tibbsy07 5.5 pico reef

[jedimasterben]

Xenia does not tolerate peroxide in any amount, they're fine with Purigen.

 

Peroxide breaks down in just a few hours, leaving only pure water and oxygen. If it sat outside of the dark bottle for more than just a couple of hours, it was completely broken down and couldn't be the cause of your issues.

[tibbsy07]

Xenia does not tolerate peroxide in any amount, they're fine with Purigen.

 

Peroxide breaks down in just a few hours, leaving only pure water and oxygen. If it sat outside of the dark bottle for more than just a couple of hours, it was completely broken down and couldn't be the cause of your issues.

Well it's either the purigen, peroxide, or a byproduct of the peroxide with the purigen. That was the only difference to the tank and immediately the xenia were unhappy again. Now they are tiny tiny tiny. They didn't like when I had purigen in there before.

[markalot]

Peroxide kills them, fast. Mine melted to just a small patch of goo. They were back within a month, but the results of lightly dosing my 46 with peroxide were immediate.

 

I have purigen in my 29 and the xenia are going strong. I suspect it might be something to do with a purigen bag, in small tank, stripping the water of something the Xenia needs.

 

You are exporting via just water changes, right? No skimmer or refug?

[tibbsy07]

Peroxide kills them, fast. Mine melted to just a small patch of goo. They were back within a month, but the results of lightly dosing my 46 with peroxide were immediate.

 

I have purigen in my 29 and the xenia are going strong. I suspect it might be something to do with a purigen bag, in small tank, stripping the water of something the Xenia needs.

 

You are exporting via just water changes, right? No skimmer or refug?

Correct - water changes only. I expect that the purigen in such a small tank is likely pulling something out of the water, but I highly doubt it would cause melting of the xenia within 15 minutes of being added.

 

Here are the series of events:

• End of March through April 27th, I did weekly water changes of 1 gallon using IO salt, purigen in the rear chamber. Xenia are unhappy the whole time.

 

• Return from business trip to tank a bit out of control, due to no water change and no topping off for a week. Xenia are grumpy, but that could be anything at this point

 

• Buy new IO salt, do a 2.5 gallon water change on May 11. Remove purigen from HOB, swap out for activated carbon. Put purigen in H2O2 to renew, 24 hrs, rinse with water, store away. By am of May 12th, xenia are looking better. Zoas look a little weird - check for pods, and I have amphipods making them angry. OK.

 

• Week goes by, everyone is looking fantastic. Xenia are out and pulsing again. But I lost the crab and two snails, and so the tank is getting dirty with no CUC. Test water parameters, everything is normal. Mg and Ca might be a bit off, but not extremely.

 

• Do a water change on Sunday night of 1 g, and add back the bag of purigen to help remove some nutrients. Within 15 minutes, the xenia have completely closed, are melting by next morning. The kenya tree and blue sympodium are almost the same.

 

Correlation does not equal causation, however I believe that I have enough evidence here to suggest it's in the purigen/peroxide treatment from Sunday.

 

1.) CPE used, no purigen - xenia and whole tank happy

 

2.) Remove CPE and add purigen - xenia are unhappy

 

3.) Remove purigen and add back carbon - xenia are happy

 

4.) Add peroxide-treated purigen back - xenia melt, and the kenya and blue sympodium freak out, too.

 

If the purigen is stripping something heavily, then I would expect stress on the coral, as I saw over the month of April, but not within 15 minutes. Especially with a water change, given the fact that the water change has introduced a lot of nutrients to the system, and the purigen should be limited in what it can pull away instantly.

 

The peroxide should have been broken down over the 24hr treatment period, but it doesn't mean that it actually was, and it doesn't mean that there wasn't some reaction with the purigen. Maybe the purigen holds peroxide longer? I don't know.

 

I'd say the new salt but I've been using it and it was fine. All signs point to an issue with the purigen and/or peroxide.

[markalot]

Might be an indication that when media is packed in, like purigen, not all the the peroxide was exposed to water so it did not break down.

 

/shrug

 

I buy small purigen bags, throw them out when brown. Give something for archeologists to ponder in a couple hundred thousand years.

[tibbsy07]

Might be an indication that when media is packed in, like purigen, not all the the peroxide was exposed to water so it did not break down.

 

/shrug

 

I buy small purigen bags, throw them out when brown. Give something for archeologists to ponder in a couple hundred thousand years.

lol

 

I used purigen in my 12g and it was great. I think it's a combination of too much stripping from the water in such a small tank (caused the unhappiness before) and the likelihood of a lack of peroxide removal from the purigen (could be many reasons) that resulted in this problem.

 

I had good luck with both carbon (though without a CUC it got messy) and CPE. I know those work for this particular tank, so I'm going to stick with those. I will give purigen another go on a different tank if I need to.

 

 

 

On a random note, but very cool and a great read - http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/fish-poop-is-great-coral-food

We all knew that fish poop was great for corals - now there is some actual research to back it up!

[joy13]

On a random note, but very cool and a great read - http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/fish-poop-is-great-coral-food

We all knew that fish poop was great for corals - now there is some actual research to back it up!

Someone needs to come up with frozen fish poop in a cube or in a liquid, they could make a fortune.

[ZephNYC]

Someone needs to come up with frozen fish poop in a cube or in a liquid, they could make a fortune.

 

This is the best idea I have heard throughout all the BS new inventions. You Sir, are a genius.

[tibbsy07]

Someone needs to come up with frozen fish poop in a cube or in a liquid, they could make a fortune.

If science doesn't work out, I'll do this

[tibbsy07]

So Kat showed me this today: http://www.marinedepot.com/Ecoxotic_E_Series_Full_Spectrum_LED_Light_System_Pre_Order_Aquarium_LED_Light_Fixtures-Ecoxotic-XX09400-FILTFILDPO-vi.html

 

Interesting. The one for my tank would only be $133. It is controllable and full spec, though I wonder how powerful the lights actually are.

 

The idea of using this is kind of cool, though. http://www.ecoxotic.com/eco-pico-reef.html I want a nicer, cube style tank. I could get this for 130 and then just use my AC70. I think that would look really nice. Again, though, I wonder about the light. I've heard good things about the EcoPico 3-way LED. Some folks here have used them and had success.

 

Kat also suggested building my own array using 2 Panorama Pros, though I have no idea which ones I would use. I could use 2 of them and mount them inside a custom fixture.

[markalot]

Meh.

 

Why not go with BuildMyLED Linking to the 14K high output fixture as an example:

 

http://www.buildmyled.com/14000k-reef-spectrum-xb-series/

 

 

 

The only drawback is no control over the color, but you can build your own LED combination and, if you don't need the PAR, save money on the normal output version.

 

 

They will do custom nano sizes as well, just email them.

 

They are running behind on orders so it's taking about 2.5 weeks on custom fixtures.

 

$140 for the XB, $120 for the normal, but no fancy storms or controller.

[jedimasterben]

So Kat showed me this today: http://www.marinedepot.com/Ecoxotic_E_Series_Full_Spectrum_LED_Light_System_Pre_Order_Aquarium_LED_Light_Fixtures-Ecoxotic-XX09400-FILTFILDPO-vi.html

 

Interesting. The one for my tank would only be $133. It is controllable and full spec, though I wonder how powerful the lights actually are.

 

The idea of using this is kind of cool, though. http://www.ecoxotic.com/eco-pico-reef.html I want a nicer, cube style tank. I could get this for 130 and then just use my AC70. I think that would look really nice. Again, though, I wonder about the light. I've heard good things about the EcoPico 3-way LED. Some folks here have used them and had success.

 

Kat also suggested building my own array using 2 Panorama Pros, though I have no idea which ones I would use. I could use 2 of them and mount them inside a custom fixture.

She sent me that, too. Made me LOL. It's the same stuff that Ecoxotic has been selling that is at least consistent - unfortunately it is consistently shitty.

[tibbsy07]

Meh.

 

Why not go with BuildMyLED Linking to the 14K high output fixture as an example:

 

http://www.buildmyled.com/14000k-reef-spectrum-xb-series/

 

 

 

The only drawback is no control over the color, but you can build your own LED combination and, if you don't need the PAR, save money on the normal output version.

 

 

They will do custom nano sizes as well, just email them.

 

They are running behind on orders so it's taking about 2.5 weeks on custom fixtures.

 

$140 for the XB, $120 for the normal, but no fancy storms or controller.

I remember these. I'll look into them, for sure.

 

She sent me that, too. Made me LOL. It's the same stuff that Ecoxotic has been selling that is at least consistent - unfortunately it is consistently shitty.

Even their panorama pros are bad? The ecopico light doesn't look terrible, but likely a softy only kind of light?

[Reefkid88]

Have you thought about using just a big media bag with just activated carbon ? And possibly cancel out all the problems ? Or just quit using purigen fully and just use CPE and or carbon ? Carbon itself is a good exporter,might not get out all of your nutrients but water changes can get that done.

 

In MY experience,softies loved dirty water. Some if my Zoa's went from just a small frag 5-8 polyps to 20+ in almost a months time. Also my birdsnest went from a 1/2" 3 branch frag to about 3" 8 or so branch frag. I never once tested my water,did water changes only about every week and a half to 2 weeks lol. That tank was my first tank though,and was a complete noob but learned a lot.

 

Honestly,the ecoxotic lights are highly overpriced and not worth it,to me they aren't atleast. I'm sure Ben can chime in. Have you thought about building your own light ? That'd be more worth it personally.

[jedimasterben]

Ecoxotic still hasn't learned that LEDs need heatsinks.

[Reefkid88]

Ecoxotic still hasn't learned that LEDs need heatsinks.

I've always wondered that they use,just the PCB they are mounted on ?

[jedimasterben]

Yup, which is why their failure rate is very, very high.

[tibbsy07]

Have you thought about using just a big media bag with just activated carbon ? And possibly cancel out all the problems ? Or just quit using purigen fully and just use CPE and or carbon ? Carbon itself is a good exporter,might not get out all of your nutrients but water changes can get that done.

 

In MY experience,softies loved dirty water. Some if my Zoa's went from just a small frag 5-8 polyps to 20+ in almost a months time. Also my birdsnest went from a 1/2" 3 branch frag to about 3" 8 or so branch frag. I never once tested my water,did water changes only about every week and a half to 2 weeks lol. That tank was my first tank though,and was a complete noob but learned a lot.

 

Honestly,the ecoxotic lights are highly overpriced and not worth it,to me they aren't atleast. I'm sure Ben can chime in. Have you thought about building your own light ? That'd be more worth it personally.

I'm currently running carbon only. I pulled the purigen the next morning when the xenia closed. They still haven't opened back up. I was running CPE only for a while, but when it got used up (really it was just that it started leaking out of the bag) I swapped to purigen because I had it. I think the standard 100ml bag of purigen is too much for this small tank. I'm only using carbon or CPE on this one from now on - I'll probably stick with CPE.

 

Ecoxotic still hasn't learned that LEDs need heatsinks.

I wondered about that specifically... Never saw any heatsinks in/on their lights and wondered why.

[joy13]

Tibbsy mark your calender for June 7th the farm is having a swap/cookout. I am hoping work cooperates and I don't have to work that Saturday, might even put in for Friday so I do have that Saturday off.

[tibbsy07]

Tibbsy mark your calender for June 7th the farm is having a swap/cookout. I am hoping work cooperates and I don't have to work that Saturday, might even put in for Friday so I do have that Saturday off.

Cool! Thanks for the heads up. How do the swaps work? What if I have nothing to swap and just want to buy - can I do that, too?

[joy13]

Cool! Thanks for the heads up. How do the swaps work? What if I have nothing to swap and just want to buy - can I do that, too?

I just bring money. Usually if you have something like an lps that needs to be fragged you can bring that too.

[metrokat]

Whoa, this page seriously went over my head. Can we talk about Xenia or something.

[tibbsy07]

I just bring money. Usually if you have something like an lps that needs to be fragged you can bring that too.

Gotcha. I'll just bring some cash

 

Whoa, this page seriously went over my head. Can we talk about Xenia or something.

Sure, lol

[tibbsy07]

Got back in town from FL last night. Fun trip, but crazy travel yesterday. Blech.

 

Tank is insane. Xenia are making a comeback. Water was almost 84 degrees... No Bueno. I am going to have to get a chiller, I think. The room gets pretty warm. Any recommendations on a small chiller that won't destroy my wallet?

 

Tank is dirty as heck - losing those margarita snails has wreaked havoc. I am going to scrape the walls with some filter floss and do a water change tonight.

 

I have to buy new salt... I made the mistake of taking it out of the bag it came in and putting it in a bin with a lid that was supposed to be airtight. I put a slice of bread in there to lessen any moisture issues (as one does with brown sugar), but the bread didn't help. The salt is already clumpy and soaking up moisture in the air. I added 3/4 of a cup to get to the 1.025 salinity that I wanted instead of the 1/2 cup the box says... Dangit.

[jedimasterben]

Tank is insane. Xenia are making a comeback. Water was almost 84 degrees... No Bueno. I am going to have to get a chiller, I think. The room gets pretty warm. Any recommendations on a small chiller that won't destroy my wallet?

A fan.

I have to buy new salt... I made the mistake of taking it out of the bag it came in and putting it in a bin with a lid that was supposed to be airtight. I put a slice of bread in there to lessen any moisture issues (as one does with brown sugar), but the bread didn't help. The salt is already clumpy and soaking up moisture in the air. I added 3/4 of a cup to get to the 1.025 salinity that I wanted instead of the 1/2 cup the box says... Dangit.

Most salt mixes need 3 cups to mix five gallons to 35ppt. Using 2.5 cups per five gallons would only get to ~27ppt.

 

Keep silica gel in with it.