PNW Temperate Tanks Using Marineland Commercial Systems

[AquaticEngineer]

You are driven! Great job. I've been meaning to get around to setting up an automatic feeder for a year, and you're making me feel lazy.

 

I've been trying to bust it out so that it was all ready to go by this weekend since I'm getting the stuff from Sango and going collecting. It may not be totally ready due to the lack of a skimmer, but my backup plan was to house everything in the already established tank. Should be fine, just requires more spot feeding.

[AquaticEngineer]

OK here's what I got finished on the new system, I'm getting water from the big tank moved into it as we speak

[AquaticEngineer]

Day one of vacation was freaking awesome I got to go collecting along a large rock out cropping just off the beach from the resort we are staying at in Lincoln City. Low tide was at 6:42 at a -.06 and I had sunlight until a little after 5pm then got to go out with flashlights looking.

 

Didnt find to much with the flashlights that I didnt already find during the day, but I got a bunch of hermit crabs, one purple starfish, one orange starfish, several medium sized rock sculpins, some chitons, some very cool porcelain type crabs, a few nice display rocks, and some small clumps of seagrass.

 

Didnt mess with any other macro algaes or kelp since I'm going to try just the seagrass first. Tomorrow the wife and I are going beach combing for more rocks and to get a good bucket of small gravel/sand for the seagrass tank.

 

Going to check out Siletz bay tomorrow and then hit up another area of tidepools tomorrow eveving when the tide is going out, its going to be another small minus tide so should be okay.

[Weetabix7]

I can't wait to see livestock in this system.

I think this is one of the most interesting setups on NR right now, I hope it comes together for you the way you dreamed it would.

[sango]

That seagrass/DSB cube looks great! The seagrass in my DT has been ever-so-slowly melting. I'll be *very* interested to follow your progress with that. Be sure to let us know what you learn along the way about how best to grow it.

[C-Rad]

The most successful temperate tank with macro algae that I ever saw was the one that Jon Olav (in Norway) set up and blogged about

He created a back and forth swaying water motion using opposing sets of three powerheads on a timer/wave maker. I think he learned that the wave motion was required for the macros. His filtration system didn't include any porous live rock, bio-balls, or any system to grow denitrifying bacteria. Instead I think he let the plants consume the nutrients in the water, and he used a skimmer and ozone. It made me wonder if live rock (denitrifying bacteria) competes with macro algae. At any rate, growing macro algae has some special requirements, so you'll probably need to do some research and learn the tricks before you can keep macro algae alive. Since Jon Olav did it with temperate species, he's probably the best source of info out there. He's taken his tank down, but he might be willing to answer some questions.

[animalmaster6]

That blog^^ is incredible! Do you know if he set a new tank back up yet C-Rad?

[AquaticEngineer]

Thats the plus side to the plants I'm growing, they are not macro algae at all

 

The ones I'm growing in my DSB will be semi aquatic plants that grow at the edge of the shoreline but below the high tide mark. I got 2 different species this weekend to grow.

 

The plants for the "fuge" are a type of Zostera Eelgrass that was growing attached to large rocks in the tidal zone. I'm going to try and find some eelgrass that grows on the sand flats next trip hopefully.

 

On another note, I got to visit one of old friends Ken Wingerter down at the Hatfield Marine Science Center in Newport. They have some amazing touch tanks with monster colonies of strawberry anemones and some really cool fish and inverts. The touch tank actually makes the exhibits at the Oregon Coast Aquarium look pretty weak, lol. He took me and my wife back stage and I got to check out their filter room and see the Wolf Eel he is keeping there. It was pretty cool to see Ken, hopefully I'll make it back out that way again soon and we'll get to go collecting together

 

Well all the fish and inverts I got this weekend are acclimating right now in the garage, the all made the trip back very easily. I managed to get some pretty awesome large rocks too. Right now most of the critters will be going into the big tank since it is the most stable, but I'm going to start moving a few animals over into the new system over the next few days as I put the finishing touches on some stuff.

 

I cant wait until the 30th, I'll have a few extra bucks to get the last bits I need to finish up this project and really start taking pictures and documenting its progress. Maybe I can convince Ken to do an article on my tank build for Advanced Aquarist's Online Magazine

[animalmaster6]

That would be awesome if you could get on Advanced Aquarist.

[AquaticEngineer]

Thought I would give you guys a little taste of my collecting trip in Lincoln City.

 

Pic from the room we stayed in

 

Here's a pic of the rocks near 15th st, you can drive your car right down onto the beach and walk 50 ft to the rocks during low tide.

 

More of the rocks

 

 

There is literally thousands of these nems.

 

And a nice shot of the sunset from the rocks outside of the hotel, I was still collecting but I had to stop and grab a shot of this

 

Some of the most gorgeous strawberry anemones I have ever seen were in the touch tanks at the Hatfield Marine Science Center, sorry for the crappy pic of these.

 

And finally my setups at home with everything acclimating.

 

Heres a quick peek at some of the new stuff, these guys are from the group buy.

 

More to come tomorrow once everything is feeling comfy and ready to come out and say hi

[sango]

Wow!!! Love the pics! Thanks for the update! Cool to see the stars in their new home. Now we need a close-up shot of the seagrass DT.

[AquaticEngineer]

Wow!!! Love the pics! Thanks for the update! Cool to see the stars in their new home. Now we need a close-up shot of the seagrass DT.

 

Alright I'll go snap one

[AquaticEngineer]

Ok, maybe a couple....

 

 

 

 

 

 

[sango]

Awesome! Love the rocks you have in there. Is that 2nd fish a clingfish? Ugly bas****s, huh?

 

Here in San Diego I have seen eelgrass growing in shallow water, in muddy/sandy substrate in a protected cove. I have one of those 27W Home Depot lamps myself and it worked well on my 6G planted freshwater cube, but I'm not sure it's going to be enough light to grow eelgrass in that tank...

[AquaticEngineer]

Awesome! Love the rocks you have in there. Is that 2nd fish a clingfish? Ugly bas****s, huh?

 

Here in San Diego I have seen eelgrass growing in shallow water, in muddy/sandy substrate in a protected cove. I have one of those 27W Home Depot lamps myself and it worked well on my 6G planted freshwater cube, but I'm not sure it's going to be enough light to grow eelgrass in that tank...

 

All the fish in their are tidal rock sculpins.

 

I have the same light going over my refugium on my tropical marine tank, I actually switched out the bulb that comes in them which is a 6500k bulb for a 50/50 10k/actinic bulb I got on ebay. I may still go with a small high output led light like a par38 over this tank instead. Gonna look at some led bulbs next time I'm at homedepot and see if it will do the job.

 

I've been reading through a lot of articles online about how they are trying to propagate eel grass in captivity for release back into the wild, I'll see if I can find the specs on what lights they are currently using to grow those out.

[AquaticEngineer]

Well that was easy enough to find......now understanding it all might take a couple minutes Can anyone explain to me how I would break down and compare wattage and spectrum with mol quanta?

 

I found a quick explanation but still not totally sure, if anyone wants to try and figure that out follow the link below. I'm not even going to try and do it with a 2 year old running around

http://4e.plantphys.net/article.php?ch=t&id=131

 

Light Requirements for Growth and Survival of Eelgrass

(Zostera marina L.) in Pacific Northwest (USA) Estuaries

 

Ronald M. Thom & Susan L. Southard &

Amy B. Borde & Peter Stoltz

Received: 3 December 2007 / Revised: 18 July 2008 / Accepted: 28 July 2008 / Published online: 28 August 2008

# Coastal and Estuarine Research Federation 2008

 

We developed light requirements for eelgrass in

the Pacific Northwest, USA, to evaluate the effects of shortand

long-term reductions in irradiance reaching eelgrass,

especially related to turbidity and overwater structures.

Photosynthesis-irradiance experiments and depth distribution

field studies indicated that eelgrass productivity was

maximum at a photosynthetic photon flux density (PPFD)

of about 350–550 μmol quanta m−2 s−1. Winter plants had

approximately threefold greater net apparent primary

productivity rate at the same irradiance as summer plants.

Growth studies using artificial shading as well as field

monitoring of light and eelgrass growth indicated that longterm

survival required at least 3 mol quanta m−2 day−1 on

average during spring and summer (i.e., May-September),

and that growth was saturated above about 7 mol quanta

m−2 day−1. We conclude that non-light-limited growth of

eelgrass in the Pacific Northwest requires an average of at

least 7 mol quanta m−2 day−1 during spring and summer

and that long-term survival requires a minimum average of

3 mol quanta m−2 day−1.

Full article here:

http://www.springerlink.com/content/l22360072364wt77/

[sango]

I believe that those numbers directly correspond to the PAR readings we see in the hobby. See these pages:

 

"In research on photosynthesis, when PAR is expressed on a quantum basis, it is often given the special term photosynthetic photon flux density (PPFD)." - http://4e.plantphys.net/article.php?ch=t&id=131

 

 

"There are some approximations that can be made for known light source types, however for agricultural measurements irradiance measurements are not made using a PAR sensor, the reasoning is outlined below:" ... "Not all light is useful for photosynthesis, only light in the wavelength of 400-700 nm (blue-green to red-orange)." - http://www.onsetcomp.com/support/knowledge...unit-conversion

 

If those are PAR numbers (350–550) you are going to need some intense lighting! A PAR38 LED close to the water might do the trick, but you might want to use the normal warmer spectrum bulbs (not the blue ones reefkeepers use). Home Depot in my area sells 6500k PAR38 LEDs which might work. For more information on the PAR readings for PAR38 bulbs, I would look for posts by evilc66 on nano-reef.com.

[AquaticEngineer]

Heavy Photo Update, all taken this morning. Sorry about the flash, the main tank is not lit yet.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[sango]

WOW!!! More great pics! That other starfish you collected looks cool.

[animalmaster6]

How many tanks with livestock do you have right now?

 

The tanks are looking awesome man. Everybody looks happy!!

 

I like those sculpins.

[AquaticEngineer]

WOW!!! More great pics! That other starfish you collected looks cool.

Yeah I got 2 of them, one purple, one orange. I was really hoping to find another coloration but the weather didn't really cooperate They both were feeding on mussels when I collected them so I know they are healthy and they were easy to get since they came off with the mussel so I didn't have to damage any legs. These were two of the smallest I could find and they are just under 5" from tip to tip. There were some monster ones out there

 

 

How many tanks with livestock do you have right now?

 

The tanks are looking awesome man. Everybody looks happy!!

 

I like those sculpins.

 

Right now I have the 110 gallon system fully operational and it is housing most of the animals in it.

 

The second system is up and running and I filled it with water from the 110 when I did my last water change. I have all the fish and hermits in the tank with the eel grass since they will be moved into the 50 gallon cube that is plumbed into the same sump as the eel grass tank. I have to get one more piece of acrylic cut for the bottom tray in the 50 gallon and it'll be ready to put rock and livestock into. Then the gorgs and strawberrys will be moved over into that tank along with anything that needs constant feeding. It has water running through it already, but the coolant coil and intake for the closed loop will be exposed until I can get that last piece.

 

So far the sculpins have been the only fish I have seen when collecting in the tide pools, hopefully I'll have more then just them in the future

[sango]

Good that you'll be able to separate your stars from your strawberries to prevent snacking.

 

I have a tip for you: run your fish net quickly upstream along the underside of rocks when the water is flowing out after a wave. I have used this technique to get blennies, opaleyes, and sculpins.

 

 

Also, I found that PAR38 evilc66 thread: http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?...=221433&hl=

[AquaticEngineer]

I'll try that next time I go out collecting. Hopefully by the next time I go I will have some neoprene chest waders and I can get out into the water a little further than just hopping from rock to rock

 

I tell you what though, I bought a pair of neoprene gloves and those paid for themselves 10x over this last weekend between keeping my hands warm and not getting cut up on all the mussels on the rocks.

[C-Rad]

The tanks are looking great. Thanks for the pictures. I really like the gorgonians (I've got to get one of those again!)

[AquaticEngineer]

Thought I would share a quick video I shot the other night of my tank.