Advice on keeping RFA's in a pico system

[Detritus]

Hi guys! I threw this question out at the "other" reef forum, and members there told me it was possible, but I figured you guys here at nano-reef would be the real authorities 😉 Long story short, I would like to start a 2+ gallon pico system, and I'd like to make it a Rock Flower Anemone dominate tank. Would such a small tank be suitable for maybe a handful of very small RFA's? Would this be ill-advised in such a small system? I want what's best for the animals, of course.

 

Longer story, I am returning to reef tanks after a number of years out of the hobby, and my last tank was a 125 gallon, so this pico tank idea is really new to me, as are the RFA's, which I'm still trying to learn about. For the setup, I had originally purchased a basic, rimless 2 gallon tank that measures 8.27"x8.27"x8.27", which was $35, and I got an AC30 to drive the tank, which was also $35. They will be delivered tomorrow. Then today I noticed a Lifeguard 2.65 gallon AIO tank that was $72, so basically a wash money wise, and I ordered it. I like the idea of the AIO very much and it's a touch more volume, which is great. However, the Lifeguard AIO measures 7.87"x7.87"x9.84" so it's got an even slightly smaller footprint than other tank and I'd be giving up a lot of that floor space to the false back panel. Would you guys think I could keep maybe 3-5 RFA's in this AIO with the smaller footprint? I think the AOI will look nicer, and I'm sure I can upgrade the pump with a Rio or something to get more flow. I may even be able to find some kind of RFG for the return. So I think it's more flexible than the AC30.

 

I do want to mention that I definitely have other tanks available if my RFA's did outgrow the 2 gallon setup. I have a 6.5 Imagitarium AIO that I modified to be more efficient, and I have a couple of IM Nuvo 10's, as well as no end of regular standard tanks (I have always been a tank junkie, I'm really trying to change lol!). But I really want to start here with something in the 2 gallon range.

 

For lighting, I found a Nicrew reef light that has a timer with ramp up/down and supposedly can grow low-light corals just fine. It was all of 12 bucks on sale, so I figured I'd start with that. I do have a PAR meter so I will be able to say with some certainty what the light is really putting out. If that light doesn't cut it, then I'll get a Kessil A80.

 

I also got a small Sicce 12 watt heater preset to 78F and I do have an ATO for this tank, I have had it a while and can't think of the brand right now, but this pico will have a decent ATO.

 

Oh! I almost forgot kind of the most important thing for me! I am currently planning and building a 40-80 gallon setup that will be my main tank. For that tank, I want to do the slow and sterile thing, starting with dry rock and adding bottled bacteria, etc. But, I have always been intrigued by the aquacultured live rock and sand from places like Tampa Bay Saltwater. I don't know if they've always done this and I didn't notice but I learned recently that they offer "Treasure Chest" packages, which are smaller amounts of rock and sand, shipped by USPS to your door, unlike the orders you have to pick up at the airport. This is one of the biggest reason I wanted to start this pico, I want to get their Nano Treasure Chest, which comes with a few pounds of base rock, premium rock, sand, and I think a snail or hermit. I'm really excited to try this methodology of using the aquaculture rock and sand.

 

Again, I asked on the other forum, and my plan was to fishless cycle the tank using Dr. Tim's One and Only and his ammonium chloride. My thought was that I understand the rock and sand are teeming with beneficial microorganisms, but realistically there will be some die off for sure. I thought that by having an active biofilter in place before getting the rock and sand would give the system a little buffer to handle some of that die off. I'm very nervous about the small tank volume! Members of the other forum said that would be unnecessary. I was told if I use the TBS rock and sand I can literally fill the tank with saltwater, add the rock and sand, turn the filter on, and basically instant tank. What do you guys think? Can I get away with just adding the rock and sand like that? I am nothing but patient, and I would wait as long as necessary for the tank to stabilize before trying to add the 'nemes. And I get I can easily do 100% water changes as needed.

 

OK, I know that was A LOT lol! But please let me know what you think of my project. I am stuck on the 2 gallon tank size for now, and if I can't keep the 'nemes, that's fine, I'll do Zoas or something else.

 

Thanks very much for your help!

[seabass]

44 minutes ago, Detritus said:

Would you guys think I could keep maybe 3-5 RFA's in this AIO with the smaller footprint?

Sure.

 

45 minutes ago, Detritus said:

I'm sure I can upgrade the pump with a Rio or something to get more flow.

Flow shouldn't be much of a concern for an RFA-centric setup.  You really just don't want a bunch of dead flow areas.

 

49 minutes ago, Detritus said:

I am currently planning and building a 40-80 gallon setup that will be my main tank. For that tank, I want to do the slow and sterile thing, starting with dry rock and adding bottled bacteria, etc. But, I have always been intrigued by the aquacultured live rock and sand from places like Tampa Bay Saltwater. I don't know if they've always done this and I didn't notice but I learned recently that they offer "Treasure Chest" packages, which are smaller amounts of rock and sand, shipped by USPS to your door, unlike the orders you have to pick up at the airport. This is one of the biggest reason I wanted to start this pico, I want to get their Nano Treasure Chest, which comes with a few pounds of base rock, premium rock, sand, and I think a snail or hermit. I'm really excited to try this methodology of using the aquaculture rock and sand.

Anything to help with maturity (and biodiversity) can help.

 

57 minutes ago, Detritus said:

I found a Nicrew reef light that has a timer with ramp up/down and supposedly can grow low-light corals just fine. It was all of 12 bucks on sale

I don't know much about that light.  However, RFAs don't usually need intense light; so there's a chance this fixture will work for you.

 

51 minutes ago, Detritus said:

my plan was to fishless cycle the tank using Dr. Tim's One and Only and his ammonium chloride. My thought was that I understand the rock and sand are teeming with beneficial microorganisms, but realistically there will be some die off for sure. I thought that by having an active biofilter in place before getting the rock and sand would give the system a little buffer to handle some of that die off. I'm very nervous about the small tank volume!

I wouldn't be overly concerned about the biofilter.  But before you add the RFAs, I'd probably just make sure that the rock isn't producing more ammonia than it can process.

 

I think your plan should work.  I'm looking forward to seeing it all come together.

[Detritus]

Thank you @seabass for your reply! That's great news, I'm excited! I think I will go with the AIO tank for sure. As far as the light, I don't have super high expectations for a $12 light but my understanding was that these RFA's didn't need a whole lot of light, so I thought for the price I'd give it a shot. If needed, I would upgrade to a Kessil A80.

 

I would definitely wait to add anything other than the rock until the tank is stable. I have zero problems being patient.

One thing I would really like is something in the tank that moves. Could you suggest some kind of tank mate that plays nicely with RFA's and would work in my small setup? I mean, a shrimp or crab, heck a large amphipod, just *something* that moves. I think a small Goby maybe possible, is that correct?

 

Thank you again for your help!

[Detritus]

Maybe I'm overthinking the cycle, but would there be any benefit to placing the 3 pounds each of sand, base rock and premium rock in a standard ten gallon tank initially. This way the die off would have less impact on the system and the rock and sand can kind of stabilize in that tank before being moved into the 2 gallon. Or would you forgo all that and just setup up the 2 gallon from the start?

 

Thanks very much! 

[Detritus]

Ok, I am so, so sorry, but I think my plans may have changed quickly. I have learned that Mantes are typically safe with corals (at least cheap softies) and I believe RFA's too, from what I've read tonight. At this time, my indecisive self has decided to abandon the tiny 2 gallon idea and go with an IM Nuvo 10 gallon Mantis/RFA tank. I will have to find a different place in our house for this tank, but I think this satisfies two itches; a long time interest in Mantes, and my new found interest in RFA’s. TBS has packages that include live rock, sand, and a Mantis - cool!

 

Sorry to have bothered you guys 🙂
 

[seabass]

9 minutes ago, Detritus said:

I think my plans may have changed quickly

Wow, that Was sudden.  I've never kept a mantis, so I'm not completely sure what's compatible with them; but they are beautiful creatures.

[Detritus]

1 hour ago, seabass said:

Wow, that Was sudden.  I've never kept a mantis, so I'm not completely sure what's compatible with them; but they are beautiful creatures.

Completely sudden, and I'm really sorry if I wasted your time! I do appreciate your input, and you've helped me in the past as well, so thank you again 🙂

 

But yeah, from my research today, Mantes are largely coral-safe, it's just that they will rearrange things and potentially knock your rock and corals for a loop, so, with some exceptions, they do best with inexpensive softies. I have also read that they do well with RFA's and if I can combine these two interests, so much the better. And while I won't be able to place this 10 gallon tank where I originally wanted the 2 gallon, I think it will be worth it to combine two very cool animals, in my opinion, the Mantis and the RFA's.

 

Thanks again for your help!

[NoOneLikesADryTang]

On 10/15/2023 at 5:50 PM, Detritus said:

Ok, I am so, so sorry, but I think my plans may have changed quickly. I have learned that Mantes are typically safe with corals (at least cheap softies) and I believe RFA's too, from what I've read tonight. At this time, my indecisive self has decided to abandon the tiny 2 gallon idea and go with an IM Nuvo 10 gallon Mantis/RFA tank. I will have to find a different place in our house for this tank, but I think this satisfies two itches; a long time interest in Mantes, and my new found interest in RFA’s. TBS has packages that include live rock, sand, and a Mantis - cool!

 

Sorry to have bothered you guys 🙂
 

We had a mantis RFA combo tank, but I was terrible about keeping the journal on it updated. We had a G Ternatensis in an ADA 60P (17 gallons). 
 

I would definitely try to get a small mantis if it’s going in the IM 10 gallon tank. With displacement, it’s only going to be about 6 or 7 gallons of water. With it being a cube, It’s not a ton of room for it to make it’s den. You’ll really need to think that out/plan accordingly so that it has a safe place free from light to molt.  
 

Mantis’ can be very sloppy eaters, so your nitrates and phosphates can get away from you quickly. Stay up on your water changes. 

[Detritus]

16 hours ago, NoOneLikesADryTang said:

We had a mantis RFA combo tank, but I was terrible about keeping the journal on it updated. We had a G Ternatensis in an ADA 60P (17 gallons). 
 

I would definitely try to get a small mantis if it’s going in the IM 10 gallon tank. With displacement, it’s only going to be about 6 or 7 gallons of water. With it being a cube, It’s not a ton of room for it to make it’s den. You’ll really need to think that out/plan accordingly so that it has a safe place free from light to molt.  
 

Mantis’ can be very sloppy eaters, so your nitrates and phosphates can get away from you quickly. Stay up on your water changes. 

Thank you for your reply! I'm going back and forth on the tank size, but it will likely be an IM Nuvo 10 or 15. I will definitely be watchful of nitrates and do my best to keep the tank running clean. For the aquascape, I'm going with some live rock and sand from TBS who is also supplying the Mantis. I have to think that their rock is ideal for these animals. I'm still researching and learning about the Mantis, but I like this idea 🙂

 

Thank you again for your help!