Want to 'upgrade at the back system' in 12 gal 48 litre nano cube

[Laurenscube]

Hi Everyone,

 

Looking to update the back of my nano 12 gal- 48 lite tank. I have a river reef all in one system. Been up for 2 1/2 years.

Currently housing 2 montiporas, 1hammer head, xiena, zoanthids, Green star polys.

Hope to eventually get a clam and a Trachyphyllia geoffroyi ,Challice coral

 

I have recently removed the lid and got myself an AI prime light. I have a small eheim 350 skimmer which fails every now and then...

Have coarse sponge, phosphate remover bag, carbon bag, ceramic cubes to hold bacteroa. - CAN I REMOVE ALL OF THIS IS IT NECESSARY ??? Dont like having to keep buying thing to replace like this..

 

Been thinking about changing to the following: I have 4 square sections at the back

 

 

(Have phosphate at 0.50 )
Refugium-  To grow Green hair algae - If i do can anyone recommend a little flat led strip to put over so it doesn't stick up out of my tank ?What bulb? How do i maintain when it grows? Do i just trim it when it grows etc for maintenance

 

Kalwasser reactor - I have a 48 litre tank, i have looked at other conversations saying for a small tank this could be dangerous as such small doses are needed etc

 

Automatic top off ??- Do i need one really? Since removing the lid i now add fresh ro water once a week.

 

Protein skimmer ? Previously using a eheim 350 as had a hood on the tank but now removed lid so can upgrade to hang on the back if anyone know of a small skimmer which could fit this tank

 

 

 

Thank you

 

Any advice would be great 

 

 

[Subsea]

In such a small tank, skimmers and dosing is unnecessary if you do partial water changes.  You have a lot of differrent coral.  The only chemical filtration that I would re ommend is GAC.

 

I see little need for you to reduce phosphate unless you have cynobacteria or if your SPS are showing a problem.  If you wish to reduce phosphate and grow your corals, I suggest you add nitrogen.  I use ammonia.

[Laurenscube]

Hi thank you for your reply Subsea

 

What is GAC? and how would I add nitrogen by ammonia ?

Also my colours on the coral arent great got some mushrooms over a month ago and they dont seem to look as good as they did in the shop.

[Subsea]

Granulated activated carbon.

 

https://iaspub.epa.gov/tdb/pages/treatment/treatmentOverview.do?treatmentProcessId=2074826383

 

If you don’t know what GAC is, then you may not be ready to dose ammonia.  Ammonia is pure nitrogen and lethal with high doses.  Ammonia is converted by bacteria to less toxic nitrite to a nitrate fertilizer.  Many corals and many macro prefer ammonia to nitrate.

 

You have differrent corals that are all competing for the same thing; food and light.  In their defense, to outcompete different corals, they have open warfare.  Softies conduct chemical warfare and LPS have sweeper tentacles.  For chemical warfare use GAC. 

[Orangutran]

First off, nice name---My daughter is named Lauren too!

 

Don't worry, I didn't know what GAC is until recently, just a fancy name for carbon. I do agree to run carbon, not sure about the other stuff. What's your nitrates at? 

 

Not sure what light you had previously, but the AI Prime will help with the coral colours too. I just upgraded to them as well, and noticed an immediate difference! 

[NanoRox]

I'll add my two cents since I have a similar aquarium at 14 gallons.

 

1. with respect to your filtration, the various resins etc work OK but I am finding there are better methods.  Essentials would be filter floss and carbon.  If you are looking to do a refugium I think many here can help since I do not have one.  I do run a chaeto reactor which works on the same principles (uses chaeto algae to filter nutrients).  With just those three components (chaeto, floss and carbon) water quality has been great.

           **One word about Chaeto...read up on what is necessary for it to grow and thrive.  it requires a bit more finesse than throwing resins in the filter because you have to make sure the chaeto algae receives enough nutrients to grow but still out compete the algae in your display.  It's a bit of a dance but if you just watch your tank and check your parameters regularly you can do it.  

 

2. Even though the tank is small, I personally think an ATO is worth the money.  For one it is convenient but also it helps kill two birds with one stone.  I do dose kalkwasser to maintain my alk by adding it to my top off water. You do not need a reactor...complete overkill in my opinion.  Again, you need to study a bit on how to apply kalk because some folks don't like it.  It is very simple but can also crash your tank in a nano-second if your ATO fails.   Based on the numbers in the pic you provided, water changes should be all you need but again, regular dosing has some benefit regardless because it helps prevent the up and down in the alk you could potentially see with weekly water changes.   OK...three birds...an ATO also prevents salinity fluctuations you will see if you only manually top off weekly.  Believe me, you will be shocked at how fast water will evaporate without a cover. 

 

3. skimmers just are not needed...particularly if you have a successful chaeto filter. 

[Laurenscube]

4 hours ago, Orangutran said:

First off, nice name---My daughter is named Lauren too!

 

Don't worry, I didn't know what GAC is until recently, just a fancy name for carbon. I do agree to run carbon, not sure about the other stuff. What's your nitrates at? 

 

Not sure what light you had previously, but the AI Prime will help with the coral colours too. I just upgraded to them as well, and noticed an immediate difference! 

Thanks, nitrates are o.50 tested yesterday it’s the highest they have ever been. 

The light I had came with the all in one system they were little led strips and I couldn’t grow or colour up any corals really so got the Ai. Really enjoying it ! 

[Laurenscube]

3 hours ago, Duane Clark said:

I'll add my two cents since I have a similar aquarium at 14 gallons.

 

1. with respect to your filtration, the various resins etc work OK but I am finding there are better methods.  Essentials would be filter floss and carbon.  If you are looking to do a refugium I think many here can help since I do not have one.  I do run a chaeto reactor which works on the same principles (uses chaeto algae to filter nutrients).  With just those three components (chaeto, floss and carbon) water quality has been great.

           **One word about Chaeto...read up on what is necessary for it to grow and thrive.  it requires a bit more finesse than throwing resins in the filter because you have to make sure the chaeto algae receives enough nutrients to grow but still out compete the algae in your display.  It's a bit of a dance but if you just watch your tank and check your parameters regularly you can do it.  

 

2. Even though the tank is small, I personally think an ATO is worth the money.  For one it is convenient but also it helps kill two birds with one stone.  I do dose kalkwasser to maintain my alk by adding it to my top off water. You do not need a reactor...complete overkill in my opinion.  Again, you need to study a bit on how to apply kalk because some folks don't like it.  It is very simple but can also crash your tank in a nano-second if your ATO fails.   Based on the numbers in the pic you provided, water changes should be all you need but again, regular dosing has some benefit regardless because it helps prevent the up and down in the alk you could potentially see with weekly water changes.   OK...three birds...an ATO also prevents salinity fluctuations you will see if you only manually top off weekly.  Believe me, you will be shocked at how fast water will evaporate without a cover. 

 

3. skimmers just are not needed...particularly if you have a successful chaeto filter. 

Thanks for your reply. I seem to be having quite a few swings in AlK. At the moment dosing just by adding to the top off water I pour in. I will look up ATO as when I get clams and others on my wish list I think it will be harder to control my ca and alk. Can you message me some pics of your tank ? 

[NanoRox]

54 minutes ago, laurenscube said:

Thanks for your reply. I seem to be having quite a few swings in AlK. At the moment dosing just by adding to the top off water I pour in. I will look up ATO as when I get clams and others on my wish list I think it will be harder to control my ca and alk. Can you message me some pics of your tank ? 

Yeah I think you will really like an ATO.  Pm sent.  please feel free to follow my build thread as well (link is In my signature).   Do you have a build thread we all can follow as well? 

[Clown79]

The phos and nitrates are high.

 

Waterchanges will reduce the nutrients but something is causing it.

 

The sponge in your filter may be adding nutrients as detritus gets trapped. Do you clean your chambers and vacuum sand?

 

What phos remover are you using and how often is it changed?

 

Personally I like simple systems.

 

I use very small quantities of GAC, purigen, and when needed phosguard (in tiny amounts)

 

Instead of sponges I use filter floss to trap particles, poop, food.

 

I don't use ato, top up every morning. Takes 2 seconds.

 

2 part liquid dosers are easier to use, especially in small tanks. It keeps ca and alk balanced.

[Laurenscube]

8 hours ago, Clown79 said:

The phos and nitrates are high.

 

Waterchanges will reduce the nutrients but something is causing it.

 

The sponge in your filter may be adding nutrients as detritus gets trapped. Do you clean your chambers and vacuum sand?

 

What phos remover are you using and how often is it changed?

 

Personally I like simple systems.

 

I use very small quantities of GAC, purigen, and when needed phosguard (in tiny amounts)

 

Instead of sponges I use filter floss to trap particles, poop, food.

 

I don't use ato, top up every morning. Takes 2 seconds.

 

2 part liquid dosers are easier to use, especially in small tanks. It keeps ca and alk balanced.

Never thought about my sponge, i do rinse it weekly when i do my water changes but maybe thats not enough ? I dont touch the chambers really i do remove the carbon bag monthly and re fill it with new carbon granules. Phosphate bag i change monthly also but only recently started buying the phosphate remover bags because of the phosphate raising. I believe both carbon and phosphate products are Ehiem. 

 

What brand of two part do you use? 

[Orangutran]

On 2/14/2018 at 3:16 PM, laurenscube said:

Thanks, nitrates are o.50 tested yesterday it’s the highest they have ever been. 

The light I had came with the all in one system they were little led strips and I couldn’t grow or colour up any corals really so got the Ai. Really enjoying it ! 

It's at 50? or .5?

 

How is reefing in London? I've been quite a few times, cus my wife is from there, but I have not seen 1 LFS yet. But London is humongous...

[Clown79]

On 15/02/2018 at 12:04 PM, laurenscube said:

Never thought about my sponge, i do rinse it weekly when i do my water changes but maybe thats not enough ? I dont touch the chambers really i do remove the carbon bag monthly and re fill it with new carbon granules. Phosphate bag i change monthly also but only recently started buying the phosphate remover bags because of the phosphate raising. I believe both carbon and phosphate products are Ehiem. 

 

What brand of two part do you use? 

Sponges even washed are still dirty. They are good in FW because that's the biological filter in FW but we have liverock that does that.

 

Most use filter floss which is replaced twice a week. 

 

I rinse all media bags weekly, the crap that builds on them is just another place for nutrients to develop.

 

Carbon - most recommend changing every 2-3 weeks.

Phos removers- need to be used with monitoring of numbers and replaced as numbers start rising. 

 

I like esv bionic. Very easy product to use.

[Laurenscube]

Thank all that info is really helpful will sort today !!

 

Wanted to ask is it worth keeping in the little ceramic hoops which are meant to hold the good  bacteria in there? 

Thank you

[Laurenscube]

13 hours ago, Orangutran said:

It's at 50? or .5?

 

How is reefing in London? I've been quite a few times, cus my wife is from there, but I have not seen 1 LFS yet. But London is humongous...

.5 

 

Expensive ! have to travel to the really good reef shops. I do go to one which used to be in great portland street- Aquatic design centre but they have recently moved to Battersea in south london and I live in North london so it is a bit of a trek! but worth going.

That store stocks the queens aquariums  There's a guy who works there who is a diver and when he travels he brings back some rare finds which is interesting to see now and again. I watch a lot of stuff online and youtube about tanks and in U.S  looks like there more places over there spread out. I follow reef builders with Jake Adams and he is always going around all these awesome reef exhibitions which look amazing. I am going to plan to make a trip over there at some point and hopefully go to one when I am there. Thinking of planning a road trip for it and maybe visit a few, Heard of Reef stock and Reef a palooza  Love watching videos online of other people tanks ! Its one of my favourite things to do !

[Clown79]

On 17/02/2018 at 6:01 AM, laurenscube said:

.5 

 

Expensive ! have to travel to the really good reef shops. I do go to one which used to be in great portland street- Aquatic design centre but they have recently moved to Battersea in south london and I live in North london so it is a bit of a trek! but worth going.

That store stocks the queens aquariums  There's a guy who works there who is a diver and when he travels he brings back some rare finds which is interesting to see now and again. I watch a lot of stuff online and youtube about tanks and in U.S  looks like there more places over there spread out. I follow reef builders with Jake Adams and he is always going around all these awesome reef exhibitions which look amazing. I am going to plan to make a trip over there at some point and hopefully go to one when I am there. Thinking of planning a road trip for it and maybe visit a few, Heard of Reef stock and Reef a palooza  Love watching videos online of other people tanks ! Its one of my favourite things to do !

I'm in Canada. It can get costly here too and stores are limited too. 

We call it day trips when we go shopping.

[Orangutran]

On 2/17/2018 at 6:01 AM, laurenscube said:

.5 

 

Expensive ! have to travel to the really good reef shops. I do go to one which used to be in great portland street- Aquatic design centre but they have recently moved to Battersea in south london and I live in North london so it is a bit of a trek! but worth going.

That store stocks the queens aquariums  There's a guy who works there who is a diver and when he travels he brings back some rare finds which is interesting to see now and again. I watch a lot of stuff online and youtube about tanks and in U.S  looks like there more places over there spread out. I follow reef builders with Jake Adams and he is always going around all these awesome reef exhibitions which look amazing. I am going to plan to make a trip over there at some point and hopefully go to one when I am there. Thinking of planning a road trip for it and maybe visit a few, Heard of Reef stock and Reef a palooza  Love watching videos online of other people tanks ! Its one of my favourite things to do !

Does the queen really have a reef tank, or is that a figure of speech? LOL But yeah, americans have it good when it comes to this hobby. If there are no LFS close by, they have tons of online stores! I would love to get stuff from live aquaria, and have access to fresh LR from the caribbean! If you plan on a reef related holiday, may as well plan it around macna too!

 

Your .5 nitrates should not be a concern, and it even has room to go up. As for the ceramic rings, I think it helps as long as you keep the area free of detritus. So my vote is to keep if you have nothing else to put there! 

[Laurenscube]

The queen has reef tanks at the palace they have loads of pets there, she has always been known for being an animal lover. I seen macna on the reef builder YouTube videos looks amazing. I don’t think they do anything to that sort of scale here. 

 

I never use to siphon the back chambers and did the other day and it was awful back there so hoping that will help to. Do you have experience with a chaeto refugium at all? What size tank and set up do you have ? 

[Orangutran]

On 2/22/2018 at 2:27 PM, laurenscube said:

The queen has reef tanks at the palace they have loads of pets there, she has always been known for being an animal lover. I seen macna on the reef builder YouTube videos looks amazing. I don’t think they do anything to that sort of scale here. 

 

I never use to siphon the back chambers and did the other day and it was awful back there so hoping that will help to. Do you have experience with a chaeto refugium at all? What size tank and set up do you have ? 

No way, you're saying the Queen is a reefer?!! That makes our hobby so legit now!  

 

I do have chaeto in my sump at the moment, but only for the last half year. I used to rely on GFO, but that had some undesirable side-effects, so I am trying to go a more natural route. If you've watched the BRS videos on cheato, it's conclusive that it effectively reduces nutrients. I'm not sure how much chaeto you can cram into your chambers, but some is better than nothing! If I had an AOI again, I would just have carbon and chaeto, and see where that takes me. Your nitrates and phosphate levels doesn't seem to be a problem, unless you're growing algae or your corals are suffering, so don't worry about chasing #s. I currently have a 29, check my sig. 

 

Btw, are you enjoying the snow over there!  

[Laurenscube]

23 hours ago, Orangutran said:

No way, you're saying the Queen is a reefer?!! That makes our hobby so legit now!  

 

I do have chaeto in my sump at the moment, but only for the last half year. I used to rely on GFO, but that had some undesirable side-effects, so I am trying to go a more natural route. If you've watched the BRS videos on cheato, it's conclusive that it effectively reduces nutrients. I'm not sure how much chaeto you can cram into your chambers, but some is better than nothing! If I had an AOI again, I would just have carbon and chaeto, and see where that takes me. Your nitrates and phosphate levels doesn't seem to be a problem, unless you're growing algae or your corals are suffering, so don't worry about chasing #s. I currently have a 29, check my sig. 

 

Btw, are you enjoying the snow over there!  

Snow has finally stopped its been ridiculous! Sadly our country just doesnt seem to deal with it very well! It has caused serious damage to a lot of peoples home! Fortunately hasn't really effected me. I was just house bound for 3 days.

 

Wanted to ask you some advice.

I have been considering cheato to put in the back. to control my phosphate and nitrate. However you said previouly it wasnt a problem. But something inst right in  my tank as things dont seem to be growing much and my Alkalinty is really swinging all the time!

I have a good light which I am starting to think maybe i have to low ? I have an AI prime,but getting a new chalice next week so trying to sort out my alkalinity swings before I get the chalice. Im happy to try a new piece of equipment or dose something different or twice weekly water changes. have posted a photo of my parameters. Currently im doing 10 % water changes once a week I have green star polyps and zoas which i got maybe 2 months ago and there not really growing, everything looks healthy but not really growing and the colours not amazing. I got 2  montiporas a month ago one seems to be getting bigger. Do you think the montis are due to my alkalinty swings ? I dont know for colour wise if i need to start checking potassium iodine etc and dosing with red sea colour dosing kit which I have but havent used yet .

 

Sorry for the long post 

 

[Orangutran]

On 3/6/2018 at 2:08 PM, laurenscube said:

Snow has finally stopped its been ridiculous! Sadly our country just doesnt seem to deal with it very well! It has caused serious damage to a lot of peoples home! Fortunately hasn't really effected me. I was just house bound for 3 days.

 

Wanted to ask you some advice.

I have been considering cheato to put in the back. to control my phosphate and nitrate. However you said previouly it wasnt a problem. But something inst right in  my tank as things dont seem to be growing much and my Alkalinty is really swinging all the time!

I have a good light which I am starting to think maybe i have to low ? I have an AI prime,but getting a new chalice next week so trying to sort out my alkalinity swings before I get the chalice. Im happy to try a new piece of equipment or dose something different or twice weekly water changes. have posted a photo of my parameters. Currently im doing 10 % water changes once a week I have green star polyps and zoas which i got maybe 2 months ago and there not really growing, everything looks healthy but not really growing and the colours not amazing. I got 2  montiporas a month ago one seems to be getting bigger. Do you think the montis are due to my alkalinty swings ? I dont know for colour wise if i need to start checking potassium iodine etc and dosing with red sea colour dosing kit which I have but havent used yet .

 

Sorry for the long post 

 

Wow, you alk is bouncing everywhere! No idea why, I'm no expert when it comes to these these. Your mag seems to be wacky too. Do you know what your new saltwater measures? has it stabilized?

 

As for the AI Prime, I believe your uv/violet/ry/blue can be significantly higher. A lot of people follow the AB+ setting used on the radions, do a search on it. You can probably bump it up gradually.

 

And even though I said you shouldn't worry about your nitrate/phos, by all means, you can/should still add chaeto!! 

 

Have to run!

[Laurenscube]

20 hours ago, Orangutran said:

Wow, you alk is bouncing everywhere! No idea why, I'm no expert when it comes to these these. Your mag seems to be wacky too. Do you know what your new saltwater measures? has it stabilized?

 

As for the AI Prime, I believe your uv/violet/ry/blue can be significantly higher. A lot of people follow the AB+ setting used on the radions, do a search on it. You can probably bump it up gradually.

 

And even though I said you shouldn't worry about your nitrate/phos, by all means, you can/should still add chaeto!! 

 

Have to run!

Thanks really confused on the water parameters and my montis look awful- will consider the chaeto as seems will do good and will adjust my settings as thought could be higher was tying to keep it safe.Will test my water change water see if i get any info there.

[Muffin87]

On 14/2/2018 at 1:52 PM, laurenscube said:

If i do can anyone recommend a little flat led strip to put over so it doesn't stick up out of my tank ?

The chaetomax is a quite popular compact refugium light, but may be difficult to find in the UK or Europe.
I'm in Italy and I couldn't find anyone who'd sell it here.

 

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/chaetomax-2-n-1-refugium-led-auqa-gadget-innovative-marine.html