Disappointed in NanoBox Duo Plus M Par Values

[Zach W]

I just rented the Apogee MQ-510 from BRS to get a sense of the par values in my tank as I start to get more and more in SPS. None the less I can away quite disappointed. To get to the numbers shown in the photos I had to turn all of my blues to 100%, white/lime 35%, moonlight 85%. My light is currently ~5" off the water line and as central in the tank as I can get it with the gooseneck mount. Has anyone else had this experience? 

 

My Tank is an IM 20

 

@DaveFason do you have any advice?

 

 

 

[Tamberav]

200-300 par is what I aim for but I don't see anything wrong with your measurements. FYI with your scape you has no rock where some of your best par is.

[William]

I don’t really see anything wrong with those par values tbh ..... 

 

I have the same light over my Red Sea Reefer nano and have had very good results/growth rates 

 

looking at the Corals you have and where they are placed with the corresponding par values, I think you are fine. This light is certainly not the most powerful,  and may not yield the absolute fastest growth rates, but imo it produces the best color possible. 

 

FYI this light is supposed to be close to the water surface (mine is about three inches from the water surface) 

[William]

 

My lights turn off at 10, so 11 hour photoperiod 

[mitten_reef]

I guess my question is, what are you trying to compare it to that is the cause for disappointment?  A Radion?  An AI Hydra26HD?  Those are much more powerful fixtures in comparison, but they also present a different sets of challenges with nano tanks. 

 

Imho, don't let the numbers distract you, watch your corals and see how they respond to the light. It seems that you may have kept your light settings pretty low prior to this PAR test. Which I guess, is a good thing to figure out now than later.  Increase the light slowly (every other week, or every few weeks?) and watch the growth spurt takes off when the light hits the sweet spot. I can tell you from a personal experience that nanobox WILL grow sps without issue in shallow tanks like ours. My tank is Fusion 30L, so same dimension with an extra foot in length.  My light settings get into the 70, 80, 90% range for all color channels (non-white, non-mint) to see good growth out of acroporas. The growth takes off at much lower light level for birdnest and Montipora’s.   

[Zach W]

1 hour ago, William said:

I don’t really see anything wrong with those par values tbh ..... 

 

I have the same light over my Red Sea Reefer nano and have had very good results/growth rates 

 

looking at the Corals you have and where they are placed with the corresponding par values, I think you are fine. This light is certainly not the most powerful,  and may not yield the absolute fastest growth rates, but imo it produces the best color possible. 

 

FYI this light is supposed to be close to the water surface (mine is about three inches from the water surface) 

 

9 minutes ago, mitten_reef said:

I guess my question is, what are you trying to compare it to that is the cause for disappointment?  A Radion?  An AI Hydra26HD?  Those are much more powerful fixtures in comparison, but they also present a different sets of challenges with nano tanks. 

 

Imho, don't let the numbers distract you, watch your corals and see how they respond to the light. It seems that you may have kept your light settings pretty low prior to this PAR test. Which I guess, is a good thing to figure out now than later.  Increase the light slowly (every other week, or every few weeks?) and watch the growth spurt takes off when the light hits the sweet spot. I can tell you from a personal experience that nanobox WILL grow sps without issue in shallow tanks like ours. My tank is Fusion 30L, so same dimension with an extra foot in length.  My light settings get into the 70, 80, 90% range for all color channels (non-white, non-mint) to see good growth out of acroporas. The growth takes off at much lower light level for birdnest and Montipora’s.   

It’s good to hear you have had success, I’m starting to really get into acropora and I have gotten some frags that the seller recommended keeping in high par (350-400) to retain color (cb Maleficent & RR Pink Floyd) and I am not able to get to those numbers unless I’m right at the water level. My Pink Floyd has already lost some of its bright yellow. Previous to today I had my blues at 80 and whites at 20 white my moonlight at 70. I was only at about 200 par at the highest rock structure. So I was thinking about biting the bullet and getting a Radion XR30. I hope to eventually get a larger tank so it would future proof my setup. 

[mitten_reef]

19 minutes ago, Zach W said:

 

It’s good to hear you have had success, I’m starting to really get into acropora and I have gotten some frags that the seller recommended keeping in high par (350-400) to retain color (cb Maleficent & RR Pink Floyd) and I am not able to get to those numbers unless I’m right at the water level. My Pink Floyd has already lost some of its bright yellow. Previous to today I had my blues at 80 and whites at 20 white my moonlight at 70. I was only at about 200 par at the highest rock structure. So I was thinking about biting the bullet and getting a Radion XR30. I hope to eventually get a larger tank so it would future proof my setup. 

Yeah, probably will be tough to get that high PAR, even with creative placement of both the  light and the coral.  Good luck 👍, post some pics of the frags, would love to see those two in forum’s tanks. Vendor pics I’ve seen, they’re beautiful.

[Zach W]

Just now, mitten_reef said:

Yeah, probably will be tough to get that high PAR, even with creative placement of both the  light and the coral.  Good luck 👍, post some pics of the frags, would love to see those two in forum’s tanks. Vendor pics I’ve seen, they’re beautiful.

Here are the frags I got! 

[Tamberav]

37 minutes ago, Zach W said:

 

It’s good to hear you have had success, I’m starting to really get into acropora and I have gotten some frags that the seller recommended keeping in high par (350-400) to retain color (cb Maleficent & RR Pink Floyd) and I am not able to get to those numbers unless I’m right at the water level. My Pink Floyd has already lost some of its bright yellow. Previous to today I had my blues at 80 and whites at 20 white my moonlight at 70. I was only at about 200 par at the highest rock structure. So I was thinking about biting the bullet and getting a Radion XR30. I hope to eventually get a larger tank so it would future proof my setup. 

 

 

I would consider a hybrid over any pure led system for a serious acro tank.

[William]

1 hour ago, Zach W said:

 

It’s good to hear you have had success, I’m starting to really get into acropora and I have gotten some frags that the seller recommended keeping in high par (350-400) to retain color (cb Maleficent & RR Pink Floyd) and I am not able to get to those numbers unless I’m right at the water level. My Pink Floyd has already lost some of its bright yellow. Previous to today I had my blues at 80 and whites at 20 white my moonlight at 70. I was only at about 200 par at the highest rock structure. So I was thinking about biting the bullet and getting a Radion XR30. I hope to eventually get a larger tank so it would future proof my setup. 

I would max out your blue channel, do you have the two channel or four channel unit? 

[yoshii]

For coral coloration, keep in mind light is not the only factor in determining coral color. Two people can keep the same frag in two different tanks and usually they vary a bit in color.

[Zach W]

49 minutes ago, William said:

I would max out your blue channel, do you have the two channel or four channel unit? 

I’m not sure.. I have a duo that I purchased last March if that helps. Here is a picture of the current settings 

[FISHnChix]

Yep all LEDs are going to be unimpressive I think in the par readings.  Just tested my 2 kessils at my current settings (only at 55 percent right now) seriously low levels...  on the left i have a narrow version that's why they are higher there 

[A.m.P]

From my understanding LED's tend to test low on traditional PAR meters and only one specifically-designed to test the levels of LED-light in particular are accurate, a LFS here has both and found about a 30% difference at worst, usually underrating the LED's by around 50 PAR. From what I've read PAR values can also be deceptive with LED lights to begin with, hotspots and extremely specific wavelengths seem to be able to bleach or stress corals at lower light levels than other forms of reef lighting (except halides which will literally give you and anything too close to them a tan)

[DaveFason]

Sorry to hear you are disappointed but I can assure you that the light, quality of light and numbers will be just fine for what you want. Bump the light down 1-1.5" and turn the royal, blue/cyan and violet up ~90-95%. 

 

There are a ton of success stories with the light. Chasing numbers can be the worst thing to do in my opinion. 250-300 should be just fine for 90% of your corals. 

 

Drop me a message and I will gladly go in and your schedule some more. 

-Dave

[Reefkid88]

I would definitely say,light is not the only contributing factor for acropora color. There are a few things. 

 

 Those are pretty damn good par values. I have used Dave's lights and DIY lights for years,well really in 10 years those are really the only 2 types of lights I have ever used and NEVER had a problem growing Acro's or even coloration. 

 

 Don't think into to much. Give them time and see what happens. Remember amino's,food and stable water condition will help yield good success with sps.  

[mcarroll]

I would suggest, like the post above, that there is more to it than light.

 

The guy you bought the corals from may have you over-focused on only one aspect of husbandry. 

 

How does your tank match his in terms of flow? How about chemistry?  How does he feed his tank? What are his nitrate and phosphate levels like? How do these things compare with your tank?