What are these things eating my zoas?

[galoot]

They are all over the place at night. They are eating my zoas up.

 

HELP!!!!!!

....

[mang0ez]

ARGH! i have these as well! :S they look like they crawl around on their sides ahah.

[jsw]

Amphipods. Search around a bit. I know there are others who've had problems with them nabbing zoanthids. Never had any problems myself. They're fascinating little creatures.

[B-Dogg]

I also have them all over the place. I have one that is about twice that size. I was told they are beneficial and not worry about trapping them.

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=151844

[Longinus]

I also have them all over the place. I have one that is about twice that size. I was told they are beneficial and not worry about trapping them.

 

I name mine....Fred so far is guilt free for stealing zoas. I do think they take unattached frags and wander with them though.

[tomshannon]

Every day while collecting eggs, a farmer notices fewer and fewer chickens in his coop. One night, by chance, he shines a flashlight into his yard and sees 15 deer in the general vicinity of his chicken coop....

 

Amphipods are algavores and detritovores. Yes, they will swarm all over the place when the lights go out, but I would venture a guess with almost 100% certainty that they are NOT responsible for your zoanthid disappearances.

 

Point... there's a fox out there somewhere

[m'akoyPINOY]

i agree with tomshannon!

[YeahitsK]

Great analogy tomshannon. Nice to have you on board the site.

[Dj Orion]

Every day while collecting eggs, a farmer notices fewer and fewer chickens in his coop. One night, by chance, he shines a flashlight into his yard and sees 15 deer in the general vicinity of his chicken coop....

 

Amphipods are algavores and detritovores. Yes, they will swarm all over the place when the lights go out, but I would venture a guess with almost 100% certainty that they are NOT responsible for your zoanthid disappearances.

 

Point... there's a fox out there somewhere

 

 

I agree, pods are rarely the culprit. I have seen normally coral friendly critters (ie. sexy shrimp, hermits) go for corals when they are dead or dying however. I would check to make sure that your zoa's are in good health before ripping out all those pods (if thats even possible)

[TUDIZZLE]

I had the same problem with my zoa's. Now I am not saying they are eating the zoas but they irritate them to the point where they will not open and then they die...then the amphipods would start to eat them.

 

 

 

Imagine if those same deer stood at the door of the chicken coop, keeping the chickens from getting outside to the food and water. The chickens would die of starvation but the deer would still be the root of the problem.

 

 

A quick FW dip makes them drop right off. I took my colonies and dipped them upside down and swished them around a little bit, for less than a minute. I had 30-40 of the larger pods fall off of each colony. Now my zoas have bounced back and are multiplying like crazy.

[galoot]

Every day while collecting eggs, a farmer notices fewer and fewer chickens in his coop. One night, by chance, he shines a flashlight into his yard and sees 15 deer in the general vicinity of his chicken coop....

 

Amphipods are algavores and detritovores. Yes, they will swarm all over the place when the lights go out, but I would venture a guess with almost 100% certainty that they are NOT responsible for your zoanthid disappearances.

 

Point... there's a fox out there somewhere

 

I have to disagree 100%. I saw them with my own eyes. They were all over them. Their heads were buried into the zoas. Then tell me why they are doing this? If something else is eating the zoas, what are they doing? Because it sure looks like they are munching on them. So far it is only on one type of zoa. The others haven't been touched. But earlier I had GSP that were getting eaten more and more everyday until it was all gone. I never found the perp then.

 

What do you think is eating my corals? A rouge snail or something else?

[tomshannon]

Tudizzle,

 

I fully appreciate your situation, and do not doubt that dipping your zoanthids resulted in better growth, but:

 

I've grown tons of zoanthids side by side with my Convolutriloba cultures and in a very amphipod-rich system. The amphipods generally come out at night leaving a full day of pester-free feeding for the zoanthids.

 

Systems containing a good population of amphipods will have amphipods under every rock, coral, clam etc., as well as in every nook and cranny (please don't keep your english muffins in the tank). Performing a freshwater dip on just a portion of everything in the tank will barely make a dent in the overall population.

 

It is more likely that your zoanthids had a tiny parasite that is specific to zoantids only. Dipping your zoanthids, while killing several amphipods, probably wiped out the parasites as well.

 

Just my opinion

[Md's Finest]

I have to disagree 100%. I saw them with my own eyes. They were all over them. Their heads were buried into the zoas. Then tell me why they are doing this? If something else is eating the zoas, what are they doing? Because it sure looks like they are munching on them. So far it is only on one type of zoa. The others haven't been touched. But earlier I had GSP that were getting eaten more and more everyday until it was all gone. I never found the perp then.

 

What do you think is eating my corals? A rouge snail or something else?

I think I have some too. Mine look like long fleas with long antena and I have brown and lime green ones. They are definately eating my zoas too.

[jsleep]

I have to disagree 100%. I saw them with my own eyes. They were all over them. Their heads were buried into the zoas. Then tell me why they are doing this? If something else is eating the zoas, what are they doing? Because it sure looks like they are munching on them. So far it is only on one type of zoa. The others haven't been touched. But earlier I had GSP that were getting eaten more and more everyday until it was all gone. I never found the perp then.

 

What do you think is eating my corals? A rouge snail or something else?

 

Have you checked closely for nudis? The nudis blend right into the zoa. Zoa spiders may also be a culprit, and like nudis, they blend right in.

 

Like someone said, it could be that the zoas were on their way out leading to a free meal for the pods; much like bristle worms with dying snails, etc.

[TUDIZZLE]

All I know is what has worked for me and what the results were.

 

 

Many people have had the same experiences and shared them here as well.

 

I FW dip all new peices, much longer, so any parasite would have already been dealt with. Plus the duration of the second dip would most likely not effect parasites that attack zoas.

 

I do agree that having pods is healthy, but if a large group move into a zoa colony they can easily irritate them to the point where they won't open.

[tomshannon]

Galoot,

 

Amphipods tend to graze in areas where low water flow results in the accumulation of detritus, like around the bases of rocks and in between zoanthid polyps. I still doubt that they are eating your zoanthids unless the polyps are already necrotic.

 

Try this, if possible: Get a jar and some screen. Take a small clump of zoanthids and remove the amphipods by hand (no FW dip). Place the clump in the jar, put the screen over the jar with a rubber band, and place the jar in your tank. If the zoanthids still die, you have a parasite. If they bounce back, then I'm temporarily stumped.

 

As to what the parasites, or other predator may be, zoanthid ecology is not my specialty, but I'm sure someone out there may know.

 

Best of luck.

[chuckfullservice]

Just a thought I'm not really sure but I think I read some were isopods are not good. I cant remember if they kill fish or corals or both!

Do some research on them !

[TUDIZZLE]

either way dip..........then you can decide for yourself who the culprit is

[galoot]

either way dip..........then you can decide for yourself who the culprit is

 

 

the dip will only kill any bacteria right? the pods are every where. dipping would only get rid of the bacteria correct? the pods are not going to stop doing what they are doing.

[Diatome]

It's interesting how many posts you get with the I found bugs lead-in. Year after year.

 

Look, the pic is of a pod. Pods are beneficial. If anything, they may get eaten by the zoas. I have sponges, tunicates, pods and 4 different kinds of worms living with my zoas. The tunicates are the only thing in that group that has ever cost me any zoas. Cymothoa isopods are the only ones you will find any horror stories about and that is with fish. Amphipods and isopods are natural parts of the reef. The spiders, crabs and sundial snails are definite threats. A fungus or parasite is probably your culprit. I watched someone use a soft toothbrush on a zoa colony and they opened up and they had been written off. As much as you see, there are many things you will probably never see on the rocks and such. I tore down a tank after three years and was amazed what came out of that tank. Many things that were never added, except as hitchikers.

[TUDIZZLE]

the dip will only kill any bacteria right? the pods are every where. dipping would only get rid of the bacteria correct? the pods are not going to stop doing what they are doing.

 

 

FW dip will not hurt your zoas it will cause the pests to drop off almost immediately. If its an unseen nudi it will be effected as well.

 

 

make sure you use a ph buffer so that your FW ph matches your tanks

[phases]

Systems containing a good population of amphipods will have amphipods under every rock, coral, clam etc., as well as in every nook and cranny (please don't keep your english muffins in the tank).

 

I like your style!

[Sexy Shrimp]

Another analogy:

 

Lions kill your zoas (fungus/zoa pox/nudi) and pods clean up the carcass (hyenas). Just because you see a hyena eating a springbok doesn't mean that it killed it (was probably a female lion or a wimpy cheetah - they always lose their kills).

 

The pods are clearing up dead/dying zoas. If your zoas are infected they are probably doing you a huge favour.

 

Fungus - like a black (or grey/white) dusting

Zoa pox - little white dots on the outside of your zoas

 

Check these out...

 

Also FW dips are next to useless. Try a lugols liodine dip instead...

[Fade2White12]

I say this all the time - regardless of whether you believe amphipods are capable of actively preying on

corals or not, large populations of amphipods will not allow a sick or dying coral to recover on its own. Once any type of deterioration occurs, amphipods will actively prey on that living thing, making all attempts at restoring its health impossible unless through quarantine.

 

But regardless, most amphipods are not strictly herbivorous or detrivorous. They are opportunistic feeders like most Malacostraca members. While in the wild most amphipods are detrivores/herbivores, when there is less predation resulting in increased populations and more competition for food, as well as less of that natural food and smaller size of habitat, active carnivorous behavior by these creatures is easily possible.

[Sexy Shrimp]

Once any type of deterioration occurs, amphipods will actively prey on that living thing, making all attempts at restoring its health impossible unless through quarantine.

 

Exactly!

 

Find the cause of the inital deterioration (repeated lugols dip to treat) and QT (even if it's just in a jar as mentioned earlier) and your zoas should recover (been there).

 

Watch out for your other zoas too - if you have an infestaion of some sort you don't want it to spread...

 

 

EDIT: Post a pic of your zoas so someone could offer more of a clue what the initial problem was