Guys with minimalist scaping...

[MyLittleGremlin]

Well if you follow the course of the entire discussion certain topics were raised about the filtration methods used with minimal aquascaping and i was just sharing my experiences and thoughts on the subject. my apologies as I didnt mean to sound rude as it has nothing to do with your post count but i was just correcting some misleading information.

 

 

I corrected my above post with Nitrifying Bacteria so it was more specific as to type of Bacteria I was writing about.. Thank You, for pointing the error out to me. And yes, this thread has bounced around to several different filtration methods. I do understand there are more ways to skin a cat so to speak.

 

To be honest... this board I have read and read for years. And I have been so intimidated by some of the more experienced members as to some of their replies to newbies that it has been impossible for me to post.

 

Nothing like having wet feet for the first time.

[Rehype]

I did corrected my above post with Nitrifying Bacteria so it was more specific as to type of Bacteria I was writing about.. Thank You, for pointing the error out to me. And yes, this thread has bounced around to several different filtration methods.

 

To be honest... this board I have read and read for years. And I have been so intimidated by some of the more experienced members as to some of their replies to newbies that it has been impossible for me to post.

 

Nothing like getting my feet wet now.

 

Again my apologies as i didnt mean to sound as if i was jumping down your throat..these threads are open discussions so feel free to post more often

[NinjaBum]

I use macros. I do water changes like....never.

 

My rock is extremely porous though as well.

 

 

"Hey it's one of those macroalgae guys! Get out of here!"

[Dani3d]

My 75 gallons has about 45lbs of liverock, but it is a very porous rock with a lot of contact surface, the Totoka liverock.

 

Totaka rocks have a lot of twist to it so if you actually strech the surface, it would be equivalent to probably double or triple the amount of what it looks like. With dense heavy rock, the contact surface is exactly the size of the rock, so not that much.

 

So the quality of the rock is important and 100 lbs or dense rock will not compensage for 40lbs of good quality rock. I have minimal liverock in my aquascaping and it works very well as I have practically zero nitrates and I have no sump.

 

I used to have a lot of caulerpa micro algae and thought that this was what was keeping my nitrates low, but now I don't have any micro algae but my nitrates are always bearely detectible, less than 2ppm. I only do a 20% water change per month, so that's not the water change either and I don't dose.

 

Dosing vodka or other type of carbon does lower phosphates and nitrates so I am guessing that a lot of these large aquariums with lots of fish and minimal aquascaping are also using some form of carbon dosing. That work extremely well!

 

 

I've been out of the hobby for a bit but I previously understood that you needed to have enough rock to support the bacteria required for natural filtration. Many of the best looking tanks I've seen on here have minimal rock. How are you guys making that work? My first thought was to just add a bunch of rock to the sump, but I haven't noticed a lot of you guys doing that...

 

Did I miss something?

[RayWhisperer]

Nitrogen then is exported by doing regular water changes

 

Very fine powdered sand leads to failure due to it packing tightly which does not allow oxygen that is a must needed element in the sandbed for the Nitrogen Cycle to function properly.

 

My interpation as to the Key to Min Aquascaping is..... good sandbed and very porus but min rockwork for surface area for growing bacteria, strong flow to eleminate any dead spots in the aquarium so water is well oxygenated and weekly water changes to eleminate Nitrogen. Refrug with Macro/Skimmer are a plus and keep filter material in filter clean.. Then keep the BioLoad simple.

 

Seems like we apply all of the above in reefing to maintain our little tanks. Well, almost. Min Aquascaping is using less Rockwork.

As I believe Reherpes pointed out to you. It's a lack of oxygen that is needed for Denitrifying bacteria and other organisms to flourish. Once the nitrates have been broken down to nitrogen, export isn't needed. Well, at least for nitrogen. That can easily escape through a process call "off gassing". There will always be some other pollutants in need of export.

[Eole00]

the way i set up my old frag tanks to hold no rocks other than plugs and a few fish in the main display was to use a modular sump. Basically it was a sump with small tanks in it. 1 held about 30lbs of fairly tightly packed rubble rock, there was also a 5gallon tank filled with a dsb. This method seemed to work well for me since I could pull out the smaller tanks to clean the detritus every 6 months or so. Another thing that wasn’t mentioned was the effect of coralline growth on live rock, wouldn't that impede water flow to inner portions of the rock to become more anoxic thereby becoming denitrifying over time?

[Rehype]

Another thing that wasn't mentioned was the effect of coralline growth on live rock, wouldn't that impede water flow to inner portions of the rock to become more anoxic thereby becoming denitrifying over time?

 

That could very well be a factor for dense and less porous rock since it isnt as efficient at filtering. The more porous the rock is the more likely that anaerobic conditions can be created deep within the rock.

 

Example(not my pic):

[MyLittleGremlin]

I know this may sound dump... but is cooking of live rock (denitrifying process) only done to get rid of unwanted growth or critters before adding in a aquarium?

 

Do we not turn our sandbeds over to keep from getting a buildup of this decsaying type bacteria within our sandbeds where there may be no oxygen in it?

[Rehype]

I know this is cooking of live rock (denitrifying process) only done to get rid of unwanted growth or critters before adding in a aquarium?

 

Do we not turn our sandbeds over to keep from getting a buildup of this decsaying type bacteria within our sandbeds where there may be no oxygen in it?

 

 

Yes typically.

 

Yes we turn over our sandbeds to keep them oxygenated and prevent anaerobic zones in the first place... as most reefers tanks arent properly designed to accommodate a stable anaerobic sandbed. One of the most important rules of maintaining a true DSB is to never disturb it as it can crash your entire tank.

[wombat]

There is plenty of available surface area on even a small amount of live rock to effectively filter a tank.

 

If you have sufficient water flow, two fist sized chunks of porous rock would be fine for say a 10 gallon tank. Plus it leaves lots of room for coral to grow.

[Deleted User 6]

HAY GUIS AM I DOIN IT RITE?

 

[fewskillz]

HAY GUIS AM I DOIN IT RITE?

 

Almost, you've still got some room on the right and I see one gap in the center. Good first effort though.

[Deleted User 6]

[RayWhisperer]

Almost, you've still got some room on the right and I see one gap in the center. Good first effort though.

STFU, NOOB!

He's doing it perfectly. All that green hairy stuff proves it.

[Asureef]

STFU, NOOB!

He's doing it perfectly. All that green hairy stuff proves it.

 

 

+1

 

[Atela]

 

Gotta luv that face!

[jeff33702]

If that were the case, the finest sand you can get would work fine for a DSB. Southdown is REALLY fine sand. Think sugar, or finer. Every tank I've seen with a DSB made of southdown sand has failed. These are tanks of people I know. Large tanks, very large tanks.

 

My 65 had a very DSB of southdown. Lots of critters got in there though, do to the TSW rock. That tank was solid for 6 years. Only thing that killed it was a chiller malfunction.

[RayWhisperer]

Well, you've managed something I've seen failed many many times. As a matter of fact, I just helped break down a tank Saturday. Another Southdown DSB failure. Granted he was moving. However, he couldn't stop the cyano and pest algae from taking over everything. Once we started pulling out the sand, it was obvious what the problem was.

[jeff33702]

Well, you've managed something I've seen failed many many times. As a matter of fact, I just helped break down a tank Saturday. Another Southdown DSB failure. Granted he was moving. However, he couldn't stop the cyano and pest algae from taking over everything. Once we started pulling out the sand, it was obvious what the problem was.

 

It's probably because I didn't ever turn the sand by hand. I only had critters doing the work. It was VERY deep too, 3-4".

[Dani3d]

That's not very deep.

 

it was VERY deep too, 3-4".

[jeff33702]

That's not very deep.

 

I should have said that it was 3-4"(maybe a bit more in some spots) above the black trim on my tank, which was at least 1". I think that's pretty deep compared to most tanks with "DSBs".