Mandarin Dragonet

[quixand]

So...my question is pretty simple I suppose.

 

http://www.saltwaterfish.com/site_11_03/Ma...246_61_4_4.html

 

Says minimum 10g tank size. Yet nearly everywhere else states 75g+, and everyone else feels it's wrong to put a Mandarin in a nano tank.

 

What say you all?

I'm currently running a 15g nano reef with a 10g sump/fuge and my fish plans are a mated pair of Black and White clowns, and a Mandarin Dragonet.

 

Possible? Or come up with something else?

[BKtomodachi]

Its really not possible unless you find one that eats prepared foods. Even then, it MUST accept a variety of nutritious and suitable foods, and will require lots of diligence, patience, and time.

 

Whoever wrote that article is a complete moron, lol.

[ubigbobby]

Its really not possible unless you find one that eats prepared foods. Even then, it MUST accept a variety of nutritious and suitable foods, and will require lots of diligence, patience, and time.

 

Whoever wrote that article is a complete moron, lol.

 

 

+1.

 

The problem with Madarins isn't as much tank size as it is diet. They naturally feed primarily on copepods, and are notoriously difficult to wean onto prepared food. That's why people often cite 75G+. Becuase a 75G or bigger tank SHOULD have a large enough stable copepod population that you don't have to worry about weaning the madarin onto prepared food, he'll just continuously feed off the copepods on the Live Rock.

 

In a 10G there will be enough pods to last a couple weeks at most, and the tank is too small to keep regenerating a pod population large enough to support the fish.

 

If you can find one that has been trained to eat prepared food then you're lucky and you can get one for your 10G. But unless you find one like that, you're gambling with the fish's life that it will adapt to frozen or flake food, and sadly the vast majority will not.

[quixand]

So I take it you guys subscribe to the "Mandarins can't be kept in nanos" camp?

 

That's a shame, they really are beautiful.

I'd think the fuge would be able to produce enough pods for one fish no?

[SeeDemTails]

NOOOO! Mandarins can do just fine in smaller systems, if you take the time and responsabilty to train and feed the fish.

 

#1....I dont get the "if you can find one that is trained" comments.....ANY MANDARIN CAN BE TRAINED....It isnt hard at all. Start with a syringe, rigid air tubing, and some live brine. Turn off your pumps, squirt the live brine in front of the fish, it will eat them I promise. It will recognize the brine come from the tube soon as the tube is clear and it can see them wriggling around inside it. Once the mandarin is reacting to the tube, start mixing mysis with the live brine in a 50/50 mix. The fish will start eating the mysis and then you can just feed it mysis. When I turn off the pumsp, my fish meets me in its feeding location within seconds, they are quite intelligent.

 

#2....Mandrins are not the pod devouring fish they are made out to be. They do eat pods but unless you have bare glass tank there is not way the fish will find and eat every pod. Pods hide in the rock, well out of the reach of the mandarin. Thats why I laugh when people say you MUST have a fuge to keep a mandarin. Totally not true, every porous rock is a pod farm.

 

#3.....Fuge or no fuge, you need to train the fish to eat mysis. You can vary the diet if you want, but the combo of the pods in your tank and the mysis you feed it, it will be just fine.

 

My fish is fat and happy after almost a year in my tank. It has clearly grown. I dont know of a much better indicator of success than that.

[Lizzie1324]

^

^

^

Listen to SeeDemTails. She has an awesome method of training a mandarin to eat frozen mysis. I'll try to describe it in short if I can..

 

1. Get the fish to associate food with clear tubing. It will start coming to the top of the tank with the other fish.

2. Start feeding live brine through the tubing.

3. Once it gets that idea feed it a combo of frozen brine and live brine

4. Then feed it a combo of frozen brine and frozen mysis

5. Then feed all mysis!

 

And TADAAAAA. Frozen fed mandarin. If I ever plan on getting one this is the method I'm going to use. She can even hand feed hers if I'm not mistaken...

 

But correct me if I missed anything.

[Japsican]

I used SDT's and Dooderinos (spelling) advice. I didnt even use live brine, I just kept the Mandarin quarantined for a week and kept shooting frozen mysis straight at him. He started picking the mysis off the floor, now he comes toward the feeding tube whenever he sees it hit the tank...I turn off all my pumps before feeding since he is a pretty slow eater, he likes to inspect his food before he eats it, but he always finishes whatever frozen mysis he can get to.

 

Also, as for copepod depletion. I have not noticed any mass depletion of copepods in my tank after my mandarin was introduced. There is one spot in my tank that always has tons of copepods swimming in it when the lights are on...after the Mandarin was introduced, the copepods are still there...It's also a pretty easy spot for him to get to if he wanted to.

 

Thanks SDT and Dooderino!

[quixand]

Absolutely BEAUTIFUL info.

 

Exactly what I was hoping for. First hand experience from people very knowledgeable in this subject.

Thank you very much SeeDemTails, I may be PM'ing you someday

[MiddReef]

+1 to the "SDT Method." It is possible, but certainly a more care-intensive process. You also need to be ready to accept a potentially higher nutrient load into your tanks with the increased feedings...so don't just dump in food and hope your mandarin is grabbing it. I wouldn't reccomend it to complete beginners, and it certainly takes dedication. First fish? Probably not, but somewhere down the road when you know that you're comfortable spending 10 minutes or so every other day to target feed your mandarin it's much more realistic.

[Seiryoku]

I'm planning to get a green mandarin for my 20g soon and will use the above method of feeding ^^)b

 

I'll probably make multiple "pod condos" as well that will rotate around fuges on my various tanks...but I have too much time on my hands >_<

[BKtomodachi]

#1....I dont get the "if you can find one that is trained" comments.....ANY MANDARIN CAN BE TRAINED....It isnt hard at all. Start with a syringe, rigid air tubing, and some live brine. Turn off your pumps, squirt the live brine in front of the fish, it will eat them I promise. It will recognize the brine come from the tube soon as the tube is clear and it can see them wriggling around inside it. Once the mandarin is reacting to the tube, start mixing mysis with the live brine in a 50/50 mix. The fish will start eating the mysis and then you can just feed it mysis. When I turn off the pumsp, my fish meets me in its feeding location within seconds, they are quite intelligent.

I have seen pics of your mandarin and I am quite impressed. I am scared to try this method myself, though. When I used to work in a LFS there were some individual fish that I personally just could not get to eat prepared foods. Perhaps I was doing something wrong, I don't know.

 

Should I try it?

[Seiryoku]

Yes, you should!

[BKtomodachi]

I could have the mother of all controversial tanks. 1 Sunburst anthia + 1 mandarin.

[Seiryoku]

Hmm, mine will only be slightly controversial with a mandarin and dwarf flame angel ...

[BKtomodachi]

well, UP THE ANTE THEN!

[Seiryoku]

Maybe...I'm about to make a new thread in this forum...

[Dooderino]

To make it a little easier in the beginning I would suggest putting the Mandarin in a breeding net. This will contain the food to the net and you won't have to worry about the other inhabitants of the tank stealing the food.

 

Just like teaching a dog tricks this works best by close repetition. Turn the pumps off EVERY time. Feed with the same tube. And even keep the time of day close to the same time.

 

You can teach them to eat everything. I taught mine to eat pellets. VIDEO in sig.

[Seiryoku]

I forgot who it was...but...

 

There is a video of a guy feeding his mandarin in a large tank with tangs that eat everything. He took an olive jar and molded some acrylic around it, like a hook, with a long handle type thing. He gets some tank water in it and puts the food (formula 1 pellets I think) in until it sinks then lowers the entire thing into the tank and he small fish go in, including the mandarin, to pig out.

 

Worked really well from what I saw.

[SeeDemTails]

Thats Melev....his method is cool too. I just enjoy the 1 on 1 time with my fish.

 

I can stick my fingers in the water and litteraly touch my fish, it has lost all fear of me.

[13angels]

wow this info is worth gold!!!

[MiddReef]

It also helps to have a LFS that is willing to train and/or "pre-train" the fish for you...not many will, but there are a few out there who will at least give it a shot.

[brian92]

It also helps to have a LFS that is willing to train and/or "pre-train" the fish for you...not many will, but there are a few out there who will at least give it a shot.

+1

 

I'm getting a mandarin next week for my 20L but the only reason I'm gonna try keeping one is because they wean them onto frozen food first.

[MiddReef]

Perfect! I stopped by a few times and watched a particular individual that was on hold for me eat frozen food before I even considered it. Lucky to have a great LFS that is willing to help out and go out of their way, not just sell sell sell...

[ubigbobby]

NOOOO! Mandarins can do just fine in smaller systems, if you take the time and responsabilty to train and feed the fish.

 

#1....I dont get the "if you can find one that is trained" comments.....ANY MANDARIN CAN BE TRAINED....It isnt hard at all. Start with a syringe, rigid air tubing, and some live brine. Turn off your pumps, squirt the live brine in front of the fish, it will eat them I promise. It will recognize the brine come from the tube soon as the tube is clear and it can see them wriggling around inside it. Once the mandarin is reacting to the tube, start mixing mysis with the live brine in a 50/50 mix. The fish will start eating the mysis and then you can just feed it mysis. When I turn off the pumsp, my fish meets me in its feeding location within seconds, they are quite intelligent.

 

#2....Mandrins are not the pod devouring fish they are made out to be. They do eat pods but unless you have bare glass tank there is not way the fish will find and eat every pod. Pods hide in the rock, well out of the reach of the mandarin. Thats why I laugh when people say you MUST have a fuge to keep a mandarin. Totally not true, every porous rock is a pod farm.

 

#3.....Fuge or no fuge, you need to train the fish to eat mysis. You can vary the diet if you want, but the combo of the pods in your tank and the mysis you feed it, it will be just fine.

 

My fish is fat and happy after almost a year in my tank. It has clearly grown. I dont know of a much better indicator of success than that.

 

That's what I get for regurgitating the same old info I've read in them books!

 

Hmm...I have a 10G FOWLR that a Mandarin would look mighty good in....

[quixand]

This thread turned into a veritable gold mine of fantastic info.

 

Seems to me the original goal for my tank is not only plausible, but pretty darn possible!

 

/dance