Cyano

[Helfrichs Chick]

There is a coraline that looks that color, but I dont think thats what this is. Honestly your rock is ALL live rock right? Not lace rock. Some reason I am thinking heavy metals... no reason just think that. Doesnt look like cyano at all and doesnt look like diatoms to me. Hum.... this is a good one. Can you give me the complete perameters on your tank? Including photoperiod.

 

Oh I just read its on your sand.... I REALLY hate to tell you this but it does look like the Dinos I had. Man I HOPE not. Does it shrink up at night, and look like tiny rust colored dots??

 

Whats you feeding schedual like? Is the water you rusing for TO and WC GOOD water, as in no phosphates or silicates? What type of food are you feeding? Read the lable some have high levels of phosphorus which makes the food good for the fish but bad for algae blooms. We will get it nailed just need to keep working at it. Might be a good idea to switch to more natural foods, like frozen mysis and stay away from flake and pellets as they put lots of gunk in the water. Also when you feed your frozen foods your not adding the "thaw out" liquid right?

[spanko]

Bown sturr looks like diatoms to me from the pic. Some good coralline and some green maybe hair algae. Nothing looks too bad or out of the ordinary to me.

I agree with H..CHICK cut down on the feding and lighting for a whil and see what develops. Keep up with the water change schedule.

[Helfrichs Chick]

I do not think its diatoms. Looks too dense. IMO

[roxy25]

There is a coraline that looks that color, but I dont think thats what this is. Honestly your rock is ALL live rock right? Not lace rock. Some reason I am thinking heavy metals... no reason just think that. Doesnt look like cyano at all and doesnt look like diatoms to me. Hum.... this is a good one. Can you give me the complete perameters on your tank? Including photoperiod.

 

Oh I just read its on your sand.... I REALLY hate to tell you this but it does look like the Dinos I had. Man I HOPE not. Does it shrink up at night, and look like tiny rust colored dots??

 

Whats you feeding schedual like? Is the water you rusing for TO and WC GOOD water, as in no phosphates or silicates? What type of food are you feeding? Read the lable some have high levels of phosphorus which makes the food good for the fish but bad for algae blooms. We will get it nailed just need to keep working at it. Might be a good idea to switch to more natural foods, like frozen mysis and stay away from flake and pellets as they put lots of gunk in the water. Also when you feed your frozen foods your not adding the "thaw out" liquid right?

Helfrich’s Chick

 

I will give you parms when I get home. Right now my photo period is long ( some of my sps suffered with the lights off) so I am trying to revive them and get some color back.

 

I turn lights on around 5:30 and turn them off around 12 am or 1am

 

Yes it’s gone at night the reappears as the lights come on. The more light the darker and more its spreads.

 

As for feeding I have ORA pellets for the clowns and I feed cylopeeze. I barely feed them I forget and some times they get feed every three days. ( I have lots of pods )

 

I use arrowhead distilled water for WC and TO. I don’t test for phosphates only because I know the test are not accurate I just run the phosguard in media sock between the sump baffles. ( took it out on Sunday and now more algae is growing) so I know the seachem might not be the greats phos ban but it is doing something.

 

I have chateo and grape caluplara and another type of Caluplara in the sump along with more live rock.

 

Today I plan to take the rock out of the sump and put some sand in there for the Caluplara to grow on and place the grap cap in between the rocks so it can start to root on the rocks.

[Helfrichs Chick]

Honestly babe it seems like you've got everything right (rare lol). I also use the ORA pellets and find it is GREAT food, and very clean (relatively). I do think that you have a pretty good case for Dinoflagellates. It does sound like thats whats going on and IME the only way to battle it is reduced photoperiod and no food. The macros will help and probably why your tank is not completely covered. Even if you have to take all your SPS out and I would recommend taking the fish out too, as dinos can be toxic to fish, and especially humans. Only certain species thou. From what I have read and been through in the past there are many species and some are easy to eradicate and some not. I think the key here is that it spreads quickly with the light being on. Same as what happened to me. Just sounds all too familiar.

 

As for phosphates, even thou the tests (I use Salifert) can really be inaccurate but IMO if you get a reading at all you can be assured that its way too high. I call it a ball park reading not a pin point reading. No tests are 100% IMO.

 

The only way to battle this crap is to keep as much food from it as possible. This means no light and no fish food. I feel your pain for SURE however dont take my word on it 100%. I am not there and cant see it personally. My suggestion..... do you have a GOOD LFS near you with a microscope? I did and they diagnosed it for me. If you do not you may also be able to take it to a major college, or call the Bio department and ask a professor to ID it, usually they love doing this kinda stuff lol. Also look on Wet Web Media, as Bob Fenner is usually pretty helpful with this stuff. I have his email if you need it. Let me know what you decide to do and I Will keep looking for info to help. I think the best thing to do presently is to get a positive ID, then we can figure out methods to get this stuff gone and your tank all sparkly again! Keep in mind I got rid of it and with work you will too..... there IS HOPE!!!!

[roxy25]

Honestly babe it seems like you've got everything right (rare lol). I also use the ORA pellets and find it is GREAT food, and very clean (relatively). I do think that you have a pretty good case for Dinoflagellates. It does sound like thats whats going on and IME the only way to battle it is reduced photoperiod and no food. The macros will help and probably why your tank is not completely covered. Even if you have to take all your SPS out and I would recommend taking the fish out too, as dinos can be toxic to fish, and especially humans. Only certain species thou. From what I have read and been through in the past there are many species and some are easy to eradicate and some not. I think the key here is that it spreads quickly with the light being on. Same as what happened to me. Just sounds all too familiar.

 

As for phosphates, even thou the tests (I use Salifert) can really be inaccurate but IMO if you get a reading at all you can be assured that its way too high. I call it a ball park reading not a pin point reading. No tests are 100% IMO.

 

The only way to battle this crap is to keep as much food from it as possible. This means no light and no fish food. I feel your pain for SURE however dont take my word on it 100%. I am not there and cant see it personally. My suggestion..... do you have a GOOD LFS near you with a microscope? I did and they diagnosed it for me. If you do not you may also be able to take it to a major college, or call the Bio department and ask a professor to ID it, usually they love doing this kinda stuff lol. Also look on Wet Web Media, as Bob Fenner is usually pretty helpful with this stuff. I have his email if you need it. Let me know what you decide to do and I Will keep looking for info to help. I think the best thing to do presently is to get a positive ID, then we can figure out methods to get this stuff gone and your tank all sparkly again! Keep in mind I got rid of it and with work you will too..... there IS HOPE!!!!

 

 

there is another pic

 

I don't have no where to put my sps or fish . there must have to be another way ?

 

Here are my parms

 

CA 400ppm

Alk 7.5

ph 8.0-8.1

ammonia 0

nitrite 0.5

nitrate 1

[Caesar777]

This isn't exactly an ADVANCED topic. Feed less, do more water changes, get a good protein skimmer (I'm sure not reading the entire thread just to see if and which you have...no mention in the first post). Test your phosphate, I'll bet it's through the roof.

 

And RowaPhos granules are THE best phosphate media, PERIOD. But they only pull phosphate, don't cure the problem: too much organics. Cyano grows from using nutrients in your tank, not light. It's not a true algae but a bacterium. ChemiClean is basically an antibiotic, and will not only kill fish and/or corals but also nuke your bacterial populations. Treat the problem, not the symptom.

 

Also, while cyanobacteria can be red, pink, brown, black, green, and probably other colors, that could well be dino's. They look like a bunch of tiny speckles, and can be a b!tch to get rid of. LIMIT NUTRIENTS--that's the key. BIG water-changes, RO water only, good skimming, and keep up on the maintenance once they're low/gone.

[Maeda]

there is another pic

 

I don't have no where to put my sps or fish . there must have to be another way ?

 

Here are my parms

 

CA 400ppm

Alk 7.5

ph 8.0-8.1

ammonia 0

nitrite 0.5

nitrate 1

 

 

Another thing to try that helps that I forgot to mention.... Bump you're alkalinity to around 9-10dkh.

[roxy25]

This isn't exactly an ADVANCED topic. Feed less, do more water changes, get a good protein skimmer (I'm sure not reading the entire thread just to see if and which you have...no mention in the first post). Test your phosphate, I'll bet it's through the roof.

 

And RowaPhos granules are THE best phosphate media, PERIOD. But they only pull phosphate, don't cure the problem: too much organics. Cyano grows from using nutrients in your tank, not light. It's not a true algae but a bacterium. ChemiClean is basically an antibiotic, and will not only kill fish and/or corals but also nuke your bacterial populations. Treat the problem, not the symptom.

 

Also, while cyanobacteria can be red, pink, brown, black, green, and probably other colors, that could well be dino's. They look like a bunch of tiny speckles, and can be a b!tch to get rid of. LIMIT NUTRIENTS--that's the key. BIG water-changes, RO water only, good skimming, and keep up on the maintenance once they're low/gone.

 

I see you didn't read the whole post again

[roxy25]

Another thing to try that helps that I forgot to mention.... Bump you're alkalinity to around 9-10dkh.

 

 

I will raise my alk

 

ok I did a search over at RC on dinos and I am glad to say its not dinos it is cyano. I saw some pics of dinos and thats definately not what I have

 

do you think my sps will be ok if I cut the phot period to 5 hours or even 4 ?

[SeeDemTails]

A Polyfilter did wonders for killing off the HA and cyano in my 10 gal.

 

I use a gatorade bottle phosban reactor in my other tanks.

[roxy25]

A Polyfilter did wonders for killing off the HA and cyano in my 10 gal.

 

I use a gatorade bottle phosban reactor in my other tanks.

 

 

hmmm how would I make a gatorade phosban reactor any links? I will do a search also thanks

[Helfrichs Chick]

This isn't exactly an ADVANCED topic. Feed less, do more water changes, get a good protein skimmer (I'm sure not reading the entire thread just to see if and which you have...no mention in the first post). Test your phosphate, I'll bet it's through the roof.

 

C~ I would personally classify dinos as an advanced topic. Not like were talking about pods here. So thanks for that. I dont see why you would post if you dont want to read the thread, doesnt make any sence to me. Sorry no offence. ALSO dinos can use up phosphates so fast that they will always test 0, so testing does no good, it will not show "through the roof".

 

Roxy: Back to the topic, Maeda said to raise your ALK... I have also read that however I would do some research first. I personally think Dinos just have to grow themselves out. I mean when I had them that entire year, I was running short photoperiod, and didnt add any food, and this was on a tank that never had an algae issue, and tested perfect time and time again. Nothing helped. While I will not say 100% (cause im not there) that you have dinos they do look exactly like what I had. If you dont have the option to take the corals out (to do reduced light periods) then just try to syphon the dinos off the sand, and keep the water as clean as possible. They will eventually fizze out. Did you look up wet web media, Fenner is very helpfull.

[Phixion]

Goodness, after reading this thread I just realized that I too have dinos in my tank unfortunately... =/ I'm going to be tearing down my tank in the next couple of weeks to move to a new apartment, I figure I can clean off a lot of the dinos at that time. Would they re-grow back after doing this, or would that be a pretty sure-fire way to get rid of it? I saw it growing over the past several weeks and kinda wondered what it is, but never gave too much thought to it. I haven't specifically tested my params lately, but I probably should tonight if I can. I know that my S.G. is 1.024 right now, my Ca is 540ppm as of last week (yes high I know), my alk is 9.0meq/L, my PH is about 8.0 though and my ammonia is 0. My nitrites and nitrates I'm not sure what they are at, but I'm certain the trites are at 0, trates might be like 5.... My phosphate I need to test as I just pulled a sack of PhosGuard out last week (was in the tank since the end of Jan) and I plan to put a new bag of it in when I move my tank. Ironically I've noticed the dinos growing a little more since I took the PhosGuard out, but I had some GHA growing in my tank even before I took the PhosGuard out, so I'm not sure how directly related it is to the dino growth. As for my water situation, I mix my own SW using Tropic Marin salt (switching to Red-Sea Coral Pro when I move) and my water comes from my RO/DI system which tests out at 0 TDS as of this past weekend. Forgot to mention that my tank has a skimmer in it which I have set to run on my night cycle which is about 15 hours long (from 6pm till 9am).

[Helfrichs Chick]

I figure I can clean off a lot of the dinos at that time. Would they re-grow back after doing this,

 

100% yes they will come back, maybe even worse, since your probally going to have a tiny cycle again. JMO.

 

Just gotta fight these things, takes a while but they eventually fizzle themselves out. GL

[roxy25]

C~ I would personally classify dinos as an advanced topic. Not like were talking about pods here. So thanks for that. I dont see why you would post if you dont want to read the thread, doesnt make any sence to me. Sorry no offence. ALSO dinos can use up phosphates so fast that they will always test 0, so testing does no good, it will not show "through the roof".

 

she just loves to bug me thats all, don't pay her any mind

 

anyways chick you are right I took a better look at the stuff on the sand. I guess I couldn't see the bubbles on the rock.

 

this brings up my mysterious deaths of my shrimp in my 10 gallon I had this all over it was horrible and my two shrimp and a few snails died. I didn't know why either but this explains it.

 

when I transfer I had new rocks water and sand I don't understand how it got in the new system.

 

I don't know what to do ! I will look do some more research

[Maeda]

so do you have dinos? or cyno?

 

cyno i can help... dinos id have no idea.

[roxy25]

so do you have dinos? or cyno?

 

cyno i can help... dinos id have no idea.

 

 

dinos

[roxy25]

matt read this was so helpful http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-11/rhf/index.php

 

 

I raise my PH before reading and I have notice its not growing back so fast

[Phixion]

Thanks for the heads up Kerry! Mine isn't growing fast at all, and infact except for a random strand here and there, it's not really affecting my tank much... Cyano is more of my real enemy right now. After lights out for an hour or two the cyano is already 90% gone, then returns by the end of my daylight period the next day.

[roxy25]

Thanks for the heads up Kerry! Mine isn't growing fast at all, and infact except for a random strand here and there, it's not really affecting my tank much... Cyano is more of my real enemy right now. After lights out for an hour or two the cyano is already 90% gone, then returns by the end of my daylight period the next day.

 

 

what did you try so far ?

 

PM if you want to chat about it

[Phixion]

It's ok since it's related. For my dinos, I sucked out what i could see (which wasn't that much of it) using a pipette. I had a frag plug with a branchy thing on it (some jokers that long since died) and the dinos completely covered the plug, so I pulled it out and scrubbed it down. I had some dinos in a couple other spots and sucked it out. For my cyano, I don't touch it. it just dissapears by itself once the lights go out. Then returns again the next day... *sigh* I'm seriously considering a Korallia 1 for some crossflow in the tank... I was planning to use the 606 for that though to see if that helps any, then get the Korallia from there.

[roxy25]

It's ok since it's related. For my dinos, I sucked out what i could see (which wasn't that much of it) using a pipette. I had a frag plug with a branchy thing on it (some jokers that long since died) and the dinos completely covered the plug, so I pulled it out and scrubbed it down. I had some dinos in a couple other spots and sucked it out. For my cyano, I don't touch it. it just dissapears by itself once the lights go out. Then returns again the next day... *sigh* I'm seriously considering a Korallia 1 for some crossflow in the tank... I was planning to use the 606 for that though to see if that helps any, then get the Korallia from there.

Do you have pics because The dinos do the same thing. That you are stating, lights out it disappears lights on it back.

 

Do you run any time of media to remove phosphates ?

 

Well after much reading on both cyano and dinos . Cyanos is pretty easy to get rid of have you tried freshwater maracyn ? or red slime remover?

 

I tried like every chemical and nothing ( that’s is another reason I have concluded its dinos)

 

 

As for the 606 pump pm you addy I totally forgot I can send it out this weekend . I am about to get some maxi jets from a friend so I won’t be using it LMK

[lil'wrasse cool]

well I know snails die from high nitrates or unable to flip themselves. maybe try a dif nitrate kit. and when I run phos remover all cynos and dyno stop spreading and die off. also my nitrates are around 5 or.5 ppm cant remember I think its 5 though. If you have not tryed phos remover then get 10 bucks and go to you large pet store chain ( I found they have the cheepest prices on the stuff) here its petcetra and you will see a great dif. in you tank in under a week just leave the bag in for a week or so not 24 or 48 hours.

[roxy25]

well I know snails die from high nitrates or unable to flip themselves. maybe try a dif nitrate kit. and when I run phos remover all cynos and dyno stop spreading and die off. also my nitrates are around 5 or.5 ppm cant remember I think its 5 though. If you have not tryed phos remover then get 10 bucks and go to you large pet store chain ( I found they have the cheepest prices on the stuff) here its petcetra and you will see a great dif. in you tank in under a week just leave the bag in for a week or so not 24 or 48 hours.

 

The test kits are use are sailfert I don't have high nitrates at all. I have lots of marco algae growing also.

 

Yes thats what the article suggest raising PH then running a great phosphate remover

 

I have so much to order but can't cause I lost my bank card damn !