THE OFFICIAL ASK ALBERT THIEL THREAD

[Paul.b]

 

 

And here is another nice one for you (but rare) The Lemon Goby from the Caribbean

 

I don't have one of those, but if I see one, I will. I don't know how many gobies I have but they are the predominant fish in my tank even though most of them hide so much. Many times I can look at my tank and see no fish even though there are about 25 fish in there. I don't keep a tank so I can see the fish, if I wanted to see the fish I would have filled the tank with boring tangs. I keep a tank for the odd, the unusual, the rare, or difficult to keep. And if I never see the fish except at night by using a critter light that is fine as they text me when they need something.

One big thrill for me is seing a batch of eggs and some fish guarding them. Or waking up to a school of baby somethings swimming about even though I don't have time to raise them.

[albertthiel]

 

 

And here is another nice one for you (but rare) The Lemon Goby from the Caribbean

 

I don't have one of those, but if I see one, I will. I don't know how many gobies I have but they are the predominant fish in my tank even though most of them hide so much. Many times I can look at my tank and see no fish even though there are about 25 fish in there. I don't keep a tank so I can see the fish, if I wanted to see the fish I would have filled the tank with boring tangs. I keep a tank for the odd, the unusual, the rare, or difficult to keep. And if I never see the fish except at night by using a critter light that is fine as they text me when they need something.

 

One big thrill for me is seing a batch of eggs and some fish guarding them. Or waking up to a school of baby somethings swimming about even though I don't have time to raise them.

 

Well that one is going to be hard to get as far as I know, it is listed as 'rare" ...

 

And I agree one derives far more satisfaction from keeping the odd and more difficult than the common and real easy ones ...

 

I'd like to add a few of those more challenging ones to my tank but with what I have in the 20 I am at what I feel is the max I can safely add so the system set-up can deal with the Bioload so unless I get a large tank doing so will have to wait ... but one of these days that is more than likely what is going to happen ... maybe go up to a 40B with a sump ...

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

Anthias Impostors if you can call them by that name : the PseudoAnthias and Franzia sub-genus

 

A two part article by Henry Schultz III

 

Link to Part I :

 

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-09/hcs3/index.php

 

Link to Part II :

 

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-12/hcs3/index.php

 

Albert

[Paul.b]

but one of these days that is more than likely what is going to happen ... maybe go up to a 40B with a sump ...

 

Albert

Yes Albert, that is what you need. a bigger tank. I guess we all do.

 

I was just at my boat and tried to collect some stuff from around my boat. I got a few shrimps and 1 amphipod, yes one.

One swipe of the net usually yields a net full of shrimp and amphipods but the water is still cold. I did get some scurvy looking stuff which may be a sponge or weird seaweed for the bacteria and I dumped that in. My fish enjoy chasing the shrimp and undoubtably, they will jump out.

I collected here around my boat. Not the Ideal place.

[albertthiel]

Yes Albert, that is what you need. a bigger tank. I guess we all do.

 

I was just at my boat and tried to collect some stuff from around my boat. I got a few shrimps and 1 amphipod, yes one.

One swipe of the net usually yields a net full of shrimp and amphipods but the water is still cold. I did get some scurvy looking stuff which may be a sponge or weird seaweed for the bacteria and I dumped that in. My fish enjoy chasing the shrimp and undoubtably, they will jump out.

I collected here around my boat. Not the Ideal place.

 

Yes eventually we all seem to need a larger one but with the focus I currently devote to Nanos I do not really want to get too far away from what would be considered a Nano size, and a 40G Breeder with a sump would be great but if I do set one up it would be as a separate tank.

 

In fact right now I am setting up a 10 Gallon, well about to start setting it up, and then writing a blog about all the steps involved and the sequence and goes on etc ... for a UK magazine. It will be a minimalistic set up and once the blogs appear on their site (and condensed versions in the printed version of the Magazine - Marine Habitat) I will post links to them here.

 

And on collecting : I guess you did not really get what you wanted it sounds like ... no problem ... whenever ... no rush

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

So what does a 600 Gallon well laid out Scape Look Like ?

 

Below is an image of an Aquarium at a local Professional Office showing how the rock scape has been arranged in such a manner that all sides are accessible and no rock touches the glass any where

 

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

Acrossota amboinensis and Acrossota sp.

 

There seems to be little information on the Mat Polyps which can quickly multiply and grow all over the Live rock in an Aquarium.

 

Below is a link to pictures of Acrossota but also of other similar looking Mat Polyps

 

Link :

 

http://www.ultimatereef.net/info/iddb/stolonifera.php

 

Albert

 

 

[MR.FEESH]

Albert, could you please comment on the difference in types of plankton and "filter feeder food"?

 

I'm planning to set up a tank without fish and, coincidentally, almost of of the potential inhabitants have various "filter feeder food" needs in order to sustain them according to the bios on liveaquaria.com

 

Specifically:

 

-fan worm: phytoplankton, liquid organic foods

-porcelain crab: planktonic food, small bits of fish/shrimp/meat

-sea fan: filter feeding food, live or frozen baby brine shrimp, marine snow, phyto plankton

-soft coral: mostly photosynthetic, also consume plankton, small crustaceans, brine & mysis shrimp

-SPS coral: zooplankton, micro plankton

 

Ideally, I would rather not have a bottle or two of different food for each of these animals. Is there that much of a difference between them? Would I do okay with feeding them all food from one or two types of live food bottles?

 

Thanks for your advice!

MR.FEESH

[albertthiel]

Albert, could you please comment on the difference in types of plankton and "filter feeder food"?

 

I'm planning to set up a tank without fish and, coincidentally, almost of of the potential inhabitants have various "filter feeder food" needs in order to sustain them according to the bios on liveaquaria.com

 

Specifically:

 

-fan worm: phytoplankton, liquid organic foods

 

-porcelain crab: planktonic food, small bits of fish/shrimp/meat

 

-sea fan: filter feeding food, live or frozen baby brine shrimp, marine snow, phyto plankton

 

-soft coral: mostly photosynthetic, also consume plankton, small crustaceans, brine & mysis shrimp

 

-SPS coral: zooplankton, micro plankton

 

Ideally, I would rather not have a bottle or two of different food for each of these animals. Is there that much of a difference between them? Would I do okay with feeding them all food from one or two types of live food bottles?

 

Thanks for your advice!

MR.FEESH

 

Basically there are three types of Plankton : phyto, zoo and bacterio, but then there are plenty of names of how they are referred to based on their sizes. You can have mega, macro, meso, micro, nano and even smaller sizes.

 

The foods referred to above fall in the Phyto (algal) and Zoo (animal) types and so you would need at least one food of each kind and most of those will need to be kept refrigerated after the container is opened, or they will go bad, so it is always a good idea when you use any plankton matter to give it a smell test before using it to makes sure it has not decayed and gone bad. I believe that there is one company that markets the bacterioplankton, but have no experience using it. It comes in small glass ampules that have in very narrow tapering off ends that you snap off with a little tool provided with the product.

 

Other than that the foods mentioned are what many Hobbyists use to feed corals and fish (e.g. meaty foods (mysis, brine, etc.).

 

Microplankton is not a "type" but a way to express its "size", so you could have that size in both phyto and zoo plankton, but whether you will actually find foods that contain micro or smaller plankton is not that easy to answer.

 

Hopefully this answers your question, if not let me know.

 

Albert

[MR.FEESH]

 

Basically there are three types of Plankton : phyto, zoo and bacterio, but then there are plenty of names of how they are referred to based on their sizes. You can have mega, macro, meso, micro, nano and even smaller sizes.

 

The foods referred to above fall in the Phyto (algal) and Zoo (animal) types and so you would need at least one food of each kind and most of those will need to be kept refrigerated after the container is opened, or they will go bad, so it is always a good idea when you use any plankton matter to give it a smell test before using it to makes sure it has not decayed and gone bad. I believe that there is one company that markets the bacterioplankton, but have no experience using it. It comes in small glass ampules that have in very narrow tapering off ends that you snap off with a little tool provided with the product.

 

Other than that the foods mentioned are what many Hobbyists use to feed corals and fish (e.g. meaty foods (mysis, brine, etc.).

 

Microplankton is not a "type" but a way to express its "size", so you could have that size in both phyto and zoo plankton, but whether you will actually find foods that contain micro or smaller plankton is not that easy to answer.

 

Hopefully this answers your question, if not let me know.

 

Albert

 

 

That was very helpful, thank you! A quick follow up-- Although so many of the potential tank inhabitants will eat similar types of food, I'm assuming it's best to spot-feed each critter (as opposed to dropping a slightly larger amount in front of the water flow) to ensure some food doesn't go uneaten or get trapped in the filter floss etc., correct? To clarify: this is in reference to liquid zoo and phyto plankton, not mysis, brine, frozen shrimp, and other meaty foods.

[Paul.b]

 

I'm assuming it's best to spot-feed each critter (as opposed to dropping a slightly larger amount in front of the water flow) to ensure some food doesn't go uneaten or get trapped in the filter floss etc., correct?

 

I spot feed everything as all animals don't eat the same thing or amount and in a confined tank, the faster animals will get most of the food. I have a copperband that will eat all the food I put in so I have to constantly feed on one side to get him there then quickly feed the other side. He is smarter than I am and knows my strategy so I have to keep changing.

But they all eventually get fed.

[albertthiel]

That was very helpful, thank you! A quick follow up-- Although so many of the potential tank inhabitants will eat similar types of food, I'm assuming it's best to spot-feed each critter (as opposed to dropping a slightly larger amount in front of the water flow) to ensure some food doesn't go uneaten or get trapped in the filter floss etc., correct? To clarify: this is in reference to liquid zoo and phyto plankton, not mysis, brine, frozen shrimp, and other meaty foods.

 

Individua Plankter is so fine and small that the plankton liquid you add will appear to you as a brownish liquid (zoo) or greenish (photo) and, yes, although spot feeding is fine, what you add will still disperse in the water and that is basically what most who plankton will do.

 

What I recommend is that you turn off the skimmer and filtration for 30 to 45 minutes, but leave the power head(s) running, that way the plankton will move around the tank and can be captured by the life forms, and not sucked out right away by the filtration equipment, but when you switch them back on the remainder, and there will be some, will be removed from the water by your skimmer and mechanical filtration (mech filters will then need to be cleaned).

 

All those types of animals can only trap so much of what you add that feeding several times a day (and use only small amounts each time) is better than just feeding once a day.

 

As you use the foods you will soon see what happens and since you are only using small amounts you will not see much difference in what the water looks like a say a capful in an entire tank is not going to discolor the water to the degree that it is apparent to you, but the plankton is there and moving around in the tank thanks to the power head or heads that you have installed.

 

You could use an alternative method to increase the uptake of the food some what and that is by using a cone you place over what you are feeding, but in the case of dusters for instance that would not work as as soon as you pit that cone over them they will retract in their tubes, which means their feather looking tentacles are not out, and thus the duster cannot feed. The same applies for more than just dusters, so I prefer not to use them when feeding planktonic foods, but do as I described above.

 

I use frozen cyclop-eeze from time to time, which when defrosted becomes very small particles, and so it is best for those particles to be kept in motion flowing through the water column and available for those life forms that can trap them to do so. When I use that food I turn the skimmer off for 2 or so hours, and the filters for at least an hour so the food particles remain in the tank for uptake by the animals. After about an hour I use a special baster (made by Paul. B to blast the rocks with water so what ever particles settled on it go back into solution and are again floating around so they too can be trapped (well not all of them but some of them).

 

The excess is then removed from the water when I switch all the equipment back on, let it run for an hour or two and then clean the mech filter (floss in my case which I replace rather than clean). I also remove whatever else is in my HOB filter and rinse it in SW to remove any particulate that could decompose.

 

So what is best? Well you can try both but my feeling is that eventually you will just add a capful or so of the zoo and phyto plankton and do as I suggested.

 

Most of those filter feeders need multiiple feeding a day to do well, so do not limit yourself to just once a day.

 

Yes, feeding many times may increase the uneaten food in the tank and may affect the nutrient levels so monitor your PO4 especially and if needed either increase your water change % or frequency, or use more PO4 removing compounds to keep them at a low level so you do not end up with an excess that can lead to pest algae growth.

 

Dealing with the kind of life forms you intend to maintain will take some trial and error in feeding until you get it right IME.

 

Once you have them in your tank, let us know "what" you added, and maybe some of use can help you more and with additional recommendations.

 

Note that good, moderate to a little higher, non-laminar flow is needed in that tank and that you will need to find a way to accomplish that. I recently came across an attachment for Maxi-Jet PH's that has a part you attach to them that thanks to the water flow generated will swivel and turns in a 360 degree fashion and therefore alter the flow continuously, which is what it desired.

 

The unit is called : Spin Stream and you should find info on it on innovative-marine.com, I acquired on and am using it to test it, and so far it does indeed what it purports to do. Nice device. Beats adding much more expensive PH's that do so as well and a number of other things but that also costs a great deal more.

 

Albert

[atoll]

Shame.

 

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/jailed-man-who-tried-smuggle-4001526

[albertthiel]

 

I'm assuming it's best to spot-feed each critter (as opposed to dropping a slightly larger amount in front of the water flow) to ensure some food doesn't go uneaten or get trapped in the filter floss etc., correct?

 

I spot feed everything as all animals don't eat the same thing or amount and in a confined tank, the faster animals will get most of the food. I have a copperband that will eat all the food I put in so I have to constantly feed on one side to get him there then quickly feed the other side. He is smarter than I am and knows my strategy so I have to keep changing.

But they all eventually get fed.

 

Indeed Paul, depending on what one feeds and what life forms are targeted spot feeding and/or just adding the food to the tank will work best. And indeed there are the "pigs" that will try to grab whatever they can and prevent others from getting any food so that is definitely somewhat to watch out for as you say and know.

 

Feeding is an "art" in many ways .... and it may take some time for one to figure out what is best for one's tank depending on what fish and what corals are kept ... there is IME not just one method that is best., so spot feeding some and setting up a feeding station for others, and jus adding food to the tank, is more than likely IMO what will eventually work the best.

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

Shame.

 

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/jailed-man-who-tried-smuggle-4001526

 

Shame indeed but it happens more often than we know as many such protected species get imported and the illegal shipments are not "caught"

 

What is also troubling is that the area they came from (Vietnam) is known to export a lot of coral that carries diseases (especially clams).

 

Pity that what corals where seized is not listed, and also not what they did with them ... Hopefully they were transferred to a facility that can keep them alive ...

 

Albert

[MR.FEESH]

 

I spot feed everything as all animals don't eat the same thing or amount and in a confined tank, the faster animals will get most of the food. I have a copperband that will eat all the food I put in so I have to constantly feed on one side to get him there then quickly feed the other side. He is smarter than I am and knows my strategy so I have to keep changing.

But they all eventually get fed.

 

I see what you're saying. In my case though, all of the animals except for one crab are sessile, so i'm not sure speedy feeders are particularly a concern.

 

So what is best? Well you can try both but my feeling is that eventually you will just add a capful or so of the zoo and phyto plankton and do as I suggested.

 

Most of those filter feeders need multiiple feeding a day to do well, so do not limit yourself to just once a day.

 

Yes, feeding many times may increase the uneaten food in the tank and may affect the nutrient levels so monitor your PO4 especially and if needed either increase your water change % or frequency, or use more PO4 removing compounds to keep them at a low level so you do not end up with an excess that can lead to pest algae growth.

 

Dealing with the kind of life forms you intend to maintain will take some trial and error in feeding until you get it right IME.

 

Once you have them in your tank, let us know "what" you added, and maybe some of use can help you more and with additional recommendations.

 

Note that good, moderate to a little higher, non-laminar flow is needed in that tank and that you will need to find a way to accomplish that. I recently came across an attachment for Maxi-Jet PH's that has a part you attach to them that thanks to the water flow generated will swivel and turns in a 360 degree fashion and therefore alter the flow continuously, which is what it desired.

 

The unit is called : Spin Stream and you should find info on it on innovative-marine.com, I acquired on and am using it to test it, and so far it does indeed what it purports to do. Nice device. Beats adding much more expensive PH's that do so as well and a number of other things but that also costs a great deal more.

 

Albert

 

 

Thanks again, Albert. My setup is a Nano Cube-- I don't run a skimmer, and due to the filter floss being part of the water loop, I can't turn off filtration separately from the main power head. I'll just have to feed conservatively to minimize uneaten food, and clean out the filter floss often.

 

I do have plans to purchase something that changes water flow, either the model you suggested or the "Hydor FLO" (same concept, different execution).

 

I appreciate your input and expertise!

[albertthiel]

I see what you're saying. In my case though, all of the animals except for one crab are sessile, so i'm not sure speedy feeders are particularly a concern.

 

 

 

Thanks again, Albert. My setup is a Nano Cube-- I don't run a skimmer, and due to the filter floss being part of the water loop, I can't turn off filtration separately from the main power head. I'll just have to feed conservatively to minimize uneaten food, and clean out the filter floss often.

 

I do have plans to purchase something that changes water flow, either the model you suggested or the "Hydor FLO" (same concept, different execution).

 

I appreciate your input and expertise!

 

Yes based on the set up you have that is indeed what you may have to do ... thanks for the update on your system set up, and keep us posted on now things go once you have the life forms in the tank and have started feeding them

 

Albert

[Paul.b]

 

I see what you're saying. In my case though, all of the animals except for one crab are sessile, so i'm not sure speedy feeders are particularly a concern.

 

 

 

I also have a bunch of almost sessile creatures like pistal shrimp, crabs and shrimp that kind of stay in one place. For the pistal shrimp, I shoot a piece of clam in their burrow, I also feed the arrow crab that way. The clown gobies get tiny white worms and so do the mandarins, although they eat baby brine shrimp from a feeder. Most of the rest of my animals get live worms and clams every day but as I said, I ahve to trick all of them to eat before the fast feeders get it all.

I target feed everything and would never think to just put food in my tank and hope everything gets fed. That works in the ocean, but not much in a tank.

Sometimes my wife throws food at me, but not because I am to skinny.

[atoll]

They went to Zoos and public aquariums but sadly a good % died as they were so long in being distributed around etc.

 

 

Shame indeed but it happens more often than we know as many such protected species get imported and the illegal shipments are not "caught"

 

What is also troubling is that the area they came from (Vietnam) is known to export a lot of coral that carries diseases (especially clams).

 

Pity that what corals where seized is not listed, and also not what they did with them ... Hopefully they were transferred to a facility that can keep them alive ...

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

 

I also have a bunch of almost sessile creatures like pistal shrimp, crabs and shrimp that kind of stay in one place. For the pistal shrimp, I shoot a piece of clam in their burrow, I also feed the arrow crab that way. The clown gobies get tiny white worms and so do the mandarins, although they eat baby brine shrimp from a feeder. Most of the rest of my animals get live worms and clams every day but as I said, I ahve to trick all of them to eat before the fast feeders get it all.

I target feed everything and would never think to just put food in my tank and hope everything gets fed. That works in the ocean, but not much in a tank.

Sometimes my wife throws food at me, but not because I am to skinny.

 

I guess that with practice one finds out whatever works best for the diversity of life forms one keeps and so there really are no set rules IME. One may have to experiment some until one figures out what ensures that all fish and corals get the food they need, and with all the years you have as experience, well, you have that figured out for sure

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

They went to Zoos and public aquariums but sadly a good % died as they were so long in being distributed around etc.

 

 

Indeed Les, as so often happens, they will confiscate them and then because they do not act fast enough, or do not know how to keep them alive till they get spread out to aquariums etc ... many unfortunately die ... very counterproductive !

 

Albert

[Paul.b]

These guys need some small food like live new born brine, but they also love worms.

http://s258.photobucket.com/user/urchsearch/media/Clowngobi_zps1ae21999.jpg.html'>

[albertthiel]

These guys need some small food like live new born brine, but they also love worms.

 

Oh yes this Clown Goby will eat a lot of different foods and loves to perch within branched corals ... some have reported that they can damage the coral because of their slime, but I have not found any really verifiable information on that.

 

Yes if a pair lays eggs it will be on the underside of the branches, and that may cause some minor irritation to the coral but in most cases there will not be any permanent or long lasting damage done.

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

Caloria elegans Slug/Nudibranch

 

An Aeolid Nudibranch that is an opportunistic feeder and will harm corals as it sucks up the mucus on the Polyp and as a result exposes the tissue to possible infection

 

This Nudibranch, more commonly found in the Mediterranean and around the UK, may have made its way to other areas and may come in as an HH on Live Rock, and should be removed from the Tank. HH's will be small but the Nudi grows to a size of approx 1.5 cm (just over .5 inches).

 

Here is an image of it (enlarged) .... you can find plenty more on the Net although few articles describing their habits and behavior can be found.

 

 

Albert

[albertthiel]

Conchs are interesting creatures for sure ... not many are suitable for Nanos though because they grow fairly large ... I posted pics of the Fighting Conch some time ago (particularly the one owned by Nano member Neuwave).

 

Here is a short Video showing one, courtesy of Member Rick12 .... this one sure looks a bit "clumsy" :-o

 

Video Link ....

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z61sosdmga3yit9/Video%202013-03-01%205%2020%2018%20AM.mov

 

Albert