IM 25 mystery build

[Llorgon]

3 years ago I setup an IM25 as a temporary tank during a long move. For a solid year, this tank has been my most successful attempt at reef keeping. Unfortunately, both my tanks slowly crashed last summer and this tank was kind of neglected. But now I'm ready to reboot the tank!

 

Heres what I am working with:

 

Equipment 

IM 25 tank

75w heater

Inkbird temp controller

IM media caddy x2

Ghost nano protein skimmer

MP10

Radion xr30 g4 maybe? Light came with the tank.

 

Livestock

2x clowns

Royal gramma

 

Since most of my tanks end up pretty much only growing algae really well, I'm going to try something different than starting with dry rock and dry sand and use livestock. A LFS near me said they would sell me some livestock from their tanks. 

 

The mystery part of this build is what I want to put in the tank. I've been throwing around a few ideas:

Hammer/frogspawn tank

Anemone tank

SPS dominant tank

Simple softy tank

Pest/weed coral tank? Take all those corals that grow like weeds and see what happens.

 

Other than that, still not sure if I should go sand or bare bottom. I've always had sand so bare bottom would be something different.

 

If I get livestock from the LFS, is there any concern with fish disease coming in on the liverock?

 

[debbeach13]

Since, you already have an SPS tank. IMO pick one of the other choices you listed. Is the tank dry now? 

8 hours ago, Llorgon said:

I'm going to try something different than starting with dry rock and dry sand and use livestock. A LFS near me said they would sell me some livestock from their tanks. 

If this means they have live rock, and you have never used live rock before. I think you will enjoy the experience. There is a risk of unwanted pests on the rock, but you can get those any time you purchase new frags. 

[Llorgon]

5 hours ago, debbeach13 said:

Since, you already have an SPS tank. IMO pick one of the other choices you listed. Is the tank dry now? 

Tank is not dry. It's still running, but the only corals left in the tank are 2 hammers and a rock flower. 

 

I tried the SPS tank. Right now I have an algae tank with a few corals in it. It will probably turn into a mixed reef of some sort.

5 hours ago, debbeach13 said:

If this means they have live rock, and you have never used live rock before. I think you will enjoy the experience. There is a risk of unwanted pests on the rock, but you can get those any time you purchase new frags. 

Ya, the owner said he did have some aiptasia on the rocks that he is working on getting rid of. But looking at them there isn't much on the rocks. Just one here and there.

 

Right now, my thought is next weekend to take the tank apart. Put the corals and fish in my qt tank and start cleaning out the tank.

[PJPS]

15 hours ago, Llorgon said:

3 years ago I setup an IM25 as a temporary tank during a long move. For a solid year, this tank has been my most successful attempt at reef keeping. Unfortunately, both my tanks slowly crashed last summer and this tank was kind of neglected. But now I'm ready to reboot the tank!

 

Heres what I am working with:

 

Equipment 

IM 25 tank

75w heater

Inkbird temp controller

IM media caddy x2

Ghost nano protein skimmer

MP10

Radion xr30 g4 maybe? Light came with the tank.

 

Livestock

2x clowns

Royal gramma

 

Since most of my tanks end up pretty much only growing algae really well, I'm going to try something different than starting with dry rock and dry sand and use livestock. A LFS near me said they would sell me some livestock from their tanks. 

 

The mystery part of this build is what I want to put in the tank. I've been throwing around a few ideas:

Hammer/frogspawn tank

Anemone tank

SPS dominant tank

Simple softy tank

Pest/weed coral tank? Take all those corals that grow like weeds and see what happens.

 

Other than that, still not sure if I should go sand or bare bottom. I've always had sand so bare bottom would be something different.

 

If I get livestock from the LFS, is there any concern with fish disease coming in on the liverock?

 

I'd start with sand either way, pull it in 25% patches every 2 weeks in 8 months in if BB is the final destination.  It's much easier to develop biology with a sand bed, then once signs of spontaneous life have been popping up for a month, start pulling the sandbed in chunks.

 

Having tried both, I prefer the look of sand, but it's a bit more maintenance.  I just hit it with a turkey baster to free the crud (again 25%/week) and it keeps it from being an ever dirtier litter box.

 

I assume you mean liverock, not livestock.  Try it out, it'll be much easier/less faff than the multiple bacteria and assorted bugs homebrew that I've come to rely on.  If actual seeded liverock from a place I trust was an option. LR every time.  You'll have a much easier time establishing biological stability.  Same CuC rules apply, if you have GHA coming in (LR won't stop that), snails & manual removal.  Asuming the LR will have some pods, itll come in slower, don't dilly dally -herbivores. But the months and months of ugly, that mostly is shrunk to a gnarly looking week here and there for  the first few months 🙂

[Llorgon]

On 3/12/2023 at 1:00 PM, PJPS said:

I'd start with sand either way, pull it in 25% patches every 2 weeks in 8 months in if BB is the final destination.  It's much easier to develop biology with a sand bed, then once signs of spontaneous life have been popping up for a month, start pulling the sandbed in chunks.

I was leaning towards sand as well just because I like the look.

On 3/12/2023 at 1:00 PM, PJPS said:

 

Having tried both, I prefer the look of sand, but it's a bit more maintenance.  I just hit it with a turkey baster to free the crud (again 25%/week) and it keeps it from being an ever dirtier litter box.

Do you vacuum your sand as well or just use the turkey baster on it?

On 3/12/2023 at 1:00 PM, PJPS said:

 

I assume you mean liverock, not livestock.  Try it out, it'll be much easier/less faff than the multiple bacteria and assorted bugs homebrew that I've come to rely on.  If actual seeded liverock from a place I trust was an option. LR every time.  You'll have a much easier time establishing biological stability.  Same CuC rules apply, if you have GHA coming in (LR won't stop that), snails & manual removal.  Asuming the LR will have some pods, itll come in slower, don't dilly dally -herbivores. But the months and months of ugly, that mostly is shrunk to a gnarly looking week here and there for  the first few months 🙂

Yep I meant liverock. I'm going to talk to the LFS again and see what prices they will sell some pieces of liverock for. Hopefully starting with the liverock will help me skip some of the algae growing stage. 

 

As for what to do with the tank, since my 75g will probably not be SPS for awhile. I might try my hand at an SPS dominant tank for the 25g. 

 

Question for those with an IM25 tank or similar. What do you guys use for a return pump. The tank has 2 return outlets and right now I have a sicce 1.5 t'ed off to both return outlets.

[PJPS]

36 minutes ago, Llorgon said:

I was leaning towards sand as well just because I like the look.

Do you vacuum your sand as well or just use the turkey baster on it?

Yep I meant liverock. I'm going to talk to the LFS again and see what prices they will sell some pieces of liverock for. Hopefully starting with the liverock will help me skip some of the algae growing stage. 

 

As for what to do with the tank, since my 75g will probably not be SPS for awhile. I might try my hand at an SPS dominant tank for the 25g. 

 

Question for those with an IM25 tank or similar. What do you guys use for a return pump. The tank has 2 return outlets and right now I have a sicce 1.5 t'ed off to both return outlets.

Just fluff it here and there every 7-14 days with a turkey baster with the flow going.

 

I just use the included mighty jet on minimum.  My mp10s handle flow, I want maximum contact time for my filter media.  That said I have VFGs on the outlets to vary the flow pattern even more back to front.  In a softy/lps 1 nero3 gave me plenty of flexibility for flow.

[Llorgon]

16 hours ago, PJPS said:

Just fluff it here and there every 7-14 days with a turkey baster with the flow going.

 

I just use the included mighty jet on minimum.  My mp10s handle flow, I want maximum contact time for my filter media.  That said I have VFGs on the outlets to vary the flow pattern even more back to front.  In a softy/lps 1 nero3 gave me plenty of flexibility for flow.

That seems easy enough for the sand bed.

 

How do you find the 2 mp10's. I currently have one, I guess if I go SPS I will probably need a second.

[PJPS]

2 is a lot, neither tops 50% on pulse 0.250 seconds, much lower for anything approaching constant (reefcrest). Non SPS you’re fine with 1.  I like 2 for sps only because they can’t move and I want to hit them from every direction a few times throughout the day.  Anything with flow or jiggle will have water, hitting it from all sides, even with only one powerhead.  Pulsing makes for happy LPS, like, super happy. It’ll givem a rhythmic shake/jiggle that they adore.  Plenty of movement but gentle enough for jelly on calcium razors 😊

 

 

[Llorgon]

Sunday I'm picking up a few pieces of liverock from the LFS. 

 

Tomorrow, I plan to move the fish and rock to a temp tank, drain and remove the sand from this one then fill it with water and vinegar and scrape all the crap off and suck it all out.

 

Should be a fun weekend.

[Llorgon]

Tank is cleaned out and ready for some new liverock tomorrow. Hopefully I can get some good pieces!

[Llorgon]

I picked up a couple pieces of liverock yesterday. Much bigger than expected. I also got some free giant Kenya trees on it. 

 

I will move the fish back into the tank tonight. I have some bio-spira to add in as well, but I don't think I should have any issues with a cycle since both pieces of liverock were transported in tank water.

 

I'm still playing around with the aquascape. I might change it up when I remove the Kenya trees.

[Llorgon]

The plan going forward:

Change the radion settings from the LPS mode they are on to AB+ setting and check par levels
Order a pod seed pack - never done this to start before, only added them after problems occurred.
Start on some light live phyto dosing
Add some cuc
Finalize fish stocking
Remove kenya trees
Add SPS
Have an amazing SPS tank

I'm looking for some good inhabitant stocking ideas. I have the 2 clowns and the royal gramma right now. The royal gramma could be moved to my bigger tank if needed.

[PJPS]

Quality plan.  Literally the exact sequence of things I'd suggest :).  Just keep your nutrients off 0.0, check every 7-14 days.  (honestly the phyto dosing alone will keep you off true 0, but it's important to keep an eye on the direction of the trends). How far from our current target dictates our testing

frequency -

 

out of bounds = wekly

within the min/max = every 2 weeks

 

This video is a struggle, Claude is very German :). 

 

in the list:

Monti caps

Hammers

Staghorn acro (yongei, florida)

Stylo

 

Great info from THE guy at Fauna Marin.

 

 

Ignore all the trace element stuff.  Our nano systems don't need that kind of tweaking.  Packed out coral farm or 1500L+ systems. sure, you'll never keep up without micromanaging chemistry.  Water changes will fix your trace in a nano.  If you suspect your trace is way off, ICP, then Tropic Marin A & K.  Or switch to AFR for everything.  Tinkering with individual elements, in Nano sized tanks, can kill stuff quick.  They're heavy metals.

[Llorgon]

4 hours ago, PJPS said:

Quality plan.  Literally the exact sequence of things I'd suggest :).  Just keep your nutrients off 0.0, check every 7-14 days.  (honestly the phyto dosing alone will keep you off true 0, but it's important to keep an eye on the direction of the trends). How far from our current target dictates our testing

frequency -

 

out of bounds = wekly

within the min/max = every 2 weeks

 

This video is a struggle, Claude is very German :). 

 

in the list:

Monti caps

Hammers

Staghorn acro (yongei, florida)

Stylo

 

Great info from THE guy at Fauna Marin.

 

 

Ignore all the trace element stuff.  Our nano systems don't need that kind of tweaking.  Packed out coral farm or 1500L+ systems. sure, you'll never keep up without micromanaging chemistry.  Water changes will fix your trace in a nano.  If you suspect your trace is way off, ICP, then Tropic Marin A & K.  Or switch to AFR for everything.  Tinkering with individual elements, in Nano sized tanks, can kill stuff quick.  They're heavy metals.

I'm usually pretty good at not having 0 nutrients. Most of the time it's the opposite, but that is a good point and something to watch out for.

 

Interesting video, subtitles were a real help! It's interesting he can tell what is wrong with his water based on what a specific coral is doing.

 

I placed an order for a pods seed pack. Hopefully that comes soon!

[PJPS]

13 minutes ago, Llorgon said:

I'm usually pretty good at not having 0 nutrients. Most of the time it's the opposite, but that is a good point and something to watch out for.

 

Interesting video, subtitles were a real help! It's interesting he can tell what is wrong with his water based on what a specific coral is doing.

 

I placed an order for a pods seed pack. Hopefully that comes soon!

I agree it’s fascinating that he can spot such specific chemistry problems by looking at his indicator corals.    All the way down to knowing what’s going on based on the sequence of things looking bad, and the tanks to back it up.  Definitely one of the true GOATs.

[Llorgon]

On 3/20/2023 at 4:24 PM, PJPS said:

I agree it’s fascinating that he can spot such specific chemistry problems by looking at his indicator corals.    All the way down to knowing what’s going on based on the sequence of things looking bad, and the tanks to back it up.  Definitely one of the true GOATs.

It would be interesting to always have certain corals in a tank to monitor water params. 

 

Fish are in! I also put the hammer the one clown hosts in back into this tank as well. I will need to glue it down today.

 

Tested the tank water. Nutrients were surprisingly high, but the huge Kenya trees should like that.

 

Alk: 8.6
Cal: 435
Mag: 1350
N: 6
P04: 0.34

[Llorgon]

I started adding 1ml of live phyto in anticipation of the pod seed pack to come. All the fish are doing well although the royal gramma is still adjusting... It's very shy!

 

I moved the gold hammer back into this tank as it was looking a bit sad in the other tank. It did well for a couple days then started closing up.

 

Still trying to work out a stocking list as I would like a bit more fish than 2 clowns and a royal gramma that hides 90% of the time. 

 

Throwing around the ideas of goby and pistol shrimp pair, maybe a flame hawkfish or some type of wrasse.

[Llorgon]

Tank is doing well so far. Diatoms have started so it's probably time to start thinking of adding a few snails.

 

Both hammers are doing well. The gold has bounced back well. Kenya trees are doing well as expected.

[Llorgon]

Algae and diatoms are officially underway in the tank. 

 

I'm still waiting for my pods seed pack to arrive. I did put in a snail order today. 5 ceriths, 2 trochus and 5 nassarius.

[Llorgon]

The pods seed pack I ordered came today! It's currently sitting with the lids off and will be added to the tank tonight at lights off.

 

Snails are coming tomorrow which is great since the algae is definitely starting to come!

 

I'm seeing some white edges around the Coraline on the rocks. I'm going to test the water tonight. I might have to dose some calcium.

[Llorgon]

Pods seed pack went in last night. The water was still a bit cloudy this morning.

 

Snails arrived today and are in the tank. Hopefully they start making a dent on some of the algae that is popping up. 

5 ceriths

2 trochus

5 nassarius

 

I'll see how they do and then slowly add more as needed.

[PJPS]

I think you’ll really enjoy the biology you’ve setup.  Nice food web starting, fish will be very chill with live snacks between meals. All my fish peck at pods, and still go bananas for feeding time, but there’s 0 fiestiness between them.  Prior to having “too many” pods, they’d bicker now and then, now nobody “flexes” on anyone else… 

[Llorgon]

On 3/30/2023 at 3:02 PM, PJPS said:

I think you’ll really enjoy the biology you’ve setup.  Nice food web starting, fish will be very chill with live snacks between meals. All my fish peck at pods, and still go bananas for feeding time, but there’s 0 fiestiness between them.  Prior to having “too many” pods, they’d bicker now and then, now nobody “flexes” on anyone else… 

I'm hoping that with the addition of the pods things go a bit smoother. So far, I'm not seeing any sign of them, but hopefully they will show up soon!

 

I did my first water change this weekend. Water is still a bit greenish though after adding in the pods last week.

 

I'm definitely going to need more snails. The last few days I have been cleaning the glass every day or so. Some algae is also growing on the back wall which I will have to scrape off next water change.

 

Kenya trees and the hammer corals seem to be doing well. Tonight is water testing night so I'll see how params are. I suspect I might have to start dosing come calcium for the Coraline since it's getting some white spots in it.

[PJPS]

Always dose based on testing 😊.  I like kalk, and am learning to love AFR, as you dose based on alk primarily. I do bump the mag to 1400, montis seem to like elevated mag, acros don’t seem to care.

 

The more biology (coral etc) YOU add the less nature adds for you in the form of algae and slimes 😊

[Llorgon]

Been awhile, tanks have taken a back seat to townhouse selling prep and house hunting. Really unfun stuff.

 

The tank is doing alright, some cyano has come in on the sand, lost a few snails. I've had to start dosing already, which was surprising. My 2 hammers were very unhappy for awhile and when I tested my water alk was down to 6.8. It's back up to 8 again and everything seems much happier.

 

With a pending move, I am probably going to leave the tank as is until after we are settled.