InAtTheDeepEnd's muddy puddle - brackish experiment

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Ok, it's not a reef so this is a bit of a naughty thread. But I've wanted a brackish tank for ages, so here goes. 

 

It's a 60cm/Juwel Primo 70litre, so 18 gal US. Planned stocking is 6 mollies (currently growing on a bit in my oryzias woworae fw nano) and either a knight goby or shoal of bumblebee gobies. Filtration is APS corner filter, heater cheap black box off Amazon, lights nicrew full spectrum LEDs. 

 

Why is this an experiment? Well I want to see if macro algae will tolerate an sg of 1.005, also going to try things like Java fern and elodea and see what will - and will not - tolerate a bit of salt. I've never kept livebearers, either; if and when they breed, though, they can go back into work. (I work in an aquatics store and the mollies I have right now were born in one of livebearer tanks, so I got them for nothing. They're only about 2-3 days old at the moment though so I'm going to focus on getting the tank pretty and give them a chance to get a bit bigger, before acclimating to the brackish salinity and moving them over). 

Follow on if you want, I guess. 

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Lol

One day I will remember to wash this stuff 

(TMC coarse eco sand for anyone wondering.) Filter is APS 650l/HR corner filter so quite beefy and managing it.

Plan is to add some mature media from one of my existing tanks once it's cleared and plants etc are in.... Then I start acclimating fish. 🤞

[seabass]

Looking forward to this taking shape.  Sounds intriguing; I've considered keeping a brackish tank before too.

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Clear now 

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

5x Rhizophora mangle, 3x Bruguiera gynmorhiza and 5x Clithon diadema and 5x Clithon corona ordered....

Hoping I'll just be able to bump start the cycle with some prematured media from one of my freshwater tanks, bearing in mind this is only 7ppt of salt, when the snails arrive. 

Added some codium from the reef because my nitrates in there are lower than I'd like. The elodea and pistia are not dead yet either so 🤞 😂

Mollies are eating and growing like mad in the meantime in their temporary FW digs.

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Plants doing.... Plant stuff. I hope. 

 

*Does photosynthesis dance* 

 

Codium looks not good but idk if it was even alive anyway, reef nutrients were way too low for macro 

 

 

[Ratvan]

Maybe dose some iron for the codium and try and perk it up a bit? But i think thats gone. The two things that I know can grow below 1.012 salinity are mangroves and cheato. The latter is ugly as sin and the mangroves are sloooooooooow growers, I know it's a tree but still

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

TBH I'm fairly sure its gone too - I like the look of macro but just don't get the no3/po4 levels for it in the reef.

Chaeto is hideous lol so I'd rather avoid it. Oriental mangroves (one of the species I have ordered, the Bruguiera) are actually quite fast growers; red mangroves are more medium range. But both are capable of getting absolutely massive so I don't want them growing too quickly anyway! I'm not sure the pistia is growing but the duckweed is and I have read papers of it being used for bioremediation in brackish waters, though I can't remember how brackish exactly but this tank is fairly low end so I hope they will be ok even if there is a bit of die off in the beginning as they acclimate. 

Allegedly, susswassertang can also tolerate lower end brackish so I may try that at some point down the line too, though it's technically a  gameotophyte of a freshwater fern rather than an actual plant, but can still just be propagated from cuttings anyway and does look a bit like Ulva macroalgae too. 

I don't really have the budget for more plants right now though, especially if their survival is risky. 

[Snow_Phoenix]

Yay gobies! 

I just picked up 3 on Monday for my 70G discus tank, and another 3 today. I absolutely love them, even though they're not too colorful. 

 

 

I used to have a group of 12 to 15 of them in a tank in my previous home. But those were speckled and remind me a little of yours. They were fun to watch, but quite territorial. I had to add a lot of plants and more rocks to keep the group placated. 

 

 

Forgot to add: Mine (both past & present) were FW, but I suppose they could be acclimated to brackish conditions. 🤔

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

omg GOBIES! 

 

ha ha yes I love them - brilliant lil fish. 

 

Bumblebees (one of the species I'm interested in) can be fresh or brackish for their whole lifespan and are gregarious, plus easy to source. iirc knight gobies really OUGHT to be brackish but some people do keep them FW, though they're quite aggressive to conspecifics and I'm not sure I could get just one. 

Whichever I get now I will set up another brackish tank for the other at a later date though because gobies are awesome

 

[Snow_Phoenix]

1 hour ago, InAtTheDeepEnd said:

omg GOBIES! 

 

ha ha yes I love them - brilliant lil fish. 

 

Bumblebees (one of the species I'm interested in) can be fresh or brackish for their whole lifespan and are gregarious, plus easy to source. iirc knight gobies really OUGHT to be brackish but some people do keep them FW, though they're quite aggressive to conspecifics and I'm not sure I could get just one. 

Whichever I get now I will set up another brackish tank for the other at a later date though because gobies are awesome

 

I saw bumblebees for sale today at my LFS, but their price has doubled. Also, I wasn't sure if they could live a normal lifespan in my tank since the water is rich with tannins. I do recall having a bumblebee nanotank a few years ago though! Funny little dudes. 😅

 

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Added five Clithon corona and five Clithon diadema yesterday, plus moved cycled media over from one of the 260 L FW tanks. Acclimated over the course of the day by floating the bag they were shipped in and adding 5ml brackish water every so often. Not sure how often though....I have COVID and had a temperature of 38.4°c yesterday so spent a lot of the day sleeping. But the snails were put onto the substrate at about 8.30pm and are all alive and well, and still below the water line, today.

[debbeach13]

I hope you feel better soon.

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Mangroves in today 

 

Really pleased to have some of these in the house again 

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Muddy puddle pics from today. 

I didn't actually add the planorbidae or the Physella acuta, but I'm assuming they hitch hiked in one of my FW nanos on some lemna minor, pistia stratiotes or elodea. Incidentally of those plants, only the lemna minor is growing. The elodea is green but no bigger and the pistia's roots have fallen off. I've left all specimens of both in though to see what they will do - ultimately acclimate or die I guess. 

I'm going to do a round of tests of everything tomorrow (salinity, pH, kh, ammonia, nitrites, nitrates and dissolved oxygen) or Friday then begin acclimating the mollies if all is well. 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Hmm, not ready for fish yet 

 

Salinity 1.005 

Temp 24C 

pH 6.4

kH 17dH

O2 5mg/l

Ammonia 0.25

Nitrites 1ppm ish 

Nitrates 80ppm

Phosphates 5-10ppm on FW colour chart 

 4 - 10 ppm on saltwater colour chart

 

(Fwiw, running this with tap water not RO, so not sure if the 0.25ppm Ammonia is seachem prime + chloramines in tapwater.) 

 

Have also been wondering if nitrites in brackish are less harmful than in FW, like they are in saltwater; the behaviour of my nerites, coupled with that set of parameters, implies yes. If nerites do not like your water, they leave! But none of mine have done so and are in fact very happy lil campers. 

[seabass]

3 hours ago, InAtTheDeepEnd said:

Have also been wondering if nitrites in brackish are less harmful than in FW, like they are in saltwater

Most of the studies involve fish as opposed to inverts.  I suspect that nitrite toxicity in brackish water in somewhere in between freshwater and saltwater (but is likely less toxic than in pure freshwater).  I just skimmed the following, but I think it might help:  https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-06/rhf/index.htm

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Plants are happy 

Added ceratophyllum demersum and some neritina spp. Snails. 

The hitchhiking ramshorns are breeding. 

 

Need to do another test today (got a day off! 😅) And see about acclimating my lovely little mollies. Am soaking more wood currently as I've settled on a group of bumblebee gobies in terms of stocking. 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Just tested 

 

pH 8.1

Ammonia 0-0.25ppm

Nitrite 0.25-0.5ppm

Nitrate 30ppm

 

so not quite ready yet but moving in the right direction & quite close IMO

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Mollies are in after an 8.1-0-0-10 reading and 30% WC! There's actually 4 black and 1 Dalmatian, and I drip acclimated in a bucket to 1.005 SG over several hours before netting them in. 

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Mollies are still happy. They seem to need really high dissolved oxygen levels though and I'd noticed them loitering near the surface a bit so I added an airstone and took some of the duckweed - which was totally filling the surface - out, and now they're using more of the space. Need to do a full run of tests again at some point but two of my 'disabled ' fancy goldfish have come down with bacterial infections so I'm using it multiple times a day in my goldfish room to focus on keeping their water pristine and haven't had a chance to test my upstairs tanks yet... 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

Nitrates steady at 10ppm, didn't do phosphates but fish and plants growing lots. Livebearers are greedy little shits 😂

Despite the ferocious heat in the UK right now seeing very little evaporation from the tank too. 

Bumble bees coming on the 16th ☺️

 

 

[InAtTheDeepEnd]

They're here.... There is something very special about unboxing your own fish after import haha. My assistant manager handed me a bag and said 'I believe these are yours....' and sure enough it was a bag of 15 Brachygobius xanthozonus 😍😍😍 I will admit I squealed with delight. Such gorgeous gorgeous little fish!!