Scott Riemer Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Don't tell Prop if there is a problem with the prism, it'll fuel my argument for calibration solution. Link to comment
The Propagator Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Don't tell Prop if there is a problem with the prism, it'll fuel my argument for calibration solution. HA !! " That's why I always say unless its been abused.." You have no ground young man ! *smack* Yeah I would think the refracs are toast form abuse at work then if it reads different with the floaty. Trash them and buy a new refrac. Link to comment
Scott Riemer Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Uh-oh, he found me. Link to comment
BKtomodachi Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 My refractometer is calibrated with RO. I have checked its results with solution-calibrated units, and it has always been within .0005 SG units. *shrug* Link to comment
jm82792 Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 3 weeks ago it was wicked hot,like 85 and my sunlit 7 gallon nano was being hit with full sun. After 4 days my SG hit 1.30 according to my refractrometer I didn't want to believe it but when I saw my coral and my fish I knew it was the SG. Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 Yeah I would think the refracs are toast form abuse at work then if it reads different with the floaty. Trash them and buy a new refrac. I own 2 different refracs both for home use. A new $50 one and a less then a year old and not always in my possession $120 one. What are the chances that they both were abused in a manner that their off readings are exactly the same? Refracs are not always reliable b/c there are certain substances that bend light in a non uniform way to were you will get off reading, im not sure if there are any in Instant Ocean?? I got my bootleg calibrating solution on my stir plate, results soon. Link to comment
SmittyCoco Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 bootleg You said boot leg ! You have my attention ! Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 Drum roll.... I scaled down mixing directions on the Instant Ocean bag, 8.5 grams makes up 1 cup of saltwater at a SG of 1.022. I made a 2 cup, a 4 cup and a 8 cup sample w/ 0 TDS water. I stirred all 3 for 30 min on a mag stir plate at 78F until fully dissolved. Took refrac readings and hydro reading from all three. and... The hydros were correct! All three samples with both hydrometers read DEAD ON at 1.022. Both reafracs read exactly 1.015!!! This makes me have to believe something in the Instant Ocean is throwing off the refrac readings. I wonder if i would get similar results with a different SW mix. Now I need my calibration solution to get here to continue my confusion Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 3 weeks ago it was wicked hot,like 85 and my sunlit 7 gallon nano was being hit with full sun.After 4 days my SG hit 1.30 according to my refractrometer I didn't want to believe it but when I saw my coral and my fish I knew it was the SG. Im sorry, that sucks! Good thing im still just cycling. ... learn and live Link to comment
Mr. Fosi Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 The hydros were correct! All three samples with both hydrometers read DEAD ON at 1.022. Both reafracs read exactly 1.015!!! Ha! I'm bookmarking this thread! Link to comment
Scott Riemer Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Ha! I'm bookmarking this thread! Me too, after he calibtrates his refractometers with calibration solution. Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 Me too, after he calibtrates his refractometers with calibration solution. When I calibrated my refracs w/ the bootleg calibration solution they read what the hydros read, as for R/O water as calibration solution... . I should be getting real calibration solution on tues but... i don't think there will be enough solution to float a hydro . Link to comment
The Propagator Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Hey I already said floaties are accurate But the chances you bought a cheap refractor, and the company you work for buys over priced cheap refractors is still very very high. To my knowledge there is nothing in Instant ocean that will mess up a reading with a refractor at all. I think its just a combination of things other then the salt. ( what they are ??? I dont know.. ) Have you cleaned the contact area under the flip cover really well with ro water and dried it with a soft cloth or are you just rinsing it and stowing it away ? film will build up on them fast if you don't actually clean and dry them gently with a soft cloth and RO water. I just imported two refractors from the source in China for a song and they are wicked nice and accurate as all get out. You just have to search around and find a good manufacturer. I hate to say this but those old style refractors with metal bodies, and ss heads suck goat bawlz compared to the new style. They really, really do. Most ALL sold for under $70.00 here in the states are those crappy old style refractors. The good ones start at about $70.00 - $100 and up here in the states ( The crappy ones are stuck on ya about $40 up - $60.00 ) but in China where they are all made the good ones start about $40.00 with $8.00 international shipping ! and the crappy ones are around $19.00 LOL! . You want one like so IMHO ( biggest bang for the buck and accurate )..... All aluminum construction, the plate sits MUCH easier and is easily replaceable, and its a heavy sturdy unit. Not like those feather weight crap jobs. ( I have both brix scale in old style , as well as two old style sg refracts and I can tell you they suck bawlz !! LOL! ) Now I have two of these and they rock. Model number RHS-10ATC Its not the top of the line or anything but its not a garbage unit either and it is accurate. ( Bk agrees with me !! WTF ? Just kidding BK ! ) Link to comment
apophis924 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 35 grams of sea salt, Put in a 1 liter volumetric flask. add ro/di watyer to the line. mix well. it will be 35 ppm , i cant recall the converstion to specific gravity. Use that as your cal solution. OR you can just set it t zero with RO/DI water it will be calibrated. Ignore your feelings and trust your instruments. Link to comment
Eole00 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Consistency is the key. Regardless of what instrument you use, the livestock should do fine as long as you take your time to introduce the inhabitants. nitpicking about 35ppm or 38ppm is somewhat irrelevant imo Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 Hey I already said floaties are accurate But the chances you bought a cheap refractor, and the company you work for buys over priced cheap refractors is still very very high. I bought both myself within the last year and i use them only at home and i checked them against equipment my work has. The high end one I have let people barrow, so i cant say with confidence that IT has never been abused. I did not buy them overpriced, the first won i bought retails for $120 and i got it for $100. Other Retails for $50 (pretty much the same one you showed) and i paid $30 EDIT: Actually the one you showed is the one i paid $30 for. Good refrac 1/2 a good as my other one. I don't like the refracs that the slide flips towards the front. The ones that flip forward are much better b/c you are less likely to get the top portion of the slide wet and it more naturally flips closed (not sure if that makes scene). Have you cleaned the contact area under the flip cover really well with ro water and dried it with a soft cloth or are you just rinsing it and stowing it away ? film will build up on them fast if you don't actually clean and dry them gently with a soft cloth and RO water. Deff clean and rinse W/RO and dry B4 and after any check. I don't think that it is statistically likely that both refracs are reading the same exact thing due to cleanliness or prism abuse. Consistency is the key. Regardless of what instrument you use, the livestock should do fine as long as you take your time to introduce the inhabitants. nitpicking about 35ppm or 38ppm is somewhat irrelevant imo That's what im thinking, these discrepancys are normal. I think the best thing is to practice repeatable error, if you measure the same way each time you will achive consitency. Im new to the SW world but my bet is most sucessful people and LFS are not always accurate but consitent? Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 Hey I already said floaties are accurate To my knowledge there is nothing in Instant ocean that will mess up a reading with a refractor at all. I think its just a combination of things other then the salt. what they are ??? I dont know.. ) I think we should scientifically test it to make sure. Link to comment
K-MAN Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Anyone using the one they sell at Dr. Foster & Smith for around $40? Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 This is the higher end refrac i own Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 35 grams of sea salt, Put in a 1 liter volumetric flask. add ro/di watyer to the line. mix well. it will be 35 ppm , i cant recall the converstion to specific gravity. Use that as your cal solution. OR you can just set it t zero with RO/DI water it will be calibrated. Ignore your feelings and trust your instruments. That is basically the solution i made but w/ the actual salt i am using . Deff ignore feelings, but don't blindly trust your instruments. Link to comment
apophis924 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 If you ever flown an aricraft at night or in zero vis,, using ILS approach you learn to trust your instruments, chances are if you ever flown into a major airport, you were in the hands of an ILS approach system. Feelings change and can be influenced by many factors. ILS approach ,,, well numbers dont lie. If your instruments are calibrated correctly then there is no blind trust, it is a simple mathematical fact. "if i drop a hammer in a postive gravity field i need not see if fall to know it fell" ...Mr Spock. Numbers dont lie. ignore your feelings and trust your instruments,, there is no "force" to guide us in reefing. Link to comment
hlfahemi Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 If you ever flown an aricraft at night or in zero vis,, using ILS approach you learn to trust your instruments, chances are if you ever flown into a major airport, you were in the hands of an ILS approach system. Feelings change and can be influenced by many factors. ILS approach ,,, well numbers dont lie. If your instruments are calibrated correctly then there is no blind trust, it is a simple mathematical fact. Exactly. Far too many flight safety incidents occur as a result of "Pilot Instinct". Go with the precision instruments. Calibrate them using the correct MANUFACTURER supplied instructions and go with that. Link to comment
NanoReefNovice Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 Ok... so your plane has two altimeters, and they both read deterrent altitudes, which one do you trust. You cant tell me the hydros and wrong and the refracs are right with a pilot comperasion. I'm sure the opposite as happened plenty too, pilot trusting malfunctioning gauges and flys upside down into the ocean in the Bermuda triangle. Don't over simplify a complicated subject, which refracs are. Just b/c it is a cool pricier measuring tool does not mean you cant get skewed results. Link to comment
Nick's Reef Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 You want one like so IMHO ( biggest bang for the buck and accurate )..... All aluminum construction, the plate sits MUCH easier and is easily replaceable, and its a heavy sturdy unit. Not like those feather weight crap jobs. ( I have both brix scale in old style , as well as two old style sg refracts and I can tell you they suck bawlz !! LOL! ) Now I have two of these and they rock. Model number RHS-10ATC Its not the top of the line or anything but its not a garbage unit either and it is accurate. I have the same one as prop, got mine of ebay for $37 with shipping from hong kong. Compared to the LFSs top of the line refractometer it's dead on. may want to get one of these. Link to comment
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