Tank cloudiness

[Justanotherfishguy]

Hello every time I change my water it looks good but the next morning when the lights turn on my tank get really cloudy Like.  I was wondering if that’s a algae bloom or something else. and is it bad for the fish and invertebrates in my tank  and how do I stop it from doing that? My tank is less then a year old aswell 
I have a 20 gallon tank

 I use instant ocean with rodi  water about 4 gallons every two weeks for water change and it only does it when I do water change 
Thanks

[Justanotherfishguy]

[hinnenkm]

I'm sure others will chime in and there will be a much more scientific answer, but yes, seems to be a bacterial bloom. One natural way that I've found to get rid of them is sticking macro algae in the tank or back chambers (I've used cheato, caulerpa, and flame algae to do the trick). 

 

Also, make sure there is enough surface agitation and that the inhabitants of your tank are getting enough oxygen. 

 

If anyone knows why exactly this works, I'd be interested to hear and good luck!

 

 

[Seadragon]

@Justanotherfishguy That looks exactly what I had.  Whether it's an algae bloom or a bacterial bloom, the solution is rather simple.  Read through my post below so that you can confirm the pictures look the same as your tank.

 

 

Water changes is just a band-aid and the bloom will keep coming back.  You'll need a UV Sterilizer if you want to get rid of it.

[Clown79]

The green would be algae bloom, white cloudiness is bacterial bloom.

 

Your tank is fairly new so things like this will occur unfortunately.

 

Why it's happening only at waterchanges is the bigger question.

 

How do you mix your saltwater before use?

 

Did you wash your sand before using it?

 

What are the steps of your waterchange? Turkey baste rocks, vacuum sand, rinse media bags?

 

How are the back chambers set up? Do you have the stock sponges or media basket?

 

 

[Justanotherfishguy]

@Clown79  

 

Yea it’s kinda odd I don’t no if I was doing to much water at once or not often enough and it was messing with the balance in there if that could happen.  

 

So when I mix my water I have a 5 gallon bucket just for saltwater making  I put the salt in then the water stir it then I put the heater and a pump just to let it circulated for a day so It can get to the right temp

 

I didn’t wash my sand when I first put it in 

 

I turkey baster the rocks when I’m siphon the water out  I don’t  vac the sand   and I rinse the media bags I have the purity pack from Innovation marine I believe that’s who it’s by 

 

 

So the back of my tanks just the  im purity pack in the intank thing. The heater and return pump 

[Seadragon]

I just thought of something that would make logical sense of what could be happening in your situation.

 

I would test the water that you're adding to the tank for ammonia and nitrites.  I recall a past customer at a LFS was storing his saltwater in a barrel and for whatever reason, that water had high ammonia.  If this is the same in your case, it would make sense that there is a bacterial bloom every time you add this water that has ammonia or nitrites in it to your tank during water changes.

[Justanotherfishguy]

@Seadragon

okay I have to make some saltwater tonight so when I do I’ll check it out and let you know. And I’ll read the topic when I get home and let you know if it’s the Same

[Justanotherfishguy]

Yeah so I just got a pic from roommate this what it looks like now so it only last like 7 hrs and it’s gone every time it happens I have gfo and carbon in the back of my tank don’t know if that has anything to do with it.  And every time it happens I get left a present last time I got a crap ton of what I think is hair algae 

I don’t really no how to get rid or the hair algae either last time I touched it it spread every where 

[Seadragon]

3 minutes ago, Justanotherfishguy said:

@Seadragon

okay I have to make some saltwater tonight so when I do I’ll check it out and let you know. And I’ll read the topic when I get home and let you know if it’s the Same

 

27 minutes ago, Justanotherfishguy said:

just to let it circulated for a day so It can get to the right temp

 

I would also test it right before you add it to your tank (after it has been sitting for a day or so in whatever container you're using).  Let's say it does have ammonia or nitrites in it, but only after it's been sitting for a few days... that would tell us that maybe the container or something in it is creating the ammonia.  But, if it also has ammonia/nitrites in it from the very start, then maybe the water itself is the problem.  So testing at both times would be good, but especially at the time right before you add it to your tank.

[Justanotherfishguy]

@hinnenkm 

I believe there enough surface agitation I could be wrong but I I have the return water facing up so it make a wave at the top and the back chamber is kinda low so it’s like a waterfall.  I see people put fans blowin at the water maybe I might need to do that and I’ll look Into getting macro algae 

[Clown79]

4 hours ago, Justanotherfishguy said:

@Clown79  

 

Yea it’s kinda odd I don’t no if I was doing to much water at once or not often enough and it was messing with the balance in there if that could happen.  

 

So when I mix my water I have a 5 gallon bucket just for saltwater making  I put the salt in then the water stir it then I put the heater and a pump just to let it circulated for a day so It can get to the right temp

 

I didn’t wash my sand when I first put it in 

 

I turkey baster the rocks when I’m siphon the water out  I don’t  vac the sand   and I rinse the media bags I have the purity pack from Innovation marine I believe that’s who it’s by 

 

 

So the back of my tanks just the  im purity pack in the intank thing. The heater and return pump 

If you didn't wash the sand, that can account for the cloudiness from waterchanges.

 

It's really beneficial to vacuum sand lightly uring waterchanges and stirring it during the week can help. This will help reduce the silt in the sand and get it into your filter media.

 

 

Is there a reason you are using gfo? Phos reducers should be used on a need to basis as it can easily strip a tank of available nutrients, leading to bigger problems.

 

Another suggestion would be mixing your water.

 

Add the water first, then pump and heater.

Stir in the salt, it will break down better and faster this way.

 

 

[hinnenkm]

17 hours ago, Justanotherfishguy said:

@hinnenkm 

I believe there enough surface agitation I could be wrong but I I have the return water facing up so it make a wave at the top and the back chamber is kinda low so it’s like a waterfall.  I see people put fans blowin at the water maybe I might need to do that and I’ll look Into getting macro algae 

I figured you had a powerhead towards the surface, but good to know for sure. I know there are a lot of suggestions being thrown at you and there are a million ways to run a reef, but let me know how it goes with the macro algae. As far as the green hair algae, it's coming from nutrients - so 3 things to check are how long are your lights on? How much are you feeding? How often are you doing water changes? (Although, I wouldn't be doing water changes right now as it will make your water cloudier). 

Clean up crew that helps with green hair algae would be turbos, gold ring cowries (best), and conchs (although they only clean where they can reach). Trochus snails are effective cleaners too, but a more all around cleaner.

[Justanotherfishguy]

@Seadragon 

yeah so I checked the water before I put salt in and after I put salt in both times read zero for ammonia and nitrite. When I get home today I’ll check it again now that it’s in the container I usually use. And I’ll let you know

[Justanotherfishguy]

@Clown79

 when I do my water change a use a return pump to put the water in so it doesn’t disturb the sand. 
Good to know I’ll start vacuuming the sand lightly and move it around during the week with the sand rake thing I have. 

And I use the gfo because that what the purity pack came with and it said it helps with bad algae  So I figured it was good but if it can create a bigger problem I’ll probably just get rid of it and use just the carbon or is there anything better you think I should be using if any at all. 

[Justanotherfishguy]

@hinnenkm

Yeah I’m new to all this so  the more the suggestion the better.  And I’ll definitely let you know how the micro algae goes. 

 

So I have the marine orbit light that turns on at 530 am so from 530 to 7 is the moonlight and 7to 330 is the regular light and 330 till 11 is the moonlight than darkness from 11 till 530. and from the 330 to 11 the moonlight gets darker as time goes on till it’s off. 

 

I feed twice a day but only a small pinch every time

 

I do water changes every two weeks 4 gallon at a time in a 20 gallon tank 

 

Half I don’t know how to spell but 

my clean up crew I have a fighting conch two cerith snails two nassuras snails two super tounge nassuras snails  I think that’s what there called two nerite snails I had two banded trochus  but a hermit crab got them I have two astrea turbos and today I’m getting two more banded trochus snails  and a Mexican turbo  and I have a margarita snail but all he does is flip over 

 

I have a tail spot blenny to help aswell 

 

I don’t know if I need more cuz it doesn’t look like they really do much. 

 

I’ll look into the cowrie aswell see if I can get on of those 

[Justanotherfishguy]

@hinnenkm

i have two blue two red and two yellow Tip dwarf Hermit crabs aswell

[mcarroll]

On 1/2/2020 at 8:59 AM, Justanotherfishguy said:

To me that looks like you stirred up sediment from the uncleaned sand. 

 

Bacterial blooms are really white by comparison. 

 

Unless you find some evidence for excess ammonia coming into the system, I don't see a way that this is bacterial.  Too much algae growth -- and algae LOVE ammonia.

 

On 1/2/2020 at 1:43 PM, Justanotherfishguy said:

Yeah so I just got a pic from roommate this what it looks like now so it only last like 7 hrs and it’s gone every time it happens I have gfo and carbon in the back of my tank don’t know if that has anything to do with it.  And every time it happens I get left a present last time I got a crap ton of what I think is hair algae 

I don’t really no how to get rid or the hair algae either last time I touched it it spread every where 

Pluck that stuff by hand -- get every pinch as close to its "roots" as you can and try not to let any bits float away. 

 

Put the plucked algae into a bowl of tapwater that you can also use to rinse fragments off your fingers before going back for another pinch of algae.

 

Add herbivorous snails (Turbo, Astrea, Trocus, Cerith, Nerite,...) every time you see the algae grow back on a spot you've previously cleaned.   Put a snail right in the middle of that spot when you clean it again so at least one snail knows about the clean spot.   They graze based on memory, so if a spot was too overgrown, they'll keep avoiding that spot.

 

Cowries are often (but not always) algae eaters, but too big for your tank.  Unless you're positive what species you're getting, I would avoid them.

 

And again cease with all the extra filtration.  Let nutrient levels be higher if that's what they want to do.  Snails will eat extra algae growth....and eventually coralline will cover more survace reducing the areas available for hair algae.

 

On 1/3/2020 at 8:35 AM, Justanotherfishguy said:

my clean up crew I have a fighting conch two cerith snails two nassuras snails two super tounge nassuras snails  I think that’s what there called two nerite snails I had two banded trochus  but a hermit crab got them I have two astrea turbos and today I’m getting two more banded trochus snails  and a Mexican turbo  and I have a margarita snail but all he does is flip over 

Also, consider thinning out your crab/scavenger population. 

 

With your "deep" sand bed, I'd probably opt for 2-3 nassarius snails and no crabs or extras.

 

Specifically, I'd remove the hermits, the conch (too big) and all but 2 or 3 nassarius.

 

Stick with the standard snails I mentioned already (Turbo, Astrea, Trocus, Cerith, Nerite,...).  You'll need UP TO two herbivorous Turbo snails (or equivalent) per gallon....so right now you're essentially at zero for algae control.  I'd start with a four pack of Turbos the next time you clean.  Clean four new spots on the tank (at least) and place the Turbos right on those spots.

 

If the algae still comes back in a week or whatever, clean again and add another pack of snails about the same size.  Can be turbos or something else.  (Use a larger number if you go for smaller snails.  "Equivalent" to four turbos.)  And see what happens again.

 

Repeat the cleaning and adding as many times as it takes to get control.  (IMO it shouldn't take more than a couple of iterations....really doesn't look that bad....you just have NO cleanup crew right now.)

 

Don't do anything else (like add macro algae) to lower nutrients.....that is not your problem.  👍

 

[hinnenkm]

19 hours ago, mcarroll said:

 

Cowries are often (but not always) algae eaters, but too big for your tank.  Unless you're positive what species you're getting, I would avoid them.

This is true and some species will go after your corals, which is the reason I suggested gold ring cowries (sometimes known as money cowries). I’ve had them for years and they only graze on algae. They also stay small, but most people in the hobby don’t have them available - they’ve only seen their shells as jewelry. One of my favorite cleanup crew members! 
I am really looking forward to seeing progress with this tank!

[Justanotherfishguy]

@mcarroll

thanks  for all the info really appreciate it. 
 

Okay so when I get home I’ll start plucking that hair algae away. And place the snails that I have for now on those clean spots  until I get more 

 

And when u said get ride of all that extra filtration do you mean the carbon and gfo so just keep the filter floss or all three and have nothing and have the live rock,sand and snails take care of everything 

 

 

Yah I was thinking about getting rid of at least half the crabs cuz they were messing with the snails but if I don’t really need them I def will get rid of them cuz most the time all the do is molt and leave there old body’s around 

@Seadragon

yeah where I was storing the water still read zero for everything 

[Justanotherfishguy]

@mcarroll 

 yeah so after I changed the water it was clear it wasn’t until the next morning about a half hour to a hour  after the lights turned on that it got cloudy like that   when the lights first turned on it was clear    And slowly got cloudy like that so idk if it was the sand that got stirred up. 

 

[mcarroll]

So it got cloudy in the morning AFTER the lights came on and WITHOUT any action on your part??

[mcarroll]

Have you tested your water change water for pH and alkalinity before adding it to the tank?

 

If not, can you test the next water change water for both?  May as well test for NO3, PO4, Ca and Mg too while you're at it.  pH and alk are what I'm most curious about.

[Justanotherfishguy]

@mcarroll

 that is correct saw it when the light first came on it was clear got some breakfast came back To feed the fish and it was starting to get cloudy by the time I left for work it was like the picture 

 

 

and this is probably the 4th time this has happend after water changes 

[Justanotherfishguy]

I have not tested for that. I will when I do my next water change and I’ll let you no 

 

I only have the api master kit so when I have a chance I’ll buy one for NO3, PO4, Ca and Mg