Training & Feeding a Mandarin

[BKtomodachi]

Your fish is thin. Your methods are either a complete fabrication or entirely unsuccessful.

Congratulations!

[Withers]

Starving mandarin is starving

[SeeDemTails]

Also I see you Mandarin is a male or I think I see its spike. Since you are so well versed in Mandarins you of course know that the female of the species are smaller and less robust.

 

You really have no clue what you are talking about do you?

 

The females are actually quite a bit more robust. They are thicker and shorter. My fish is indeed a female, here is a pic of a male and female side by side in my tank so you kow the difference the next time you decide to start a thread about something you know NOTHING about.

 

 

Another pic of my female.

 

To all that had some positive comments I do thank you. I know she still looks a little thin but she is filling back out. Also the pictures are a bit deceiving of her size. My Mandarin is only about 1" to 1.5" she is still small. I will keep you all posted on a weekly basis as I have been doing.

 

The people making positive comments know as much about mandarins as you, NOTHING.

 

On a side not even if she dies I will still let you all know.

 

GTFO, just GTFO. Ignorance is no excuse for killing a fish.

 

To all of you with negative comments and you all know who you are. You are the same negative people I have seen on many other forums about this little fish. It seems whenever any decides to get a Mandarin you are always there to call them down. My little Mandarin has now lived for over 10 weeks. I know you all say "6 months until success" so let just skip the "Get back to us in 6 months". All I want to say is try being a little helpful instead of so negative. If you feel your methods are I successful than mine why not try and impart some of your knowledge.

Constructive criticisms are always more accepted then comments such as “FAIL”

 

I am not being negative, I am calling you out. You dont know what you are doing, you are posting as if you have some kind of success story, when actually you are the poster child of those who fail with these fish.

 

I encourage people to buy these fish, I am an advocate of successfully keeping them. Thats why it upsets me so much when you chose to spout off like you know what you are talking about when you have no success, the fish is quite skinny, and you are telling people you methods work when you dont even know yourself if they do.

 

My methods are successful. I have the pics to prove it. Everyone knows my fish is healthy and I have helped dozens of people actually succeed with keeping these fish. There is nothing worng with trying to help people, but that comes with actually knowing how to do it yourself. You dont, you havent proven anything other than you kept a mandarin who is now skinny alive for 10 weeks. Whoopidy doo.

 

We have given you consructive criticism you just dont want to hear it. Here it is again for you, loud and clear.

 

STOP GIVING PEOPLE ADVICE ABOUT THESE FISH UNTIL YOU CAN LEGITIMATLY CLAIM SUCCESS.

[jonrx]

My female is insanely fat. I think she's going to burst

[SeeDemTails]

Females always have more girth, this guy has no clue.

[Lalani]

Crazy Canadians...

[jonrx]

Females always have more girth, this guy has no clue.

 

Oh, for sure. I stayed out of this thread for the most part because you handled it pretty well, I thought.

[Khayman]

SeeDemTails

 

You say:

 

"We have given you constructive criticism you just don’t want to hear it. Here it is again for you, loud and clear."

 

This is a funny comment when was this? I messaged you several times before I ever purchased this Mandarin. You were very highly recommended by many NR's on the subject of Mandarins. You never replied except for once. What you said then was not advice just a comment really. You told me that I was only going to succeed in killing a fish. Also you posted that it would die within a couple of days or maybe a week. Also if it lived for 6 months then I could say it was a success.

 

Well it has been more than a couple days and more than a week. We are on week 11 now and she is still alive and swims happily and eats redaly at feeding times and other than that she grazes all day. Also she does now eat pellets if she finds them on the bottom of the aquarium.

 

As for the no knowledge comment and no know how to sex the fish. Anyone can sex a Mandarin no real feat of intelligence here. Males have a dorsal spike and females do not.

 

With a much sensarity as I can express in writing I ask you again for all to see. What do “you” do for these little fish? I am more than happy to admit yours look fat and happy. I would love it if my did also. If you have any advice for me and the others that read this forum please tell us.

 

If this helps here is a description of my setup:

24G JBJ Nano Cube DX

26lbs of live rock

1” Live substrate

Here is a link to my tanks thread:

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=172262

 

Ty in advance if you reply

[SeeDemTails]

Here is the message you sent me.

 

I have seen you have posted on several threads about Mandariens. I am just writing to say anything you can tell me would be of use. I have been compiling information from a few sources and you name keeps coming up.

 

Here is what I have gottem so far.

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?...p;#entry2007302

 

As you can see some are willing to critisize but few offer any real help. They do not even offer an educated critisism.

 

I hope you can help Thank you in advance

 

I read this, and I also read you thread. I have no desire to help someone who boasts publicly that they know what they are goind already. You made this thread like you were some kind of expert, and the very next day sent that PM to me. Your a joke. I'm not going to feed you any information so you can continue to dispense information you havent successfully done yourself. Your a know-nothing-know-it-all.

 

Why would you need my help???

 

Why dont you ask your friend with his secret method what you are doing wrong.

 

The breeder I purchased my Mandarine from has asked me not to post what they do to train. I respect that seeing that they do try and make money by selling Mandarines that eat frozen.

 

Stop posting or I will continue you to prove every post you make wrong, your thread will continue to, and has accomplished, nothing besides becoming an example of why unexperienced people like you shouldnt try to tell other how to do something they dont know.

 

The only thing you should be doing is asking questions, not making unsound reccomendations. When you start to do that, and admit you were wrong to make this thread, without accomplishing anything yourself, then, MAYBE I will help you.

 

Not many things upset me this much, but this is a topic I pride my efforts in and it really irks me when a thread like this come around. It only fuels those who know nothing about these fish to criticize and cements beleifs that people who claim success wit these fish are full of it.

[Khayman]

Here is the message you sent me.

 

 

 

I read this, and I also read you thread. I have no desire to help someone who boasts publicly that they know what they are goind already. You made this thread like you were some kind of expert, and the very next day sent that PM to me. Your a joke. I'm not going to feed you any information so you can continue to dispense information you havent successfully done yourself. Your a know-nothing-know-it-all.

 

Why would you need my help???

 

Why dont you ask your friend with his secret method what you are doing wrong.

 

 

 

Stop posting or I will continue you to prove every post you make wrong, your thread will continue to, and has accomplished, nothing besides becoming an example of why unexperienced people like you shouldnt try to tell other how to do something they dont know.

 

The only thing you should be doing is asking questions, not making unsound reccomendations. When you start to do that, and admit you were wrong to make this thread, without accomplishing anything yourself, then, MAYBE I will help you.

 

Not many things upset me this much, but this is a topic I pride my efforts in and it really irks me when a thread like this come around. It only fuels those who know nothing about these fish to criticize and cements beleifs that people who claim success wit these fish are full of it.

 

Well SeeDemTails

 

Thank you again for making a point for me. I guess I will just have to keep on as I am. As I have stated many many times to you and Green this is a working experiment. I listed below what experiment means for you.

 

Experiment definition:

- the act of conducting a controlled test or investigation

- to conduct a test or investigation; "We are experimenting with the new drug in order to fight this disease"

- the testing of an idea; "it was an experiment in living"; "not all experimentation is done in laboratories"

- try something new, as in order to gain experience; "Students experiment sexually"; "The composer experimented with a new style"

- a venture at something new or different; "as an experiment he decided to grow a beard"

 

So as I have said I will keep this going for 6 months or 72 weeks.

[javisaman]

I'd be careful with this 'experiment' talk; we are talking about living creatures here. Senseless death is never an excuse for experimenting. If you really cared about the animal you would have some redundancy (aka a suitable large tank) in your "experiment" just in case something goes wrong.

[SeeDemTails]

Why would you need to experiment when there are a number of proven methods available for you to follow?

[Khayman]

Why would you need to experiment when there are a number of proven methods available for you to follow?

 

The experiment is being performed simply because when i asked for help from many people here no one was forth coming. I was either ignored or told "It will die", this was before I ever bought one.

 

Also as far as a larger tank I do have access to one. So far though the little fish appears fine. She has gotten no thinner since the day i brought her home. She is actually more colourful and is a tiny bit larger.

[StevieT]

Yeah your fish is quite skinny. Awesome fail, thanks to you people dont take people like me seriously with ACTUAL success and good pics to prove it. Get off your soap box, you never had the right to make this thread.

 

9 weeks? GMAFB. Come back after two years.

 

For reference this is what a healthy female Mandarin looks like.

 

You have a different kind of Mandarin SDT. This mandarin maybe skinny and yours may be a female but my green mandarin has a compeltely different body shape and is skinnier around areas that your spotted is fat.

 

just sayin

[SeeDemTails]

Not the green females I cram fully of mysis at the shop. They get pretty dam fat. If I could only find some rods around here. We need to get some at the shop. My girl is also a lot fatter than most females of either type.

 

Green males look much different, as do spotted males.

 

Awesome job with yours BTW Stevie!

 

Back to the OP.

 

So the guy you got it from, who raised it and has a super secret method for feeding them, wouldnt tell you how to keep it alive when you bought it? What does he want you to kill it so you buy another one? You need to do an experiment to figure this out? If thats the case please give me his contact info so I can give him a piece of my mind. And no one beleives he breeds them BTW.

 

Maybe people would help you if you didnt pretend to know it all BEFORE you asked for help.

[Withers]

Yeah but the OP's is clearly starving. The fact that he basically admits that it hasn't gotten any fatter (saying that it hasn't gotten "any thinner" since you bought it implies that it also hasn't gotten any fatter, otherwise you would have said that instead) since he bought it is very telling.

[ribbie]

Wow is this thread ever a poor display of good fellowship.......

 

Thanks for the info and all but I could have done without the mud slinging.

 

edit: after reading the entire thread it's pretty obvious who's been successful in keeping a mandarin, I think she knows who she is.

[Khayman]

Not the green females I cram fully of mysis at the shop. They get pretty dam fat. If I could only find some rods around here. We need to get some at the shop. My girl is also a lot fatter than most females of either type.

 

Green males look much different, as do spotted males.

 

Awesome job with yours BTW Stevie!

 

Back to the OP.

 

So the guy you got it from, who raised it and has a super secret method for feeding them, wouldnt tell you how to keep it alive when you bought it? What does he want you to kill it so you buy another one? You need to do an experiment to figure this out? If thats the case please give me his contact info so I can give him a piece of my mind. And no one beleives he breeds them BTW.

 

Maybe people would help you if you didnt pretend to know it all BEFORE you asked for help.

 

Actually yes they do breed them. As for the secret feeding method. It is not really a secret at all. It is there breeding method they keep to them selves,

[BLoCkCliMbeR]

Actually yes they do breed them. As for the secret feeding method. It is not really a secret at all. It is there breeding method they keep to them selves,

 

still water

[SeeDemTails]

Actually yes they do breed them. As for the secret feeding method. It is not really a secret at all. It is there breeding method they keep to them selves,

 

Then if you paid for their fish, why wouldnt they show you how to continue feeding it what it was raised on? If they plan to sell the fish, but keep how they feed it a secret, then they have NO RIGHT to do what they are supposedly doing, which none of us believe.

 

Did you or did you not buy a "tank raised" fish from this person?

 

Do you side with them? Do you think it is right for them to breed a specialty fish, if they really do, and then withhold information about how to keep the said fish alive, not to just the competition, but to the person who they are directly selling the fish too?

 

Like I said do you have any information about this supposed breeder?

 

Just give it up man, please. You have lost all respect from everyone who reads this thread, its obvious whats going on here.

 

How old are you?

 

Any new pics of the fish?

[BLoCkCliMbeR]

still water

 

lemmie elaberate on what i mean by "still water"

 

i by no means am a breeder and have only kept a mandy about a 1.5 yrs.....on live food

 

the LFS is blowing smoke up your Ash...he knows that if you look info up on this fish that it pops up with red

flags about it being a picky eater and tough to keep....so, if he tells you what you want to hear, you'll be more inclinded to buy it..

 

his super secret breeding facility is probably run by some lil filipino family and its in the ocean...

 

they have been bred in captivity, but from what i know about larval rearing its not easy.....basically you have to keep the water bairly moving, and oxygenated w/o any sort of mechanical asist....and still have plenty of live food sources for each stage of development...

 

this can be done with other animals, ive done peppermint shrimp and emerald crabs, i had them in a tank w/ a sponge filter and lots of macro, i could never get them past 2-3 weeks due to parent caniblism....

you cant just seperate them from the tank...they die when they touch air....i think (havent tried this yet) you got to keep the parent in a pvc pipe or conainer that still allows the larva to float away from the parent, while still keeping her trapped....then they still got to make it through 14 or so stages before they even look like shrimp....

 

so this is the problem with the mandy.....you cant just shove em in a bottle and expect them to start breeding.......they are broad cast spawners.......they spawn in a good set up, but the larva or eggs never make it past the filtration.....

 

i highly dobut he has a larva rearing set up.......even for shrimp.

 

 

this is one stage of the larval development of mandy......you got to provide the right food and conditions for all the stages....i think there may be 8?.....if they make it, they train readily....

 

feeding is just one problem with this fish......collection is another....many of them are "spear fished"

so even if you can get them to eat, they may succome to their wounds...

 

i hate mandarine threads.....

[Khayman]

lemmie elaberate on what i mean by "still water"

 

i by no means am a breeder and have only kept a mandy about a 1.5 yrs.....on live food

 

the LFS is blowing smoke up your Ash...he knows that if you look info up on this fish that it pops up with red

flags about it being a picky eater and tough to keep....so, if he tells you what you want to hear, you'll be more inclinded to buy it..

 

his super secret breeding facility is probably run by some lil filipino family and its in the ocean...

 

they have been bred in captivity, but from what i know about larval rearing its not easy.....basically you have to keep the water bairly moving, and oxygenated w/o any sort of mechanical asist....and still have plenty of live food sources for each stage of development...

 

this can be done with other animals, ive done peppermint shrimp and emerald crabs, i had them in a tank w/ a sponge filter and lots of macro, i could never get them past 2-3 weeks due to parent caniblism....

you cant just seperate them from the tank...they die when they touch air....i think (havent tried this yet) you got to keep the parent in a pvc pipe or conainer that still allows the larva to float away from the parent, while still keeping her trapped....then they still got to make it through 14 or so stages before they even look like shrimp....

 

so this is the problem with the mandy.....you cant just shove em in a bottle and expect them to start breeding.......they are broad cast spawners.......they spawn in a good set up, but the larva or eggs never make it past the filtration.....

 

i highly dobut he has a larva rearing set up.......even for shrimp.

 

 

this is one stage of the larval development of mandy......you got to provide the right food and conditions for all the stages....i think there may be 8?.....if they make it, they train readily....

 

feeding is just one problem with this fish......collection is another....many of them are "spear fished"

so even if you can get them to eat, they may succome to their wounds...

 

i hate mandarine threads.....

 

BLoCkCliMbeR

 

Thank you very much for the info. Like you I do feed mine a variety of live foods (Brine fry and Pods). I culture the brine it is very easy. As for the Pods I did have a culture running before I moved. As mentioned in the thread the Pod culture was too expensive to maintain and took up more space than I am willing to give it.

 

My Mandarin does however eat frozen readily. I use the dinner method I borrowed for SteevieT. I do also still feed Pods I use the Zoo2 mixture and the rubble method I have at the beginning of the thread is still being used for them.

[Khayman]

Then if you paid for their fish, why wouldnt they show you how to continue feeding it what it was raised on? If they plan to sell the fish, but keep how they feed it a secret, then they have NO RIGHT to do what they are supposedly doing, which none of us believe.

 

Did you or did you not buy a "tank raised" fish from this person?

 

Do you side with them? Do you think it is right for them to breed a specialty fish, if they really do, and then withhold information about how to keep the said fish alive, not to just the competition, but to the person who they are directly selling the fish too?

 

Like I said do you have any information about this supposed breeder?

 

Just give it up man, please. You have lost all respect from everyone who reads this thread, its obvious whats going on here.

 

How old are you?

 

Any new pics of the fish?

 

SeeDemTails

 

To answer your questions:

Did you or did you not buy a "tank raised" fish from this person?

Yes I did buy a tank-raised fish. I have seen there setup and it is quite large. As too how they breed successfully I am not sure.

 

Do you side with them? Do you think it is right for them to breed a specialty fish, if they really do, and then withhold information about how to keep the said fish alive, not to just the competition, but to the person who they are directly selling the fish too?

Do I side with them in breeding a specialty fish? The answer to this is yes. The reason for this answer is simple really. Does it not make more since to by a tank-raised fish instead of harvesting to Ocean? Also they did not with hold information from me on feeding. I bought the mandarin knowing it ate frozen that was very important to me. Also it does eat Pods and I supply the pods for it and live brine. She loves the Brine. As for them not giving out there secrets on how they breed the fish. I totally agree with them. We live in a capitalistic society and they have found a small way to make some extra money. Further more if you are as concerned with the ocean as you obviously are you should be happy people can tank raise it saves the ocean.

 

Like I said do you have any information about this supposed breeder?

Like I have said in the past yes I do. They are located in Kitchener Ontario. Many Ontario retail stores buy from them. They do not however ship out of country or province simply because of the mortality, the cost, and exporting laws.

 

As for your respect comment to me.

You are aloud your views and objections, also I am aloud mine. I have received several positive e-mails about this thread. So far only yourself, Green and your friends have been negative.

 

As of my age

I do not see the relevance in this question. I am 32

 

As for new pictures.

I just put up pictures about one week ago. If you would like pictures every week, sure no problem at all. First I have a request for you. Post your method for keeping you mandarins so fat. Though Fat does not always mean healthy. Before you say no again. Just try and understand I am only asking you to do the same thing you are asking me to do.

[BLoCkCliMbeR]

dude, you still side with them on actually breeding this fish? time for covert ops, take a camera phone pic of their "larval rearing setup"

 

if you look at planktonic larva wrong they can die.....you have BS smeared all over your claim right now...

[Khayman]

dude, you still side with them on actually breeding this fish? time for covert ops, take a camera phone pic of their "larval rearing setup"

 

if you look at planktonic larva wrong they can die.....you have BS smeared all over your claim right now...

 

They are not friends of mine personaly. The LFS I buy from knows them, they are wholsalers of his. I was only ever to their place a hanful of times when he was picking up Fish and Coral.

I never knew until I started this thread that breeding thses fish was so unherd of. Though I will say they are not the only ones who breed them. You can serch fish breeders online.