D-D H2Ocean Pro Salt

[Kozo]

Hi guys sorry for the late response..... Oh well Merfin answered all the questions and that was what I was talking about in my first post.

 

When I bought my first bucket, the seller gave me some information about mixing the salt for 48hrs, and explained why it was better to mix the salt for more than 24hrs, I also did my own research and found the same answers that Merfin showed. So my friends and I decided to test the salt and we proceeded as follow:

 

1. First we tested my RO/DI water and my friends and I found PO4 around this range .01-.02.

 

2. Then we mix the salt for 24 hrs and checked to see if the seller was giving us good info and as a result we got a bit more PO4 I think it was around .05, so we waited 24hrs (Making it 48hrs total of mixing) and the PO4 went down to the original reading of the RO/DI water that we use to mix the salt.

 

Well I hope that answer your questions Weetabix (again thanks Merfin for jumping in). And yes I was basing my answer on PO4 and I have never used the water within 24hrs of mixing, so far I have mixed 48hrs before WC, so I wouldn't know if it will affect the corals. I think (99% sure) that it won't but you will get a bit more PO4 if you don't wait 48hrs. By the way all other parameters were excellent after testing within the first 24hrs and remain the same after 48hrs, so thats why I say that it should not make a difference on the corals.

[Nick's Reef]

Yeah, I'ver noticed the same thing about the sediment, I mixed for 24hrs. But got lazy and idn't do the wc. Next day when I wen to do it the sediment was gone.

[pprwngs]

Man after reading some of the reviews of this salt I should have picked some up they were selling the big buckets for 45 and the small for 15 @ RAP in SoCal..

[masterbuilder]

I am sure no scientist, chemist or brainiac but mixing for 48 hours makes PO4 disappear? Just makes no sense to me. Its either there or it isn’t….where did it go?

[hcsceo]

I am sure no scientist, chemist or brainiac but mixing for 48 hours makes PO4 disappear? Just makes no sense to me. Its either there or it isn’t….where did it go?

 

Per the posts that merfin posted

 

This brown residue is detailed on the instructions in the tub and is a residue of ferric oxide/hydroxide from the manufacturing process, (like Rowaphos). This product will bind to any phosphates and heavy metals in the water and allow them to precipitate out for removal via the skimmer.

 

Makes good sense to me as to why the phosphate would reduce with the additional time. Ferric Oxide tends to exhaust quickly anyway as it binds impurities very quickly. I'm very excited about this salt. I'm placing my order Thursday for some.

 

Steve

[davidr2340]

Here is the instruction booklet in case anyone needs it...

 

D_D_H2Ocean_Pro__Salt_Booklet.pdf

[merfin70]

Nice Expert Review of the product was recently added to Marinedepot.com.

---------

Expert Reviews

 

Product Review: H2Ocean Pro+

 

Wow and awesome are my reactions to this very well-designed synthetic sea salt. My personal feelings about synthetic sea salts are not the measurement of its compounds or trace elements, as those elements can be adjusted. However, the most important factor for me is how well my aquatic creatures react to the new salt. If the animals in captivity do not react negatively to the product, then I proceed forward with the measurement of its compounds.

 

There are other well-designed synthetic sea salts on the market, and adjusting those salts should not be necessary. Having to adjust alkalinity, magnesium and calcium levels on a new batch of salt is something most hobbyists do not want to do. Most hobbyists are not aware that a newly mixed or created batch of salt will require adjustments.

 

I tested the elements described on the package and was pleasantly surprised that the bucket I mixed was very close. Another important factor for me is how quickly it dissolved when mixed with RO/DI water. There are other well-regarded brands on the market that have a reputation for leaving residue after mixing. I feel I should mention that this salt did not live any residue in the mixing container after being added to the RO/DI water.

 

Something that may also be of interest begins with a true story.

 

My daughter has a freshwater tank that I help her maintain. Each and every time we perform a water change, I have to buffer the pH, alkalinity, hardness and add aquarium salt. Each of these products has to be purchased separately and then added to this small 10-gallon freshwater aquarium just to get the parameters correct. As it turns out, we did a 5-gallon water change and, after adding one tablespoon of D-D H2Ocean Magnesium Pro PLUS, all aquarium parameters were instantly corrected. I was ecstatic that I did not have to add anything other than the synthetic salt to get the water just right.

 

This is an incredible product with loads of potential. I love when something needed in this hobby hits the market and it’s not just another product, but a product made with quality in mind. Providing an instruction manual with each and every bucket of salt is a great idea. Providing valuable information with this instruction manual is a strong key to success that should be taken advantage of by all who purchase this product.

 

Tony Vargas Bio

 

Mr. Vargas has been an avid aquarist since the age of seven. He started with freshwater fish and invertebrates. His introduction to saltwater began with under gravel filters in the 70`s and became a coral-a-holic in the early 80`s. Tony is among one of the first in this country to successfully keep and maintain Acropora alive in captivity long term, in the mid to late 80`s.

 

Tony started to write articles on the husbandry of many different types of coral and reef fish. His articles have been published by several national publications, first here in the US, with a monthly column called "Feature Coral", than published over seas. He has been acknowledge in Carden Wallace textbook on Acropora (Staghorn Corals of the World), and many others.

 

Mr. Vargas is a successful SCUBA diver who spends his free time diving around the world observing many of these creatures in their natural environment. And, with his writing he has effectively communicate his experiences and observations. An accomplished photographer, with many dives in the Indo-Pacific and the Caribbean. Many magazines and catalogs seek after his photos across North America. A consultant and frequent lecturer he has traveled the States and Europe to express effectively his findings on corals and reef fish husbandry.

[hcsceo]

Wow nice review. My bucket came in today. I'll post my findings soon.

 

Steve

[hcsceo]

OK ladies and gents I've done my first round of testing on this new salt. Here are my initial findings below.

 

First I tested my water directly from my DI. Below are my results.

 

PPT = 0

TDS = 0

NO3 = 0

NH3 = 0

NO2 = 0

PH = 7.4 (it might have been lower but this is the lowest scale)

CA = 0

KH = 10

PO4 = Very slight change from 0. For reference I have .5 from tap

Magnesium = 0

 

I mixed my salt in a 5 gallon bucket running a MJ1200 with air and heater to 78 for 24 hours then tested. I find my refractometer to be very accurate. At 68 degrees and distilled water it reads 0 and at same temp with reference solution it reads 35ppt. At room temp the readings are identical. So with ATC it remains accurate from 0 to at least my 35ppt reference solution. Below are the results.

 

PPT = 35 (approx. 1.026)

NO3 = 0

NH3 = Slight hint of change (I tested this two times with the same result)

NO2 = 0

PH = 8.3

CA = 500 (again tested twice)

KH = 9

PO4 = 0 (tested twice and retested my water supply to see that there was a change)

Magnesium = 1125 (tested twice and also tested Seachem's reference solution to verify my kit)

 

So it was interesting to see that some ammonia was found in the final mixed solution. Not sure if that could have come from the bucket, pump, or heater but it was found. I suppose I could do a test with just plain DI in the same bucket, pump and heater to see if I get some ammonia to verify whether it really is coming from the salt. Also, the Magnesium levels aren't what I was expecting from this salt so I was a little dissappointed there. I was really hoping not to have to dose for Magnesium anymore. I was glad to see that something in the mix does reduce PO4. As per thier website there is some type of ferric oxide in the product and should account for reduced PO4 readings at the 48 hour mark. However, I had none at 24 so there was no need to retest at 48. I do need a better PO4 test kit so I'd take the PO4 testing with a grain of salt. One thing to note is that this salt mixes more water. Two cups of IO normally gets me 3.5 gallons but two cups gets me 4 gallons with this salt. My biggest concern with the salt is what is left over in the bucket after mixing. Looks like sand and silt to me and there really is a lot of it. I'd say 10 times more crap than the black specs I get from my IO salt. I'm worried it might contain silica but I have no way of testing for this.

 

My biggest question is this.. Is it worth the cost? I'm really not sure yet. Overall the results seem mixed to slightly better than my IO brand salt I have been using. Just based on the straight numbers, I'd probably say no since I would still have to dose Magnesium. But really these numbers are only a start and my money still rides on all the trace elements and minerals that might be preserved in this salt based on the manufacturing process that could be very beneficial to our corals. I spend at least an hour a day just looking at my frag tanks so I'll be able to tell a difference if there is a noticable change. This isn't something I can quantify other than to say "yes" or "no" my corals are doing better. If my corals are happier and grow better then for sure this salt will have been worth it. I hope this helps everyone. I'm going to retest more of this salt in a few weeks just to see if there is a difference further down the tub.

 

Steve

[The Propagator]

To me, with those kind of numbers it isn't worth the cost.

You can get better numbers with a less expensive salt.

[bdare]

Steve,

 

What Ca and Alk test kits did you use? Seachem are BUNK so I don't trust your Mg results. Your numbers are MUCH different that what Billy over at RC got.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.p...hreadid=1287118

[Weetabix7]

They are much different than what I and everyone else on here have gotten as well.

I would definitely suggest testing again after 48 hrs.

I would also suggest either checking expiration dates on your test kit or seeing if a friend or LFS could test as well, to compare to your results.

I really hope you didn't somehow get a bad bucket.

If you did, I would contact the manufacturer, from what I've seen so far they do seem to genuinely care about quality with the salt.

Thanks for your report, and keep us updated.

[hcsceo]

I agree my numbers are different than the few posted tests of this salt on all the websites combined. Believe me I want this stuff to test out like everyone elses but I just post the numbers my tests give me and do the best I can to test correctly. Could my test kits be bad? IDK it is a possibility, but my IO salt tests the same as it normally does and is within the posted specs of the many tests that have been done on it. I would really like reference samples to be able to test against so that I could verify my kits prior to testing, but I'm just a little guy who props a few corals. I would disagree with the Seachem Magnesium Test kit being bogus. The only Seachem test kit that has shown problems in the past is the Ca test kit and I would agree that those results could be Bogus, however, I used the API for CA. Seachem is a diffifcult test to administer and takes time and patience to complete but provides accurate results as many users of the kit on this board and around the world can attest to. Also, a reference sample is included to verify the results of the Magnesium test to insure the regents are still able to provide accurate results regardless of the age of the product. With all that said, I'm definately getting a Salifert test kit next time as it seems to be easier to use and well liked. Seachem does not provide expiration dates but API does warrant the thier test kits to 2 years past the manufacture date shown in the lot number. Both my kits are less than 5 months old and lot numbers for API show them to be right at 1 year of manufacture. Thanks Weetie for pointing out the expiration issue as I've never looked at the kits before to determine when they might expire.

 

Tonight I mixed up a new batch and will run 24 and 48 hour tests on it. It's possible my salt was settled in shipping as I got excited and didn't mix it up good before making my first batch. This time I mixed it very well and poored everything from the bag into the bin so that I can easily roll it around and mix it in the future. I'll also see if I can get my LFS to test for Magnesium, KH, CA as these are really what we are most interested in. This way I'll have another test to compare with. If my testing comes out the same then I'll contact the manufacture and see what the deal is. I should have these updated tests posted late Sunday night.

 

Now 24 hours since I did 10% water changes on three tanks last night I can say this... My corals really look happier. Honestly I've got a few corals that I've never seen opened up as much as they are now. Two of my acan's that I've never been able to make happy were fully opened with feeders just cresting out. Some of my zoas that I thought were doing really well looked even better than I've ever seen them. Call me crazy but everything was noticeably happier. Not a single coral looked stressed or bothered by the change in salt. I'm not one to fart around with salt acclimation so these tanks go the full 10% of DD's. Some looked plumper and larger and some of my zoa skirts that flopped around were rigid and fully extended. Perhaps it is a fluke but with being only 24 hours into a water change this was completely unexpected. This alone was worth the price of admission.

 

Steve

[Weetabix7]

^^^ I am very glad to hear that.

I am seeing similar effects in my corals and I have to say that this is the first time in a year that I have felt genuinely satisfied with ANY salt brand!

I like the D-D H2O and I plan to stick with it.

[merfin70]

hcsceo - You had me hanging a long time there until that last paragraph where I finally got to hear about what was really important. Your tank. Though only 24 hours in, good to hear that nothing is PO'ed and in fact, sounds like everything is enjoying the new salt. I love this stuff as well. Its nice to finally find a good "foundation" salt. With this salt and a little B-Ionic, I'm good to go.

[PodRod]

It's amazing how different test kits can give different results. It really makes you wonder what our real parameters are. I had some free time this morning so I thought I'd preform my own tests since it has been awhile and I was doing a water change anyway. I did tests on my tank before the water change and I tested the mixed salt I planned on using for the water change.

 

First, let me explain how I mix my salt. I have two water containers that I keep filled with 4 gallons of salt water. I like to have two buckets on hand at all times just in case of emergency. I use 4 gallons only because that is all I can lift . I only use one container weekly for a water change and immediately remix another batch. I rotate that batch to the back so, basically, the water I use each week has been mixed for two weeks.

 

I put the 4 gallons of water in a bucket with a pump and heater for about an hour. Once the temp got to 80, I began my tests:

 

My Tank before water change

 

Temp 80.0

Salt 1.025

Ammonia 0

Phosphate 0

Calcium 420

MG 1290

PH 8.10

KH ??? either 11 or 14

 

 

Salt Mix in Bucket

 

Temp 80.1 using temp probe for both

Salt 1.025

Ammonia 0 Salifert

Phosphate 0 Salifert

Calcium 440 API

MG 1290 Salifert

PH 7.97 PH probe for both

KH ??? either 9 or 12 API

 

 

 

The interesting part is that I used an API test kit to check my KH. I check this daily since I dose a lot of Calcium and ALK. It always tests between 10-11. I checked my tank today and it tested at 11. BUT that was the end of the bottle so I opened a new API kit and retested again since I wanted both my tank and the salt mix to use the same test kit. What a surprise. The new test kit showed my tank at 14!!!!!! I'm a little stressed now since I don't know which one is really correct. Was my old kit wrong - I don't think so since it's the one I've been going by for over 2 months and have had no problems with the tank. But how can I be sure?

 

The lot number on the old API KH test kit is 59A0408 and the lot number on the new bottle is 59A0608. Has anyone had this problem with API test kits?

[hcsceo]

Merfin I don't know that you can quote me on this but I seem to remember a thread somewhere that spoke about the last few drops of the API KH test giving lower results. I can't find it and I don't remember where I saw it but I'm sure I did at some point. Both those bottles were made within two months of each other this year so the reagents should be good.

 

OK I made a new batch yesterday and here are my 24 hour results.

 

PPT = 35 (approx. 1.026)

NO3 = 0

NH3 = 0

NO2 = 0

PH = 8.3

CA = 440 (again tested twice)

KH = 11

PO4 = 0

Magnesium = 1125

 

Looks like mixing the bucket for settlement made a difference and I should have done that before my first test. All the numbers line up but the Magnesium. If all else fails keep testing till you get the results you want... LOL. I'm sure the ammonia from the first test was due to a dirty bucket. It's possible I used it for dirty water and didn't clean it out good the first time. I'll test again tomorrow night and we'll see about the magnesium. If it is still low I'll get the lfs to test it for me.

 

Steve

[The Propagator]

Mags low, calcium is a little lower then I like but it seems decent

[hcsceo]

OK took the 48 hour sample to the LFS and he tested with a salifert Magnesium kit and came up with the same result 1120. I've contacted the manufacture perhaps there is a bad batch. These guys were really quick to respond so we'll see what happens. I'm sending them the lot number from the instruction sheet as they keep a sample on hand for each batch to measure in cases like this. Very impressed with customer service.

[The Propagator]

Proof positive that even the "top brands" have inconsistent batches.

But at least it doesn't leave a residue in the bucket like my old trusty Oceanic did

[disaster999]

and LFS here is selling a huge bucket for 70 bucks. i wonder if i should give that a try.

 

tropic marine can be bought for cheaper and ive read TM salt is a very nice and high quality salt also.

 

not sure what i should try...any thoughts?

[The Propagator]

I wouldn't. I would buy the cheaper seachem reef salt or even reef crystals by IO if it were me.

Those numbers just aren't that impressive for the money, and you can get better numbers from seachem reef salt or reef crystals. seeing as how this new brand is not as exempt as every one thought it was for abnormalities I wouldn't waist my money on it. $70.00 will get you dang near 2 buckets of reef crystals and a bucket and a half of seachem reef salt.

But that's just me..

[disaster999]

alright, cheaper salt it is..

 

i was thinking since ive read about everyone raving about TM salts...and now DD H2O...and i can get both of them locally here, why not try it out...i guess the saying "you get what you paid for" doesnt apply here!

 

Ive had good results with RC...i guess ill continue using it

[The Propagator]

Yeah I would. I mean why fix it if it isn't broken right...

[SLOreefer]

I was hoping this thread would help me figure out what salt to use next....i think I might stick with the tried and true reef crystals...I was going to do the d-d but now I just dont know!