17g Green Leaf Rimless

[Withers]

I'm glad everything made it ok It was definitely great meeting you.

 

Those nightmares are easily my favorite paly ever

[divecj5]

Looks good Adam. I really like that cardinal. Looks like you got bit by the zoa bug.

 

Definitely bit by the zoo bug. Just finally glad to have a tank where theyll survive and hopefully thrive.

 

Love all the new frags. Those Nightmares are sweet.

 

Thanks AM.

 

I'm glad everything made it ok It was definitely great meeting you.

 

Those nightmares are easily my favorite paly ever

 

Thanks again man. Really appreciate it!!

[Deleted User 6]

is Vic as goofy looking as I imagined?

[Withers]

I definitely am.

[TheNordCelt]

Nice additions, and that Cardinal is really stunning.

[divecj5]

is Vic as goofy looking as I imagined?

 

Haha....not at all.

 

Nice additions, and that Cardinal is really stunning.

 

Thanks Patrick.

[divecj5]

I'm slowly starting to come to the realization that I may have to bite the bullet and replace my sand bed. Although the diatoms are about 1/4 as bad as they were just a few weeks ago, they are still present by the time the lights go out. I just want some WHITE sand!!!

 

Here's my masterful deductive reasoning. Knowing that diatoms feed off available nutrients (mainly PO4) and silica, I've been trying to pinpoint the source.

 

First I started with adjusting the flow in the tank. Previously, the MP10 was about 2-3" from the surface of the water. Although this facilitated excellent surface agitation, the lower reaches and far corners of the tank were starting to get built up crud. I've since lowered it to about 1/2 way up the glass and it's currently cranking on Reef mode at about 75-80% max. Along with the MP10, the MCE300 skimmer output drains into the tank as well as the Eheim canister output. Flow shouldn't be the issue.

 

Next up are nutrients and silicates. Although there was a period of weeks to months where I was using RO/DI that had at least 8-10 TDS, I'm now using a 5-stage MAXSPECT unit that has dual DI stages (one Silica Buster and one normal DI resin). Input water is 89 TDS, and 0 TDS after both the RO membrane and DI resins. I shouldn't be adding anything but clean top off and water change water.

 

I feed every 2-3 days using either Roggers Food (which is made without phosphate binders) or flake. I feed small amounts at a time and make sure most if not all is consumed before adding more.

 

I'm using a skimmer, the Deltec MCE300, that is rated for heavily stocked 50g tanks. I skim wet and get some nice skimmate every few days. Everything is cleaned and maintained on a regular basis.

 

I've also been using a turkey baster to blow off the rocks and corner sand areas to keep everything up in the water column to be removed by the skimmer or during water changes. Also note that I'm not currently running any media in the canister so there shouldn't be any build up there.

 

I also have about 75 dwarf ceriths, 8-10 nassarius, 10-12 full size ceriths, and 4 blue/red legged hermits so things should be cleaned up by them.

 

Is there anything that I could be missing? I'm thinking that a ton of "goodies" were added when I was unknowingly using dirty RO/DI. This was then soaked up by the sand and rock. My thought is that the sand is slowly leaching stored PO4 and NO4 back into the water.

 

I have a NO4 and PO4 test but I'm not 100% sure of the accuracy of either.

 

Thanks for any thoughts or suggestions. I'm slowly whittling down the list of possibilities....

[spanko]

What kind of sand is it? I think that this could be a contributor "Although there was a period of weeks to months where I was using RO/DI that had at least 8-10 TDS". If it is, and "Although the diatoms are about 1/4 as bad as they were just a few weeks ago" I would suggest that the water changing and filtering is attacking the problem and you may have to have

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

wait for it.........................

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

patience to get it fully solved.

[divecj5]

Thanks for being the voice of reason Henry

 

I'm almost positive that I went with a bag of Arag-Alive sugar-fine Fiji Pink sand. Since there is more surface area given the smaller particles, I figure it could have really soaked it up and may take a while to get released by the Nassarius and other sand "stirrers."

[spanko]

Agree. I would give it more time, monitor it, and if it continues to reduce in amount I would not go the change out the substrate route. Remember there is now a lot of little critters in there that would be hard - take time to replace in a new sand bed. Plus new sand bed could = new diatom bloom, new cyano bloom and all manner of assorted nastiness.

Oh yeah and if you don't have on, a Florida Fighting Conch is a great diatom muncher as well as a keeper of the top layer of sand in general.

 

Just sayin.

[Deleted User 6]

yeah, i'd give it time. your tank is still new at this point. hasn't had near enough time for the bac populations to mature. making major changes will probably just throw things out of whack again.

[Monochrome5]

Run some sort of dedicated phosphate remover. The chaeto I gave you will help once it starts growing. It gobbles up phosphate faster than diatoms. Chemi-Pure Elite has a phosphate remover and does wonders for water quality.

 

Biologically speaking, a conch would be great in your tank. Lots of movement at it will eat some diatoms, too. It may beat up the nass snails, but you have enough sandbed hat it shouldn't matter. You could also try a sand sifting seastar. They don't eat diatoms (that I know of) but they stir the sand so insanely well you won't have to worry about it. A diamond goby is another option, though they tend to only take care of the sand in one spot.

 

Run the chaeto, keep up with your manual cleaning, and be patient. It will be gone before you know it.

 

Best advice I've ever been given: "In this hobby, nothing good happens quickly"

 

PS: The silica they need comes from your sand. It's naturally part of sand. No way around it (other than barebottom). The phosphates are from organic material - food, pods, other algaes, waste, etc etc. Again, no real way around it.

[divecj5]

First off, you guys ROCK!!! Although I've been doing this for what seems like a long time, there are some things that crop up that you really just need a group of people to say "slow down...stop what you're thinking...and give it time." I've learned a good deal of patience in this hobby but as I'm sure my wife will attest, I have a ways to go

 

Oh yeah and if you don't have on, a Florida Fighting Conch is a great diatom muncher as well as a keeper of the top layer of sand in general.

 

Hopefully one of the LFS around here can special order a Florida Fighting Conch. Seems like a great option for keeping things nice and stirred up and nice and tidy.

 

yeah, i'd give it time. your tank is still new at this point. hasn't had near enough time for the bac populations to mature. making major changes will probably just throw things out of whack again.

 

Thanks D!! I agree that tossing yet another change will only further disturb things.

 

Run some sort of dedicated phosphate remover. The chaeto I gave you will help once it starts growing. It gobbles up phosphate faster than diatoms. Chemi-Pure Elite has a phosphate remover and does wonders for water quality.

 

Run the chaeto, keep up with your manual cleaning, and be patient. It will be gone before you know it.

 

My plan is to start running PhosBan and possibly a bag of Chemi-Pure in the Two Little Fishies reactor that I have collecting dust upstairs. I may just daisy-chain it off the output of the canister and call it a day.

 

I agree that the Chaeto will certainly help. Although I've been about as religious about manual cleaning and water changes, I think the new rock that I got it last week and chaeto will further help.

 

Best advice I've ever been given: "In this hobby, nothing good happens quickly"

 

I completely agree....I read that on Reef Central (gasp) when I first started although it was a slight variation..."only bad things happen fast in this hobby."

[spanko]

I disagree with a sand "sifting" sea star, especially in a tank this size. They will decimate the beneficial fauna in the sand, tis what they eat, and cause more problems.

[divecj5]

I agree that it seems like a more viable option for a lot larger tank. I think a juvi Florida Conch would be a lot better at keeping things tidy and not completely lay waste to all of the beneficial micro fauna.

[spanko]

Yup, the Nassarius and Ceriths for subterranian clean up and the Conch for surface mopping up. Great combo is you ask me. Just make sure the one you get is a Florida Fighting Conch, it will never leave the sandbed although sometimes it will bury itself and you will wonder where the heck it went. Some stores out the are selling conchs but the are not the Florida fighting conchs. If you see them on rockwork or climbing the glass they are not what you want.

Strombus alatus are what you want.

[DaveFason]

I would give it some time. Your sand bed is new and for bad things to happen it has to be old a deep for it to "leech" stuff out.

 

Could it possibly to much of a cleanup crew? That is a TON of inverts in a small tank. In my 35g I have MAYBE 10 snails left over and a couple hermits.

 

Give the tank some time, crank the flow and let it do its thing.

 

-Dave

[spanko]

What are you thinking here Dave, that the CUC is stirring up the sand so much that the buried particles that still have some pent up silicates are being driven to the surface fueling the diatoms?

[divecj5]

Strombus alatus are what you want.

 

Thanks for the heads up Henry. I have a pretty good relationship with the owner of one of the LFS but that's not to say that he really really knows what he's ordering I'd rather not get another conch that's going to wipe out the rest of my crew.

 

Could it possibly to much of a cleanup crew? That is a TON of inverts in a small tank. In my 35g I have MAYBE 10 snails left over and a couple hermits.

 

I was kind of wondering the same thing Dave...although not that it was too many but that adding them all at once might have cause them to literally kick up a sh*t storm in the process of them all burrowing and crawling around. I'm sure their numbers will slowly drop as the hermits give some of them the boot, some will just crawl out of the tank, etc.

 

My plan is to mount the frags that I got and let the tank "do it's thing" for a bit. Hopefully things will settle out before too long.

 

What are you thinking here Dave, that the CUC is stirring up the sand so much that the buried particles that still have some pent up silicates are being driven to the surface fueling the diatoms?

 

See my comment above but that's what I was wondering. Things might have been pent up in the sand bed since I had so few sand-stirrers that when I added a bunch all at once, it kicked things up as if I stirred the bed myself.

[spanko]

Yup a distinct possibility.

[Deleted User 6]

i like stirring my sandbed every couple weeks. since it's not a DSB, i'd rather get those trapped nutrients out.

[divecj5]

I've always wondered. Are you talking about stirring just the top layer or do you use say a chopstick and go all the way to the bottom? I think I'm going to keep my hands out and not mess with anything else right now but generally wondering.

[Deleted User 6]

I've always had less than 2" of sand, so I usually just go in there with the turkey baster or a paint stirrer or something and stir the whole thing. Released all kinds of dust and crap that gets caught in the mech filtration to be removed. I wouldn't recommend doing this if you haven't been doing it all along though. My goal is to not allow noxious areas to form en masse to begin with.

[DaveFason]

Stirring up the sand bed wont do it. You would have to have an old sand bed. I vac mine every H20 change and nothing happens. What I think is you have a HUGE bio-load with 100+ cleanup crew. Call me crazy!

 

-Dave

[Deleted User 6]

yeah, that's true. ^

 

there is such a thing as too many snails. they poop and pee too.