Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Hi everyone, Obviously your here to see what the title is all about so here it goes.... I want to keep TWO mandrians in a 10 gal.!!!! LOL, your thinking, now way. But first let me explain what my system will consist of (I know you still won't agree). Ok, I will have a 10 gal., obviously, probably around 2-3 inches of sand. Still not sure how much rock I plan to have since I need to find what pieces of rock will fit in there..... Rock to me is more of a spure of the moment deal. I also plan to have a 10 gal sump. I know the sump dosn't do anything for the pod. population. Now, comes the part that makes keeping even ONE mandrian alive possible. I will have two 10 gal. fuges. 38 watts of light on each fuge so that I can speedily grow macro. So, I guess I'll have around 10 pounds of rock per 10 gal. fuge (If that's too much tell me). So, now you know my set up, not into great detail but if you need to know more ask away. See the thing is I'd be chicken to add even ONE mandrian, so I'll want to test my stystem. What fish eats as many pods as a mandrian, I'd like to get a captive raised fish for this job if possible. Also to raise my pod population I will feed live phyto and live rotifres. Maybe even live brine (dosn't help pods) if I ever get a culture of that going. So, what do you think?? Luke Link to comment
chvynva916 Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 mmm...30 gallons even in the same place is probably not enough for one mandarin. Spread over three tanks for two manderins, I think you just answered your own question. I have a better suggestion. If you really want a manderin, find one that accepts food from you (some you can find if you're lucky). I found one that actually ate flake food (8 years ago though). It lived for about a year and a half (I also wasn't a very diligent reefer back then as I was only 14). They are some of my favorite fish. I highly recommend them if you can feed them one way or another, but otherwise don't bother. Link to comment
~_~ Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Scooter Blennys eat pods just like Mandarins...but Scooters are Dragonets just like Mandarins, so I'm not sure if there eating habits are any different. btw, I have a scooter blenny in my 20g. He is doing "ok". Even though he eats pods and prepared foods, he is picky about what he eats. It has to be the right size for it to eat it...Too big a pod and he won't/can't eat it. Also since they sleep at night, some of the pods have to be visible during the day. Even with a big fuge crawling with pods, the pods are still transfered very slowly to the main tank. I think the only possible way to keep the Mandarin alive would be if you manually transfered the pods to the main tank or if it ate prepared foods. Link to comment
jflysmooth Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 my god. someone kill this man before he kills innocent fish. Link to comment
firstkill Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 i dobut you will have enough food for even 1 mandarin over 7mnths +.... and good luck finding 2 that will even get along in a 10 gallon tank. ~fk Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Author Share Posted June 17, 2003 LOL Jfly!!! Anyway, so chyvna916, your saying that people who are 14 of age ARE NOT diligent reefers. I find myself quite diligent, lol even more now since it's summer (out of school). By the way, I'm 14 on my way to 15 in 6 days. Ok, back to mandrians, yes your right Jfly but if you notice I want to test my system befor I even attempt ONE mandrian. I don't know I would try a scooter, they are really cool and do eat like mad, I was kind of hopeing for like trying three dragon sifters because I know they will lower your pods. But at the same time completely cover your precious corals. : Those dirty scoundrals. Actually, pods are put into the tank quite quick like. I'm sure I'd get quite a few pods in the main tank each day. Maybe around 100 or so a day. I still can't seem to find how many times a female pod will release eggs and how many eggs are released at a time. I know they have a metamorphosis stage (embryo-adult) that's like 10 day. Don't mandrians eat LIVE brine shrimp?? Luke Link to comment
jojopus Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 ive never seen a mandarin swim out into the water column to eat before so i doubt it. they always eat off of the bottom. in other words anything you attempt to feed them had better be on th substrate and live brine shrimp dont sit on the substrate.....just dead ones. Link to comment
Korbin Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 I don't think a manderin would do well in a 30 gallons any way you slice it. Instead of creating a complex system, why not save up for a bigger tank? Link to comment
FlyGTI Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 I've got to agree with the rest of the contributors here. You won't be able to get away with it. One would even be too many. I understand your desire to keep them, as they're simply gorgeous fish, but it just won't happen in a tank that small, even with two refugiums. I've got a plan to get a mandarin for my 90 gal. softy reef, but I won't even attempt it until the tank has had such time to become sufficient to support a fish like that. I'm guessing that I'll be able to confidently add one next June, if I'm lucky. Simbo, they're a great looking fish, but in this case (all cases, to be truthful), you need to put your wants away and put the needs of the species in their place. If you can't provide for them properly, you shouldn't endeavour to keep them. Be a good steward of the hobby. Keep something else. You'll be able to find plenty of interesting and beautiful specimens to keep in your tank. But do the favor for the fish...don't get one unless you can properly care for it. Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Author Share Posted June 17, 2003 But I have seen a mandrian swim clear across the front glass of my 36" long aquarium...... I belvie I could get a mandrian to eat out of the water column. LOL, maybe right befor I buy them I should bring in some newly hatched brine and dump it in there.... see what they do. What do you think . I doubt the fish store would be too pleased but at least I'd know if they like bbs. Right?? I will take every precaution befor I buy one. Who wouldn't. LOL I'm 14 I can get away with crap like that. I had, when I was 11, a mandrian that was so... cool. I remember he would sit on the sand in my 38 with his belly proped up to the glass. I don't know if he would have ever survied off of my pod population. I never got to find out. One morning I woke up to see that my mandrian had one eye.....:*( I don't remember crying but that's what my dad said. Of course my dad offered to end his misery, so I let him after I screamed, kicked, and pounded on the floor for a littlle. LOL Anyway. I think I could get two mandrians to eat live brine. I hope. FJ, a male and a female mandrian wouldn't have too much trouble living in the same tank. Am I right?? Luke Link to comment
chvynva916 Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Simbo, I didn't mean that 14 are always irresponsible about their reefing, I just meant that I was when I was that age. Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Author Share Posted June 17, 2003 LOL, don't worry, I know what you ment..... Link to comment
jflysmooth Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Regardless, don't do it. Don't even try one. Think of the fish, kid, think of the fish. Your primary duty when you bring one of these animals into your life is to take care of it in the best way possible. There are hundreds of other fish you could put into a 10 gallon tank that wont starve to death. Not only that, but if you're going to have 4 10 gallon tanks attached to each other, and you're going out of your way to get crazy pod growth, why would you leave one of them as just a sump? I swear, even the title of your thread... you know its stupid, don't be a "'tard." You're getting into the situation KNOWING that you'll be starving the fish. If you're such a mature and diligent reefer at 14 going on 15 then act like it. Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Author Share Posted June 17, 2003 Jfly, thanx for that post. : You done talked me out of it...... Thanx. Just what I was looking for. I have a 75 gal. in my room that I might try one in after I order TONS of rock from Tampa Bay Saltwater. Luke Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Author Share Posted June 17, 2003 Wiat, one last thing Jfly, what dose carpe diem mean again. Sorry, brain fart. Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 17, 2003 Author Share Posted June 17, 2003 LOL, ment to write back to your (I guess) suggestion Jfly. First off, I have 4 10's just because I have 4 of them in my shed outside. Second, I want one as a sump so that in the future I can add a skimmer (hate to use them takes out live phyto) and what nots. I don't want to waist any room in my fuges. That's all. If you disagree on my reasons please let me know, I want to hear it. Luke Link to comment
wetworx101 Posted June 18, 2003 Share Posted June 18, 2003 IMO, mandarins shouldnt be kept in anything less than 90gallons, maybe half of this if using a good size fuge (then tank+fuge should equal 90g)...or from another standpoint 90lbs of LR per mandarin. And the tank should be VERY established, i.e. 6 months old or more, for a good pod count to be established. Hey chvynva916 & simbo, I remember when I was 14, and I had already gained an astonishing amount of info (according to my local aquarium club at the time) since I had started keeping fish at age 10. But now, at almost double 14, I can in no way imagine that my experience and knowlege and diligence were anything near what they are now...heck, back then I would forget to feed the fish if the A-team was on TV... he he. Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 18, 2003 Author Share Posted June 18, 2003 I always thought that the mandrian rule of thumb used the amount of rock you had not how many gallons of water you have. Am I right?? I think that the pods would much rather have 90 pounds of rock that they can attach their peraeopods to rather than 90 gallons of water to swim in. Which the pods in our tanks don't do too much of. You'd have to get the amphipoda sand flees for swimming pods (which I feed to my fish, they love em because they swim until they get eatin). So, we're back on dilligence again...... First off, everyone is different. Second, my tank is my first priority over EVERYTHING. Yes, I'm psychotic when it comes to reefing. Sorry. I spend many many hours a day on my tanks. I have just about all day to fiddle with them, besides the few hours I take elsewhere to earn money only to support my addiction. Some examples are like me helping some peoples move today. Earned $40 I now have enough to get those PC's. Yeah. Anyway, my dad is a manrine biologist, so he would hate to see my tanks unattended and if I didn't touch them from more than a week they would have to go. I don't forget to feed my fish, how can I. I have a whole wall full of phyto, rotifer, and pod cultuers, a 38 gal. and a 75 gal. in my room. So, where's the forgetting to feed them. I can harldy keep my mind off of them. Except for those times when I'm with my girl friend (well then you know wehre my mind is then). Just my say on diligence. Luke Link to comment
Zontar Posted June 18, 2003 Share Posted June 18, 2003 I think you could keep a mandarin in a smaller system, if you have a larger mature system with a whole wack of live rock (say at least 90 pounds) and you constantly rotated the rock, so that there was always a fresh supple of pods in your tank. At the LFS I work at we keep our mandarins alive by constantly rotating the rock in their tank. Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 19, 2003 Author Share Posted June 19, 2003 Or, if you cultured your own pods and could dump in 100 or more each day without a problem...... Luke Link to comment
maroonclown Posted June 21, 2003 Share Posted June 21, 2003 Don't lose hope in keeping the mandarins, Simbo18. I had a spotted draggonet, and it did extremely well for 3 months ( I killed it by over stocking the tank). I bought it from my local Petco. I bought it because it had been at that store for a month and a half, and was eating frozen brine shrimp. The display tank had (and still has) no live rock. She spent the day grazing over the LR, and ate brine shrimp when I offered it in the evening. By the way, being 14 has nothing to do with skill level. I am 14 as well. Also, back to mandarins, they have been known to spawn in captivity, but no one has raised the eggs successfully ( then again, I’m pretty sure someone somewhere has had a mandarin that survived to adulthood in the aquarium). I think you should go for it. And you don’t need all those tanks. I had mine in a 20 gallon long with no sump or refugium producing pods. To those of you that are saying don’t try this with a 10 gallon tank, I say go ahead, but don’t try a Moorish idol in any size tank ( see how absurd that is, every fish is different. Moorish idols are the perfect example. Most never survive shipping, but some individuals are hardier than damsels after they begin feeding). Though, Simbo18, I do have one suggestion. You should do this in a 15-25 gallon tank ( 20 long is best in my opinion). Good luck! Link to comment
Simbo18 Posted June 21, 2003 Author Share Posted June 21, 2003 Thanks maroonclown, it's about time someone's on my side. But the thing is that I would actually need more tanks to succesfully keep a mandrian or mandrians without cultureing pods to dump in every day. Also, you got lucky with your mandrian eating brine, frozen at that. I, on the other hand might not get a mandrian that has a brain sizzled by the cyanide used to catch them. In other words your mandrian was stupid. No offense. I am still leaning to keeping mandrians in a 10 gal. I have to see how this pod cultureing goes. I havn't seen any new pods just yet and I'm on day 3 of the culture but the water is clearing..... which is good. When I say that the water is clearing that means it was a bright green but is less green and more clear. The green comes from the live phyto that I put in there for them to feed off of. Hey, maroon, how do you afford to stay in the hobby (just curious) Link to comment
caja Posted June 21, 2003 Share Posted June 21, 2003 Originally posted by maroonclown I had a spotted draggonet, and it did extremely well for 3 months ( I killed it by over stocking the tank). I bought it from my local Petco. :*( X) I can't take it anymore. My head hurts thinking about this whole situation. Link to comment
maroonclown Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Well, I don't care if the animal is stupid, as long as it's smart enough to not attack me ( trust me, my maroon clown fish is too stupid, and killed the mushroom he was hosting in, plus, he attacks me, and I've occasionally bleed from his bites). As far as affording the hobby, I spent almost all of my money on the hobby. The problem is, I don't have a job! I am thinking about getting one at my LFS (good store) or at the new PETCO being put in. I figure as well as a paycheck and first dibs on fish and equipment, I may get some employee discount. It is very hard to come up with the money, so I do several things to save money. First of all, DIY as much as you can. It is cheaper to build a CPR bak-pak than it is to buy one. Use Southdown Sand if you can find it. Look in the classified ads in the newspaper, and especially because of FINDING NEMO, many people that bought tanks and failed will be trying to get rid of the stuff (for example: 25 gallon “NEMO” tank with everything for sale, $50 OBO, call###-#### ask for Aquarium Failure jr.) I don’t mean to sound mean by the way. Also, when stuff goes on sale, stockpile it ( but only if it ads up to less than or equal to the original sales cost) I have 4- 2.5 gallon aquariums that I got on sale for I think it was $1.50 each! Try to find your stuff through wholesalers, most will sell 1 or 2 items to directly to hobbyists. Plus, my mom love my tanks, so a good amount of financial support comes from my parents. Plus I get money for good grades on report cards, so it’s incentive to work you butt off in school. Hope that helps, but how do you afford them? Link to comment
~_~ Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 I thought someone would have photoshopped a mandarin in a police uniform by now. Or at least a hat and billy club. Link to comment
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