ich in a copper bath treatment?

[CoralStorm]

i have a tomato clown once again looking like its getting some sort of spot on it again bit funny thing is is that IT IS IN A DAMN COPPER BATH TANK which i do not understand why and how its happening nd to be honest theres nothibg i can really do but hope for the best its already ina qt tank from a while ago so why would ich happen in copper? or is it something else? maybe a copper resistant strain of ich i hope neither but im not sure maybe its something that was always been there

[mitten_reef]

What exactly is a copper bath tank? 

[CoralStorm]

2 minutes ago, micoastreefing said:

What exactly is a copper bath tank? 

almost 2 months in a qt tank with copper in it

[RustyRocket]

So when you started the argument and ripped into an experienced reefer in the other guys thread saying they are wrong and you know best...do you still stand by that statement? Not a jab, just saying there is value in what others are saying. 

Anyway lets try address the problem, can you provide some details to the questions below:

Are you sure the ailment is Ich?

Do you know the concentration of copper in the quarantine tank?

Any sand/live rock in the tank, they can absorb the copper so concentration drops. 

Have you tested and kept it at the correct level? 

What form of copper are you using? 

If the fish is in good condition still, you could try another method, like the tank transfer method.
Remember Copper at higher concentration is an appetite suppressant, be sure to make sure eating. Good luck!!

 

[mitten_reef]

3 hours ago, CoralStorm said:

almost 2 months in a qt tank with copper in it

Thanks for the clarification. As far as proper QT procedure, I’m of no help. 

 

Good luck, I think the post above has some good pointers for ya. 

[Humblefish]

Are you sure the clownfish has ich? It would be unusual to see ich trophonts on a clownfish due to their thick mucous coat. Brook is more likely, and copper will suppress (but not completely eliminate) that parasite: https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/402151-brooklynella-fish-disease-information/

[CoralStorm]

4 hours ago, RustyRocket said:

So when you started the argument and ripped into an experienced reefer in the other guys thread saying they are wrong and you know best...do you still stand by that statement? Not a jab, just saying there is value in what others are saying. 

Anyway lets try address the problem, can you provide some details to the questions below:

Are you sure the ailment is Ich?

Do you know the concentration of copper in the quarantine tank?

Any sand/live rock in the tank, they can absorb the copper so concentration drops. 

Have you tested and kept it at the correct level? 

What form of copper are you using? 

If the fish is in good condition still, you could try another method, like the tank transfer method.
Remember Copper at higher concentration is an appetite suppressant, be sure to make sure eating. Good luck!!

 

using cupramin copper treatment weird thing is is after i put treatment for past ich it went away but this just leaves a whole new door of whats in this problem its bare bottom basically your average qt

 

 

 

 just to note thatthat i am jot in a good money position right now and i KNOW for a fact that i do not know everything and nobody does i am allowed to have an opinion on why I dont want to use such and such method for one reason or another so please before mentioning that i am ignoring you guys again remember that im a differwnt person with differnt opinions on whats better you have that same thing i understand your trying to help but i prefer finding other more ways i feel more comfortable using and not only that id that after the holidays now my rerf budget got a kick in the gut right now i cant just go get something really expensive most things i got recently were gifts or money given as a gift sorry for the rant but i just hate the constant accusations that i dont listen and i think its being exagerated a little i got things sometimes when recomended like the rodi unit suggested in other posts or the water changes i do

[CoralStorm]

41 minutes ago, Humblefish said:

Are you sure the clownfish has ich? It would be unusual to see ich trophonts on a clownfish due to their thick mucous coat. Brook is more likely, and copper will suppress (but not completely eliminate) that parasite: https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/402151-brooklynella-fish-disease-information/

that what makes me wonder is that i have 2 other tankmates and they do not show any form of ick or spots at all

[JavaJacketOC]

5 minutes ago, CoralStorm said:

that what makes me wonder is that i have 2 other tankmates and they do not show any form of ick or spots at all

 

Try and get some pictures, might help confirm what you are dealing with so that you can treat effectively.

[Tamberav]

We need you to answer Rustyrockets questions which are valid so we can know why your fish continues to be sick. Honestly it really sucks when people ask for help then skip over posts. 

 

My guess is the copper level is too low... many LFS do this to 'suppress' disease but not cure it... otherwise its a different parasite but we can't help you without answers and photos.

 

 

 

 

[CoralStorm]

1 hour ago, Tamberav said:

We need you to answer Rustyrockets questions which are valid so we can know why your fish continues to be sick. Honestly it really sucks when people ask for help then skip over posts. 

 

My guess is the copper level is too low... many LFS do this to 'suppress' disease but not cure it... otherwise its a different parasite but we can't help you without answers and photos.

 

 

 

 

copper level is not too low if it cured ich already unless the copper just disapeared the fiah itself is acting nornal and no i am not sure its ich that the issue i dont know i bave tested it a few days ago it was fine i presfer not have that much copper in the water because of one of my copper sensitive fish speicies so its not eaisy to just add more copper some queations have already been answered in my ladt replies my copper is buffered activated copper

[Humblefish]

What is buffered activated copper? Which brand are you using and what is the ppm level?? Is it Cupramine? If so, therapeutic level should be ~0.50ppm using either a Seachem or Salifert copper test kit.

[Tamberav]

15 minutes ago, CoralStorm said:

copper level is not too low if it cured ich already unless the copper just disapeared the fiah itself is acting nornal and no i am not sure its ich that the issue i dont know i bave tested it a few days ago it was fine i presfer not have that much copper in the water because of one of my copper sensitive fish speicies so its not eaisy to just add more copper some queations have already been answered in my ladt replies my copper is buffered activated copper

 

If it is ich.... the spots are supposed to disappear, that is part of the life cycle. That doesn't mean its gone or cured. 

 

Humblefish posted a great article on copper but basically:

 

"A therapeutic level must be maintained at all times during the 30 days, so testing often is important. If the level drops even slightly out of range, then the 30 day clock restarts."

 

If you have fish you don't want to use copper on, then you should use an alternate method to cure. I personally like tank transfer method but it requires 2-3 sets of everything, even heaters, ect. It ONLY works on ich. 

 

 

 

 

[CoralStorm]

10 hours ago, Tamberav said:

 

If it is ich.... the spots are supposed to disappear, that is part of the life cycle. That doesn't mean its gone or cured. 

 

Humblefish posted a great article on copper but basically:

 

"A therapeutic level must be maintained at all times during the 30 days, so testing often is important. If the level drops even slightly out of range, then the 30 day clock restarts."

 

If you have fish you don't want to use copper on, then you should use an alternate method to cure. I personally like tank transfer method but it requires 2-3 sets of everything, even heaters, ect. It ONLY works on ich. 

 

 

 

 

if it is ich thwn why is all the other fish to contracting it?

[JavaJacketOC]

6 minutes ago, CoralStorm said:

if it is ich thwn why is all the other fish to contracting it?

Not sure I understand this question. If you're asking why the other fish are NOT getting it...not all fish will. I have a wrasse that showed signs of ich for a couple weeks but no other fish did. It has to do with how healthy they are, stress levels, etc.

[Humblefish]

8 minutes ago, JavaJacketOC said:

Not sure I understand this question. If you're asking why the other fish are NOT getting it...not all fish will. I have a wrasse that showed signs of ich for a couple weeks but no other fish did. It has to do with how healthy they are, stress levels, etc.

+1 Fish with a thin slime coat (e.g. Tangs, Angels, Butterflyfish) are more likely to show symptoms than those with a thick mucous layer protecting their skin (e.g. mandarins, clownfish, wrasses). However, oftentimes free swimmers are able to successfully penetrate the gills (out of sight) because the mucous coat there is reduced in composition.

[CoralStorm]

17 minutes ago, JavaJacketOC said:

Not sure I understand this question. If you're asking why the other fish are NOT getting it...not all fish will. I have a wrasse that showed signs of ich for a couple weeks but no other fish did. It has to do with how healthy they are, stress levels, etc.

it even depends if it is jch once again heres a photo im not sure how well it shows up but heres a photo never the less

[CoralStorm]

6 minutes ago, Humblefish said:

+1 Fish with a thin slime coat (e.g. Tangs, Angels, Butterflyfish) are more likely to show symptoms than those with a thick mucous layer protecting their skin (e.g. mandarins, clownfish, wrasses). However, oftentimes free swimmers are able to successfully penetrate the gills (out of sight) because the mucous coat there is reduced in composition.

my angel is not showing symptoms though either, the bubbles in the above is water coming down from a filter

[JavaJacketOC]

20 minutes ago, CoralStorm said:

my angel is not showing symptoms though either, the bubbles in the above is water coming down from a filter

 

Can't see anything useful in that picture. Maybe look for a picture on the internet of what you're seeing and post it. Might help get to the root cause and treatment options.

[CoralStorm]

okay sorry phone cameras are quite crappy

[CoralStorm]

i cou

41 minutes ago, JavaJacketOC said:

 

Can't see anything useful in that picture. Maybe look for a picture on the internet of what you're seeing and post it. Might help get to the root cause and treatment options.

i could not find anything related to it but heres a detailed desctiption they are whitish  grey spots that appear mostly on the fins but are visible on the body too mostly on the fin and sides

yeah its not a good ''detailed'' description but thew best i can give

[JavaJacketOC]

Here is a resource to help you narrow it down. Maybe google some of the potential diseases from the list based on what you are seeing, it may help you find a picture of something  something similar. I'm wondering if they're flukes or something like that. 

 

Are the spots kind of transparent?

 

https://www.thesprucepets.com/saltwater-aquarium-fish-disease-diagnostic-tool-2924572

[CoralStorm]

38 minutes ago, JavaJacketOC said:

Here is a resource to help you narrow it down. Maybe google some of the potential diseases from the list based on what you are seeing, it may help you find a picture of something  something similar. I'm wondering if they're flukes or something like that. 

 

Are the spots kind of transparent?

 

https://www.thesprucepets.com/saltwater-aquarium-fish-disease-diagnostic-tool-2924572

yes they are they are translucent meaning that they are semi transparent

[CoralStorm]

nkw i jave a choice to make it may be risky but it could be a win or lose situation my angel is looking healthy eating loads of food and overall looking good now heres the reason why i want to move it to the dt right away the tank looks ich free as all my things a looking in shape again and if my angel is not sick this move can potentially save its life i plan to leave the cleaner wrasse as a type of "doctor" to the clown and personally this move could be a money saving and life saving move and if it catches it i would immediately put it back to qt i would just like to know if i should do this personally i think i should and i know i will get some keep it in qts for sure i just want to know if i should

[WV Reefer]

1 hour ago, CoralStorm said:

nkw i jave a choice to make it may be risky but it could be a win or lose situation my angel is looking healthy eating loads of food and overall looking good now heres the reason why i want to move it to the dt right away the tank looks ich free as all my things a looking in shape again and if my angel is not sick this move can potentially save its life i plan to leave the cleaner wrasse as a type of "doctor" to the clown and personally this move could be a money saving and life saving move and if it catches it i would immediately put it back to qt i would just like to know if i should do this personally i think i should and i know i will get some keep it in qts for sure i just want to know if i should

You cannot keep moving the sick/qt fish in and out of the display........ otherwise what’s the point of the qt tank?  

 

You have been given great advice in each of your threads...... take it. Quit fighting it and know that people are trying to help you.