Klarion's Tongan Scape

[klarion]

Yay! Your babies are looking good! If it's babies you like, maybe you should start a frag tank full of cool stuff... heh oh the things I would do if I had more moneys and time lol. Just keep an eye on that Emerald. Some people keep them for years without any "nippage" and some people have problems with them right away. Wouldn't want to see your babies disappear along with the bubble algae. >.<

 

How are your levels doing? B-ionic is definitely a great way to maintain your levels. Have you been able to get things tested again with a different kit?

 

LOL, I noticed a lot of people like those frag tanks and also they tend to be into SPS and LPS corals too. I'm keeping softies for now because my lighting and tank size can not sport such aggressive and light demanding corals. Maybe in the future....

 

As far as water chemistry is concerned, we've just started this discussion and it may take some time for me to get more sensitive tests for CA, Mg. I will post an update when that's done, of course.

[klarion]

I have to tell ya it's an awesome win over the algae. You're stronger than I am in terms of patience. I'd just tear my tank down and rip it apart and ruin it therefore spreading the algae problem further

 

Thank you. I am trying to keep things as natural as possible given the constraints of a closed ecosystem. So far the algae is in check by the CUC except in a couple of spots. Also, lately my glass is getting covered with green film of algae. I know that's to be expected but it grows on really fast, like a couple of days and I have to wipe the glass clean. Is that normal?

 

Granted, my nitrates are at 5ppm so it might be that! I'm making another WC today to export some of those DOC's.

 

I'd put money on your Mg levels being out of sync. Dosing PurpleUp alone is going to cause you more headache than anything else. Your aquarium needs balance grasshopper. Get a good two-part solution like B-Ionic and use half the recommended dosage.

 

Taken under advisement. Thank you.

Edited January 17, 2008 by klarion

[klarion]

Josh, I'm amused to learn I'm not the only one using the "smell-test" on inert snails!

 

Also, thanks for answering the bristle worm question. Exactly my sentiments.

 

Boris, this sort of question comes up so often I've saved a file of some links and excerpts. Hope you don't mind if I post it here:

 

********************************************************

 

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-04/rs/index.php

 

Excerpt: "The fireworms [aka bristle worms] that are most frequently found in aquaria may be very abundant. Even a small aquarium may have thousands of them, and they are beneficial scavengers."

 

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-05/rs/index.php

 

Excerpt: "There are many other types of bristle worms found in marine aquaria, and I am sure the number of reported types will increase in the future as people start to use less toxic water mixes, and as shipping of live rock and live sand gets less traumatic for the animals in them."

 

http://home2.pacific.net.ph/%7Esweetyummy42/hitchworms.html

 

Excerpt: "The Amphinomidae - Amphinoids are also known as "fireworms" and have calcareous setae filled with poisonous secretions. When irritated, they erect their sharp setae which break off at a touch releasing their poisonous contents into the wound. Most species are found on corals, rocks and other hard substrata covered with attached organisms. They swim well and can be brilliantly colored. All but one species can be considered harmless and are great scavengers."

 

********************************************************

 

Not so much for you, but for anyone else following your thread who has the same question...If it's too much of a hijack, just delete it.

 

Here's the classic link for eradicating a Eunicid!:

 

http://www.oregonreef.com/sub_worm.htm

 

BTW, here's an ancient pic of a couple of my bristle worms, one of the longer ones (for my tank--maybe 6" or so) and a smaller one to the right of the hitcher duster:

 

 

As to regulating their numbers, I'm not sure you have a choice. If you have any in your tank they will reproduce to the level the environment will bear!

 

Emeralds do start out a bit shy, just like many other inverts we add. You will probably find the shyness dissipates over time, esp. once you get more "cover" in there (corals, macros, whatever), and ESP. if you start feeding your tank! They love food! (But of course, you want it to eat your nuisance algae. A bit of warning, though--if you do get some sessile inverts you want to feed, you will probably be better off feeding your emerald--and probably your hermits, too--first, so they won't be tempted to rob your star lps or whatever...)

 

BTW, Borneman used to have a coral forum over on Marine Depot. If it's still running you could post your "Xenia" over there and see if you get any help with the ID. It sure is gorgeous.

 

--Diane

 

Hi Diane, It took me a while to read through your post and links. Of course I do not think you've highjacked my thread. In fact, I want as much useful information on it as possible and you always have some. My goal is eventually to have a tank that has a natural appearance and a lived in look. For that reason, I'm trying to get smaller frags of corals and let them expand and grow naturally.

 

I'm not totally against bristle worms and I did have them in my previous tank. I feel a little bad about tossing the small one that came on a frag, but I also wanted them to develop in my tank without adding too many all at once. I guess it's pointless to toss them because they arrive into the tank on rocks as hitchers anyway, so I will stop doing that.

 

About feeding Emeralds. What do you feed yours? I do feed the tank every couple of days and it seems that the inverts have plenty of left overs in addition to the algae. The Emerald stays mostly in the tunnels and once in a while I see him picking on something. The snails have actually grown (or at least their shells).

[c est ma]

Boris, BTW, I love your word highlighting too. Your thread is always an aesthetic pleasure to visit.

 

Well, of course emeralds will eat anything. When I'm feeding Cyclopeeze I use a disposable pipet and squirt some at as many of the motile inverts as I can before targeting the rics, etc. The inverts usually emerge as soon as the pipet hits the water--their olfactory senses are amazing. Brittle star arms waving everywhere, pom pom, hermits, emerald popping out...

 

Most often I feed sinking pellets and I've seen the emerald grabbing these out of the water as they float by. But I did inadvertantly "train" my last emerald to take sinking algae wafers right from a set of 12" forceps, and it came in very handy when I needed to remove him. I just gave him the wafer and was able to grab him with the forceps around his body and lifted him out, wafer and all. He was so intent on his prize I'm not sure he even noticed.

 

My current emerald will also take a wafer out of the forceps, and then she usually scurries back to her current burrow to enjoy it. I think they're Ocean Nutrition wafers, and I usually only feed the crab 1/4 or 1/2 wafer at a time, unless I really want to keep her occupied for a while! (My pom pom enjoys a little chunk of wafer as well. She won't take it from the forceps but lets me place it on the rock pretty close to her. This is also a good strategy for occupying hermit crabs if you need to.)

 

I don't do this too often--was working on her "training" more often back when I thought my little plate was going to detach soon, but that hasn't happened yet, and I've still got plenty of algae...

 

--Diane

[Krayon]

Boris, BTW, I love your word highlighting too. Your thread is always an aesthetic pleasure to visit.

 

Well, of course emeralds will eat anything. When I'm feeding Cyclopeeze I use a disposable pipet and squirt some at as many of the motile inverts as I can before targeting the rics, etc. The inverts usually emerge as soon as the pipet hits the water--their olfactory senses are amazing. Brittle star arms waving everywhere, pom pom, hermits, emerald popping out...

 

Most often I feed sinking pellets and I've seen the emerald grabbing these out of the water as they float by. But I did inadvertantly "train" my last emerald to take sinking algae wafers right from a set of 12" forceps, and it came in very handy when I needed to remove him. I just gave him the wafer and was able to grab him with the forceps around his body and lifted him out, wafer and all. He was so intent on his prize I'm not sure he even noticed.

 

My current emerald will also take a wafer out of the forceps, and then she usually scurries back to her current burrow to enjoy it. I think they're Ocean Nutrition wafers, and I usually only feed the crab 1/4 or 1/2 wafer at a time, unless I really want to keep her occupied for a while! (My pom pom enjoys a little chunk of wafer as well. She won't take it from the forceps but lets me place it on the rock pretty close to her. This is also a good strategy for occupying hermit crabs if you need to.)

 

I don't do this too often--was working on her "training" more often back when I thought my little plate was going to detach soon, but that hasn't happened yet, and I've still got plenty of algae...

 

--Diane

by no means do i wish to hijack this thread, but just how good of an expierence have you had with the emerald crap, i have been thinking about obtaining one, but i have read that they do more harm then good. so what do you think?

[dshnarw]

... emerald crap...

 

funny...thats how I feel about pretty much all crabs

[klarion]

by no means do i wish to hijack this thread, but just how good of an expierence have you had with the emerald crap, i have been thinking about obtaining one, but i have read that they do more harm then good. so what do you think?

 

Well, I've only had mine for about a week and so far he's shy and just hides inside the reef since I have plenty of space there. I think he's munching on my bubble algae at night and I've seen him pick on other algae too. His claws are not like pincers, they're the shape of thin electrical pliers. He clamps the algae and pulls it out. So far, I've not seen him pull on corals but I don't have that many. I'll keep updating as I go.

[Krayon]

funny...thats how I feel about pretty much all crabs

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, i didnt even notice that XD, aw well i just keep it like that

[klarion]

The Indignities of Snails, Coral Baby and Crab

 

I caught these two embroiled in a serious dispute: Astraea trying to shake off the intruder and Margarita intent on getting fed, both hanging upside down over a precipice.

 

And this is the Zoa baby looking like a complete polyp now. The hermit is just hanging out.

[c est ma]

by no means do i wish to hijack this thread, but just how good of an expierence have you had with the emerald crap, i have been thinking about obtaining one, but i have read that they do more harm then good. so what do you think?

 

I had one that I returned to the lfs after it killed a baby plate coral by tearing into its flesh to get at a nice mound of Cyclopeeze. Even then, I did not blame the crab--I blamed myself for stuffing the plate and then leaving it in harm's way...Because I do appreciate emeralds for what they do and how entertaining they are, I have since obtained another one. I now have a fuge, and if my next baby plate ever detaches I think I'll put the emerald in the fuge for a while...

 

It mostly has to do with how much you enjoy inverts, how big an algae problem you have, etc. They are big eaters and it's often been proposed (by several N-R members) that they might be more prone to "go bad" when they run out of food. If you don't have enough algae, they need to be fed! They also need to be fed when you're feeding the rest of your tank something yummy, because they will sense it and want some too.

 

Some of us think that females might stay a little smaller and present less of a potential problem than males...

 

HTH.

 

 

The Indignities of Snails, Coral Baby and Crab

 

I caught these two embroiled in a serious dispute: Astraea trying to shake off the intruder and Margarita intent on getting fed, both hanging upside down over a precipice.

 

And this is the Zoa baby looking like a complete polyp now. The hermit is just hanging out.

 

I used to be known for my "vignettes" around here, but I think you're going to surpass me. Snail drama!

 

Nice growth on the baby zoa.

 

--Diane

[klarion]

I had one that I returned to the lfs after it killed a baby plate coral by tearing into its flesh to get at a nice mound of Cyclopeeze. Even then, I did not blame the crab--I blamed myself for stuffing the plate and then leaving it in harm's way...Because I do appreciate emeralds for what they do and how entertaining they are, I have since obtained another one. I now have a fuge, and if my next baby plate ever detaches I think I'll put the emerald in the fuge for a while...

 

It mostly has to do with how much you enjoy inverts, how big an algae problem you have, etc. They are big eaters and it's often been proposed (by several N-R members) that they might be more prone to "go bad" when they run out of food. If you don't have enough algae, they need to be fed! They also need to be fed when you're feeding the rest of your tank something yummy, because they will sense it and want some too.

 

Some of us think that females might stay a little smaller and present less of a potential problem than males...

 

--Diane

 

 

So far I like what the emerald is doing. He's like a lawn mower and he goes for the algae that no one else will touch. I seem to have enough fresh growth for him to eat and the snails are happy too because after he clears an area of the filamentous lagae, they can move in and scrape what's left over.

[Krayon]

So far I like what the emerald is doing. He's like a lawn mower and he goes for the algae that no one else will touch. I seem to have enough fresh growth for him to eat and the snails are happy too because after he clears an area of the filamentous lagae, they can move in and scrape what's left over.

hmm, i think i might, MIGHT add 1 to my Gsp/Xenia tank if the hair algae comes back. o and any new pics?

[knoxvegas]

Klarion, I just wanted to say great tank and thread, very informative. The photography is great, as well. I've read through the whole thread, but If you referenced, I missed it: What camera are you using?

[klarion]

Klarion, I just wanted to say great tank and thread, very informative. The photography is great, as well. I've read through the whole thread, but If you referenced, I missed it: What camera are you using?

 

Hi and thanks,

 

I'm using Konica-Minolta 7D digital camera with a Minolta 50mm 2.8 macro lens and a Sigma 28-70 EX DG zoom lens to take the pix. Post processing is with Photoshop 7 and I use Photobucket to host the files.

 

Thanks for reading.

 

hmm, i think i might, MIGHT add 1 to my Gsp/Xenia tank if the hair algae comes back. o and any new pics?

 

Hi. It might be a good idea. My Emerald is a good worker and I have seen him eat bubble algae, hair algae, young caulerpa and various other sp. of algae. No coral damage so far. I will keep you posted. Sorry, but the pix will come a bit later. It's been a busy time for me.

[klarion]

Here is a quick shot of the Scarlet Reef Hermit Crab next to a bunch of Zoas. It's not clear from this picture, but one of the Zoa polyps is about to spring three new babies.

 

 

Edit: Actually, It seems that there are 5 new polyps developing. I'll post pics once they grow up a bit.

Edited February 8, 2008 by klarion

[klarion]

Margarita Snail At Work.

[Orange Crush]

OC likey.

 

How do you feel about going with the retrofit a couple months down the road rather than getting an AIO? I'm glad you did; it looks good and AIO's start looking all the same after a while. I like the choice of the tonga rock too, and great documentation

[klarion]

OC likey.

 

How do you feel about going with the retrofit a couple months down the road rather than getting an AIO? I'm glad you did; it looks good and AIO's start looking all the same after a while. I like the choice of the tonga rock too, and great documentation

 

 

I still think it was the best thing for me to do and I'm not completely done with outfitting the tank, but is anyone ever:). I'm eventually planning to do some sort of a sump upgrade and definitely a lighting one.

 

Remember the my first Zoa baby pics.... Well, it is now completely separated and moving away from the main polyp:

 

 

There is a new type of Red Macro Algae growing in a couple of spots:

 

And my Schitzo Blue hermit was sizing up a new home again. He switched shells three or four times already:

 

More Inspection:

 

There are five more Zoa polyps on the way (pix when they grow up a bit).

[c est ma]

Nice updates, Boris. Those are super hermit pics! Glad the margarita's hanging in there, and congrats on the multiplying zoas.

 

Red macros are generally nice to have, IME.

 

--Diane

[klarion]

Oh, Crap!!!

 

I'm pissed because I just discovered that my coralife digital thermometer (that small one many people use) is a piece of crap and was reading more than 3 degrees off. For a while I couldn't understand why my temperatures were so unstable and unusually low and on further investigation I just couldn't believe that 2 thermostatic heaters and a glass thermometer were all off - impossible! It was the coralife thermometer that was off by twice the variable advertised by the company!

 

It was probably my fault for blindly believing the marketing ploys of corporate sales departments and in the end this stupidity probably caused the deaths of my snail and my beautiful coral boxing shrimp (first time mention) because inadvertently I've been running my tank at 81-83 F for over 2 months.

 

Let this mistake be a warning to everyone to double check temperature readings on those things.

Edited February 12, 2008 by klarion

[divecj5]

Just ran across your thread after catching up with Diane's. First off, what an amazing slice of the reef you have going there. I always enjoy reading people's threads who get enjoyment out of the small natural things in the tanks instead of just corals. Don't get me wrong, corals are amazing but I just like more of a documentary style thread than anything else. Yours among a handful of others are my favs.

 

I also agree with your style of reefing as well. Although I started off with the mindset that I wanted 0 algae in my tank, I have learned through my 55 gallon and now that my 29 has been running for 8 months that it just simply isn't possible. I ended up getting so frustrated trying to keep things clean that the tank became a chore and not something that I could enjoy. Now I just make sure that things aren't getting out of hand and I let some of the algea live.

 

Great work....I'll be tagging along for sure.

 

Sorry to hear about the thermometer...I have the same one as well and have been trying to find a replacement for a while. There are lots out there but a mixed bag of opinions on almost all of them. I guess only the really really expensive ones are truly accurate.

[klarion]

I also agree with your style of reefing as well. Although I started off with the mindset that I wanted 0 algae in my tank, I have learned through my 55 gallon and now that my 29 has been running for 8 months that it just simply isn't possible. I ended up getting so frustrated trying to keep things clean that the tank became a chore and not something that I could enjoy. Now I just make sure that things aren't getting out of hand and I let some of the algea live.

 

Great work....I'll be tagging along for sure.

 

Sorry to hear about the thermometer...I have the same one as well and have been trying to find a replacement for a while. There are lots out there but a mixed bag of opinions on almost all of them. I guess only the really really expensive ones are truly accurate.

 

Thanks,

 

I tend to agree that 0 algae is somewhat of an unreasonable goal. I just want to see what develops in my tank. Since each tank is setup differently anyway, they will all favor a different set of organisms naturally. I've had some algae dominant at various times and so far nothing has gotten out of control by my standards. My ultimate goal is to introduce several types of corals into the system and watch them colonize the available space in as natural a way as possible given the limitations of a home aquarium. I don't think my lighting is good enough for SPS though.

 

So far I've had the usual algae blooms for a maturing tank. Diatoms and cyanobacteria went by quickly. Then I had a short period of excessive growth on the glass of green algae. Now that has slowed down as well. Several varieties of green hair algae made an appearance about 3 weeks ago. That's when I got the emerald crab and he's slowly working on those. I expect that he'll keep harvesting for a while because he never completely finishes a patch, leaving just a little bit. I think that's an evolutionary adaptation to keep the food supply multiplying near by.

 

My concern is the appearance of dinoflagellates. It's not terrible now, but they are growing rather fast. We'll see how things develop. I hope that it is a temporary situation.

Edited February 12, 2008 by klarion

[divecj5]

I agree that it really is cool to see the different types of organisms that start colonizing our small reefs...I know that in my tank there are a lot more feather dusters and micro fauna than when it was 3 or 4 months old.

 

I guess it's just my geeky marine science major side of me coming out

 

Check out my thread sometime if you get the chance. It's a bit long running now and I am slowly getting back to posting more regularly.

Edited February 12, 2008 by divecj5

[c est ma]

I'm pissed because I just discovered that my coralife digital thermometer (that small one many people use) is a piece of crap and was reading more than 3 degrees off.

 

It was probably my fault for blindly believing the marketing ploys of corporate sales departments and in the end this stupidity probably caused the deaths of my snail and my beautiful coral boxing shrimp (first time mention) because inadvertently I've been running my tank at 81-83 F for over 2 months.

 

Let this mistake be a warning to everyone to double check temperature readings on those things.

 

Sorry to hear about the snail & the shrimp!

 

A good reminder to double check whatever we can...

 

I guess I'm a little surprised that temps in that range proved so lethal, tho, esp. in an as yet uncrowded tank such as yours...it seems to me that some people routinely keep their tanks in the upper temp range, for whatever reason. I know mine can easily stay around 82º during certain stretches of the summer.

 

 

 

 

I agree that it really is cool to see the different types of organisms that start colonizing our small reefs...I know that in my tank there are a lot more feather dusters and micro fauna than when it was 3 or 4 months old.

 

I guess it's just my geeky marine science major side of me coming out

 

For me it's just the biology major...AFAIC nothing epitomizes biology more than the incredible diversity that manages to thrive in our little microcosms...

 

 

--Diane

[klarion]

Sorry to hear about the snail & the shrimp!

 

A good reminder to double check whatever we can...

 

I guess I'm a little surprised that temps in that range proved so lethal, tho, esp. in an as yet uncrowded tank such as yours...it seems to me that some people routinely keep their tanks in the upper temp range, for whatever reason. I know mine can easily stay around 82º during certain stretches of the summer.

 

It's hard to figure out what caused such an unfortunate turn of events and it may not have been the temperature because the snail definitely wasn't doing as well ever since the transfer from LFS. The shrimp lost its claw while molting and died shortly afterward. Besides that, I also lost the mushroom leather coral also because I botched up its transfer, IMO because I touched it with my hands a couple of times while doing that.

 

Everyone else is happy go lucky. There are now seven new zoa polyps and I discovered 3 more Xenia younglings in the tank as well as some chaeto.

Edited February 16, 2008 by klarion