Unofficial nano-reef 12" cube contest

[erickrm]

ok let me do it like this if i can make a suggestion.....

 

i will leave the original design in place no adjustment, and if you guys really want to change the fuge to a media rack once the contest is over you can, by purchasing an additional baffle that you guys can install once the contest is complete.

 

Thanks.

[Doc Frye]

Want a complicated, but interesting way to figure out live stock value? We are going to have to figure this out sooner or later (especially with the agitation stirred up by the "rules.")

 

I suggest we offer a value on any livestock added to the tank, and if any other contestant feels that we have low-balled the figure outlandishly, they have the option to purchase the livestock for twice the value stated.

 

I have an amazing collection of zoas. I got 95% of them in one deal for less than $1 per polyp. None of these came with names or pedigrees. I am probably going to say that each individual polyp I add to my tank is valued at about $2.50. If someone thinks that is unfair, they can purchase the zoas from me for $5 a polyp. If I choose to use more of the same, then I will need to set their value at $5. If someone thinks that is still to low, they can buy them for $10 etc and it raises the value again.

 

This would help in cases such as someone putting a 3 inch AA maxima clam in their tank and saying it is worth $30. I would immediately chime in and say - I will buy that clam off you for $60! Etc. I know this is too complicated to actually work, but it would provide for a little group regulation. I think only contestants could get the chance to purchase low-balled items, and the first contestant that posts he/she wants a specific item for double the price gets it.

 

Food for thought. Seeing how this is going so far, I expect to see a few arguments about livestock prices.

[wljimbo]

To me the same tank was not a rule but the hole point to this contest.

 

Well said...

I also agree w/ Doc, we should all come up w/ something now before we start.

 

simple I started my thread, can you plz update my link! - thanks

[jaygalindo]

Want a complicated, but interesting way to figure out live stock value? We are going to have to figure this out sooner or later (especially with the agitation stirred up by the "rules.")

 

I suggest we offer a value on any livestock added to the tank, and if any other contestant feels that we have low-balled the figure outlandishly, they have the option to purchase the livestock for twice the value stated.

 

I have an amazing collection of zoas. I got 95% of them in one deal for less than $1 per polyp. None of these came with names or pedigrees. I am probably going to say that each individual polyp I add to my tank is valued at about $2.50. If someone thinks that is unfair, they can purchase the zoas from me for $5 a polyp. If I choose to use more of the same, then I will need to set their value at $5. If someone thinks that is still to low, they can buy them for $10 etc and it raises the value again.

 

This would help in cases such as someone putting a 3 inch AA maxima clam in their tank and saying it is worth $30. I would immediately chime in and say - I will buy that clam off you for $60! Etc. I know this is too complicated to actually work, but it would provide for a little group regulation. I think only contestants could get the chance to purchase low-balled items, and the first contestant that posts he/she wants a specific item for double the price gets it.

 

Food for thought. Seeing how this is going so far, I expect to see a few arguments about livestock prices.

 

lol, I actually love that idea, so what you are saying is for example, if you value your polyp at 2.50 and I think you are lowballing I can buy it for $5, but what if you don't want to sell it? It either get a value of $5 or it doesn't go in the tank?

[patrick1234]

lol, I actually love that idea, so what you are saying is for example, if you value your polyp at 2.50 and I think you are lowballing I can buy it for $5, but what if you don't want to sell it? It either get a value of $5 or it doesn't go in the tank?

The truble with this tho is just because it may be a low ball to you. My local reef site offers purple hornets at 50.00 each No way in hell id ship it to some other reefer.

[patrick1234]

What I think we need to do for the stuff that is going to go in the tank.

We can have a vote. Lets say some one calls you out on a low ball price we have a vote if ppl vote and say that it is a low ball price.

1. You are find the price of the coral we say off your live stock buget.

2. You do not get to use the coral any more.

[hayseed777]

I think the plans should stay with the original configuration. We all agreed to purchase and subsequently ordered the tanks as advertised (with fuges). Erickrm is being nice and is willing to accommodate those who want the media rack, but I wouldn't feel right asking someone to modify a custom item after I've paid for it. The man is going to be busting his ass getting these things built, tested and shipped. I don't think he needs the further aggravation of trying to keep track of who wants a media setup vs a fuge.

 

Regarding the livestock limit, it all comes out in the wash. I've never purchased a coral, but I know roughly what different types of corals sell for. If, in my inexperience, I can look at a coral and nail the asking price or "fair market value", I'm sure the vast majority of the voters will be able to also. Have faith in our fellow reefers, I believe those who stay within the spirit of this contest and don't "fudge" the livestock numbers will be awarded more votes than those who skirt the rules.

 

Stop the whining, stop bickering, stop bashing Simple. Let's be adults and work around any perceived issues with the tanks on a personal level. You can add a baffle yourself once you receive your tank, that's a big reason I don't understand all the whining. Rant Off

[harthag12]

I honestly don't know if a livestock limit is really needed. It could easily lead to disputes & really if someone can fill the tank w/ SPS to the brink, have a beautiful tank and sustain it, they're better than me. I know my limitations, the only problem w/ this is the person who waits till day the last week of the conest and just fills it w/ stuff. The baffle discussion I could care less, I don't think it will make a big differance but it does make it more complicated for Erickm. Also everyone got into the contest knowing they'd have the same tank design but whatever. The 100$ light originally listed was a neat idea, really made you think & figure out how to DiY. Oh well, it will be fun, just all the options / changes are rough for people who maybe in this and aren't on here reading this thread on a daily basis. They take a week off from the site & reading this and everything they have planned could be changed / screwed. I read this site every few hours but I'm sure I'm not in the majority.

[Doc Frye]

lol, I actually love that idea, so what you are saying is for example, if you value your polyp at 2.50 and I think you are lowballing I can buy it for $5, but what if you don't want to sell it? It either get a value of $5 or it doesn't go in the tank?

I figured you would be forced to sell it. That would stop all the low-balling from the get go. If I say I have this nice clam I value at $10, the first person in the contest to call bull-shiiiiiit can purchase it for $20. I can't just say, "okay, okay, you caught me..... I'll value it at $20." No - you lost that coral. People are not going to want to give up too many nice pieces that way.

 

I think the plans should stay with the original configuration. We all agreed to purchase and subsequently ordered the tanks as advertised (with fuges). Erickrm is being nice and is willing to accommodate those who want the media rack, but I wouldn't feel right asking someone to modify a custom item after I've paid for it. The man is going to be busting his ass getting these things built, tested and shipped. I don't think he needs the further aggravation of trying to keep track of who wants a media setup vs a fuge.

 

Eric said it makes no difference to him whether he glues the baffle high or low, so I don't think you are saving him any aggravation by continuing the argument.

 

As far as I can see - baffles up or down are contestant's choice. No pain to Eric. No extra work, material, or testing required.

 

If it is really that big of a sticking point to some of you, I say 2 contests!!!! One for us "Up Bafflers," and one for you "Fugers."

[bob21115]

What is the point of the $250 Limit? We had a limit on Hardware at first then it was remove.

 

What if we removed the live stock limit, but say that you can't add any live stock after the first month?

 

If it dies you can't replace it. That way people can't add live stock at the last minute.

 

We can ask people to vote on the best looking tank based on before and after pictures. Look at what it started at and what the final result is. Not who can buy the most expensive coral's.

 

Something else is, some people will have to cycle their tanks. Thats why I suggested a month. I plan on taking LR, LS and water from my other systems. I'm also running my skimmer in my other system to break it in. I hope I'll go there a small quick cycle.

 

Just a suggestion.

[CallMeDrLove]

I figured you would be forced to sell it. That would stop all the low-balling from the get go. If I say I have this nice clam I value at $10, the first person in the contest to call bull-shiiiiiit can purchase it for $20. I can't just say, "okay, okay, you caught me..... I'll value it at $20." No - you lost that coral. People are not going to want to give up too many nice pieces that way.

 

 

 

Eric said it makes no difference to him whether he glues the baffle high or low, so I don't think you are saving him any aggravation by continuing the argument.

 

As far as I can see - baffles up or down are contestant's choice. No pain to Eric. No extra work, material, or testing required.

 

If it is really that big of a sticking point to some of you, I say 2 contests!!!! One for us "Up Bafflers," and one for you "Fugers."

 

I think the problem with that is you are under no contractual obligation to sell the coral. A contract requires an offer, consideration, and acceptance. The consideration means there has to be something substantive to the deal. For example, if I say "Would you like $10." that is an offer. Then you say "Yes." that is an acceptance. But there is no "trade" so to speak, or "consideration", and thus there is no contract. In this instance, there is no offer. Simply listing the value of the coral is not enough to constitute an offer, and thus cannot lock you into a contract for sale. And even if it were, it would be treated like a classified ad, first come first serve. Then if you didn't want to sell the coral, just say "sorry, someone else already got it." Neat idea Doc but it just doesn't work.

 

To create a new point, what about people moving LR from one tank to a new one? Aren't they going to get a huge (multi-week) head start on cycling due to the lack of die off? Couldn't someone theoretically just move all the rock and livestock from a nano they already have and have an awesome tank immediately?

[scooternerd]

What is the point of the $250 Limit? We had a limit on Hardware at first then it was remove.

 

What if we removed the live stock limit, but say that you can't add any live stock after the first month?

 

If it dies you can't replace it. That way people can't add live stock at the last minute.

 

We can ask people to vote on the best looking tank based on before and after pictures. Look at what it started at and what the final result is. Not who can buy the most expensive coral's.

 

 

this coming from the man that has spent over 500.00 already

[CallMeDrLove]

What is the point of the $250 Limit? We had a limit on Hardware at first then it was remove.

 

What if we removed the live stock limit, but say that you can't add any live stock after the first month?

 

If it dies you can't replace it. That way people can't add live stock at the last minute.

 

We can ask people to vote on the best looking tank based on before and after pictures. Look at what it started at and what the final result is. Not who can buy the most expensive coral's.

 

Something else is, some people will have to cycle their tanks. Thats why I suggested a month. I plan on taking LR, LS and water from my other systems. I'm also running my skimmer in my other system to break it in. I hope I'll go there a small quick cycle.

 

Just a suggestion.

 

What about people who can't afford $500 in the first month? Perhaps they need to add livestock gradually. Plus it would be difficult to quarantine all the livestock for your entire tank all at once.

[jaygalindo]

Well of course you would love to remove the $250 livestock spending limit considering you have almost spent that already. But that is not the issuse. The issue is that removing this limit brings in a whole new level of coral which most of us have never seen before like this example, Reunited Watermelon Chalice

This is $1500 and is amazing and would look great in any of our tanks but I can afford and can't compete against this. So if we remove this $250 rule i am out for sure. Because as we all know in this hobby you get what you pay for and I don't want to be in a contest if you can just buy 1st place.

Also I think we shouldn't even talk about changing rules and the tank until we actually get them, I know this is crazy but we really don't know what the thing will look like aside from a sketch.

 

I think the problem with that is you are under no contractual obligation to sell the coral. A contract requires an offer, consideration, and acceptance. The consideration means there has to be something substantive to the deal. For example, if I say "Would you like $10." that is an offer. Then you say "Yes." that is an acceptance. But there is no "trade" so to speak, or "consideration", and thus there is no contract. In this instance, there is no offer. Simply listing the value of the coral is not enough to constitute an offer, and thus cannot lock you into a contract for sale. And even if it were, it would be treated like a classified ad, first come first serve. Then if you didn't want to sell the coral, just say "sorry, someone else already got it." Neat idea Doc but it just doesn't work.

 

To create a new point, what about people moving LR from one tank to a new one? Aren't they going to get a huge (multi-week) head start on cycling due to the lack of die off? Couldn't someone theoretically just move all the rock and livestock from a nano they already have and have an awesome tank immediately?

 

 

This is true but I think you are careful enough when purchasing LR at the LFS there would be very minimal die off as well. Obviously you would need the aid of the LFS to make this happen but I am sure they would understand.

 

What about people who can't afford $500 in the first month? Perhaps they need to add livestock gradually. Plus it would be difficult to quarantine all the livestock for your entire tank all at once.

 

Are you in the contest DrLove still?

[bob21115]

this coming from the man that has spent over 500.00 already

 

I've gone over this once before.

 

 

Quality cost money.

 

Should I spend $100 for a crappy look DIY LED light or $200 to get well designed and tested light?

 

Should I spend $3000 on AC for my house, then $2000 for the upgraded electrical so I don't need a chiller.

 

Should I replace all the Oak in my house so I can save money and use pine? Or should I throw the tank on a half broken TV tray and call it good?

 

I'm doing what's right for me. If you can do it cheaper good for you.

 

 

This is my first contest tank. Is this how they all work?

[CallMeDrLove]

Are you in the contest DrLove still?

 

Unfortunately no. I will, however, be keeping up with everything and documenting my nano.

[Kraylen]

Put me down, link in sig its a 12" cube

[jaygalindo]

wow people are dropping like flies, we have to get a grip on this contest or it will be a bust.

[CallMeDrLove]

This is true but I think you are careful enough when purchasing LR at the LFS there would be very minimal die off as well. Obviously you would need the aid of the LFS to make this happen but I am sure they would understand.

 

I have to buy LR online...my LFS sells what looks to be base rock for $12.99 a pound. It's tough to get good LR in Tennessee.

 

Oh...and everybody lay off of bob haha. Give him a break. Hate the game, not tha playa.

[Kraylen]

all i am saying is when i signed up there was a limit on livestock AND equipment. most of the contestants cant afford 500+ on a pico tank. this is just bs BECAUSE YOUY ARE BASICLY BUYING FIRST PLACE. enjoy your "prize" i am out of the contest as i have nothing to gain and have enough stuff going ion already.

 

i wish you all luck with second place

 

Sounds like a ##### move, money isnt everything.. I know cats with 10k tied up in their tanks and their tanks are hella wack.

[CallMeDrLove]

all i am saying is when i signed up there was a limit on livestock AND equipment. most of the contestants cant afford 500+ on a pico tank. this is just bs BECAUSE YOUY ARE BASICLY BUYING FIRST PLACE. enjoy your "prize" i am out of the contest as i have nothing to gain and have enough stuff going ion already.

 

i wish you all luck with second place

 

This may be because I'm a n00b...but I don't think you need an unlimited budget for livestock. I really think most of the cheaper stuff looks just as good as the expensive stuff. There's no way I'd pay $1150 for that 3" coral even if I had tons of money. I can buy a different coral that looks just as good or better for $50 or less. You guys ever think maybe how you arrange things will make more of an impact than what you toss in your tank?

[simplenough]

I already said it once, but ill say it again; the rules arent' going to change anymore; the rules on the first page are the final rules unless a major issue comes up (of which there isnt any at the time). You have the choice to raise or lower your baffle, so the baffle discussion is over. The livestock limit stays, because thats the fairest thing to do. I took out the limit on equipment, that should be enough to gain an edge if you want to spend a ton of money. Just because people say it on here doesn't mean its an automatic new rule. If you want to see the rules look on page 1. Other than that what people say on here isn't an official rule, just a suggestion.

[wljimbo]

I think we are forgetting the idea behind the contest and why we do this hobby! How about we just stick to the original rules and the $250.00 spending limit. If anyone wants a change anything we shouldnt argue just simply put it up for a vote. There is no need to fight, we are all here to show off our skills and make the best tank that we can. I have put a lot of time and money into this already as i am sure everyone has as well, I would hate to see this end.

 

I do have an idea that I might like to add, it might work for the livestock: There are a few people that have been following all of our threads, one who has even won a past contest, why dont we ask them to be a mediator if there are any disputes on livestock. They can give a fair price and if you are not happy you can simply remove the piece from the tank.

 

Hopefully we can all work this out and come to a middle ground.

 

 

 

I already said it once, but ill say it again; the rules arent' going to change anymore; the rules on the first page are the final rules unless a major issue comes up (of which there isnt any at the time). You have the choice to raise or lower your baffle, so the baffle discussion is over. The livestock limit stays, because thats the fairest thing to do. I took out the limit on equipment, that should be enough to gain an edge if you want to spend a ton of money. Just because people say it on here doesn't mean its an automatic new rule. If you want to see the rules look on page 1. Other than that what people say on here isn't an official rule, just a suggestion.

 

 

I think the problem is that you did change the original rules without the majority. Even though I dont think it's a big deal, I think we should have voted to change the baffles. I do agree with you on the rest of the post.

[patrick1234]

I think the problem is that you did change the original rules without the majority. Even though I dont think it's a big deal, I think we should have voted to change the baffles. I do agree with you on the rest of the post.

+1

 

As far as I know we never voted on any of it.

[jaygalindo]

I think we are forgetting the idea behind the contest and why we do this hobby! How about we just stick to the original rules and the $250.00 spending limit. If anyone wants a change anything we shouldnt argue just simply put it up for a vote. There is no need to fight, we are all here to show off our skills and make the best tank that we can. I have put a lot of time and money into this already as i am sure everyone has as well, I would hate to see this end.

 

I do have an idea that I might like to add, it might work for the livestock: There are a few people that have been following all of our threads, one who has even won a past contest, why dont we ask them to be a mediator if there are any disputes on livestock. They can give a fair price and if you are not happy you can simply remove the piece from the tank.

 

Hopefully we can all work this out and come to a middle ground.

 

+1

I agree with this, we have to have some type of authority, with simplenough competing in the contest he cannot be it.

 

 

 

 

I think the problem is that you did change the original rules without the majority. Even though I dont think it's a big deal, I think we should have voted to change the baffles. I do agree with you on the rest of the post.