

 

I thought it was safer.

 

Yes there are pool store around, but I will have to buy a big quantity. So can I use food grade DE? I still have time to cancel my Amazon order.