Jump to content


Photo

Seagrass


  • Please log in to reply
161 replies to this topic

#101
tinyreefer

tinyreefer

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 55 posts
  • Joined 09 Jan 2010
  • Richardson, TX

Wow, what a nice thread.

I have a very sparse planting of Halodule (shoal grass) in a 29g under 150w 10,000k HQI. This is my sixth time to try this grass.

Some things I have learned:
80 degrees is a good temperature
MH is the way to go although I have not tried the LED's yet. I did run T5's twice but switched to MH.
Skimmer seems a good idea and works well
Power filter seems a good idea and works well
Some kind of clay in the substrate is necessary. Miracle Mud did not work for me. The guys at Gulf Coast Ecosystems had some thing like Fiji Mud and that is what I am using now. It works better.
Must have nassarius vibex and blue leg hermit crabs for cleanup along with some kind of algae eating snail.
More flow seems to do better than less flow. I am running 2 x MJ1200's

Dosing:
I tried using fertilizer tabs. They are a mess, do not use IMO.
I tried dosing Flourish with some success but I think the products affected my snails and fish adversely. I may try again.

I hope the information helps people and I may actually post my latest on a build thread.
29g Sea Grass, Halodule, 150w HQI, CPR skimmer, power filter, 2xMJ1200 flow,

#102
Amphiprion1

Amphiprion1

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,149 posts
  • Joined 06 Mar 2010

Wow, what a nice thread.

I have a very sparse planting of Halodule (shoal grass) in a 29g under 150w 10,000k HQI. This is my sixth time to try this grass.

Some things I have learned:
80 degrees is a good temperature
MH is the way to go although I have not tried the LED's yet. I did run T5's twice but switched to MH.
Skimmer seems a good idea and works well
Power filter seems a good idea and works well
Some kind of clay in the substrate is necessary. Miracle Mud did not work for me. The guys at Gulf Coast Ecosystems had some thing like Fiji Mud and that is what I am using now. It works better.
Must have nassarius vibex and blue leg hermit crabs for cleanup along with some kind of algae eating snail.
More flow seems to do better than less flow. I am running 2 x MJ1200's

Dosing:
I tried using fertilizer tabs. They are a mess, do not use IMO.
I tried dosing Flourish with some success but I think the products affected my snails and fish adversely. I may try again.

I hope the information helps people and I may actually post my latest on a build thread.


Glad to hear that things are working well with this iteration. I think the extra light probably helped a little, too. If you have the opportunity, please do share this build. I'm very interested in seeing it.

Interesting note on the fluorish products. I've never used them in marine systems. I've noticed that the grasses are more tolerant of lower water column nutrients, but this can often encourage things like cyanobacteria to proliferate. I noticed after performing a rare water change that filamentous algae began growing again immediately after and cyanobacterial growth had slowed dramatically, indicating some sort of deficiency (likely trace metals or something similar). The water change did seem to push the grasses' growth in a positive direction, however, so I may do them slightly more often, such as on a monthly basis. I don't think more often would be as beneficial in my situation. In any case, I prefer and attempt to encourage filamentous algal growth in my system.

Also, sand dwelling snails will eventually get crowded out if the grasses really take off. Just about anything that prefers to be on/in the substrate will have a formidable barrier in their way, considering how Halodule send runners above the substrate as well as below.

#103
Wizzy

Wizzy

    Cool Beans Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,286 posts
  • Joined 21 Jun 2011
  • California, USA
I liked the simple way the author explained the care requirements of the different seagrass species.

http://reefbuilders....ms-going-green/

HTH- Wizzy :happy:

#104
wombat

wombat

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 2,466 posts
  • Joined 17 Dec 2002

I liked the simple way the author explained the care requirements of the different seagrass species.

http://reefbuilders....ms-going-green/

HTH- Wizzy :happy:


He is incorrect that some seagrasses won't act like Caulerpa. Halophila in particular will grow right up over rocks and smother any coral in its path.

My Settings > 'Ignore' Preferences > Ignore all signatures when reading topics and personal messages


#105
Wizzy

Wizzy

    Cool Beans Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,286 posts
  • Joined 21 Jun 2011
  • California, USA

He is incorrect that some seagrasses won't act like Caulerpa. Halophila in particular will grow right up over rocks and smother any coral in its path.


Spot any other errors?

If I end up setting up a seagrass tank it will be seagrass-only and maybe some rock, because I want to keep a group of Bluestripe Pipefish in an attempt to breed them.

Thanks- Wizzy

#106
wombat

wombat

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 2,466 posts
  • Joined 17 Dec 2002

Spot any other errors?

If I end up setting up a seagrass tank it will be seagrass-only and maybe some rock, because I want to keep a group of Bluestripe Pipefish in an attempt to breed them.

Thanks- Wizzy


Nope. FWIW, Blue stripe pipes are actually reef dwellers. It's extremely unlikely you'd find them in a seagrass habitat. They generally are found around relatively deep overhangs and caves, where they act as cleaners for cryptic fishes like cardinals, sweepers, and morays.

My Settings > 'Ignore' Preferences > Ignore all signatures when reading topics and personal messages


#107
Wizzy

Wizzy

    Cool Beans Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,286 posts
  • Joined 21 Jun 2011
  • California, USA

Nope. FWIW, Blue stripe pipes are actually reef dwellers. It's extremely unlikely you'd find them in a seagrass habitat. They generally are found around relatively deep overhangs and caves, where they act as cleaners for cryptic fishes like cardinals, sweepers, and morays.


Thanks for the info :D

Do you think they would be happy in a Seagrass environment?

Any other stocking suggestions for a seagrass tank?

The tank will be a 40 gallon breeder, but will be tied into a larger system.

Thanks- Wizzy :happy:

P.S. Tank will be normal reef temperatures- about 80 degrees

So I'm under the impression that seahorses are off-limits <_<

Edited by Wizzy, 12 June 2012 - 08:40 PM.


#108
bitts

bitts

    Yes. I'm blasting Wagner. While chanting KILL Da NOOB.

  • Members
  • 6,333 posts
  • Joined 30 Dec 2006
  • Denver, boulder, loveland, fort collins.....
More info on how to establish a complete ecosystem in our tanks.

http://phys.org/news...ms-healthy.html
further readings

Edited by bitts, 15 June 2012 - 10:59 AM.


#109
Wizzy

Wizzy

    Cool Beans Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,286 posts
  • Joined 21 Jun 2011
  • California, USA

More info on how to establish a complete ecosystem in our tanks.

http://phys.org/news...ms-healthy.html
further readings


Those clams sound like they could be helpful/cool to watch.

You wouldn't have to worry (as much) about the removal of dead leaves.

Are they available anywhere?

#110
Jacob042426

Jacob042426

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 4,537 posts
  • Joined 24 Dec 2011
  • Miami
i love seagrass. my next tank will definetly have some.

#111
albertthiel

albertthiel

    Helping Others Succeed ....... if I can

  • Premium Members
  • 14,415 posts
  • Joined 04 Jun 2012
  • Alpharetta, GA

i love seagrass. my next tank will definetly have some.


Link to page that deals with Bubble algae that are often causing issues but not always (also lists the various types - I wrote this many years ago)


Bubble Algae and the Types Information

Albert

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Information on my Book "Nano-Reef Aquariums" is available at  :  http://www.nanoreefs.info

No Printed Copies remain but: 

 

The  e-Version costs ONLY $ 20.00, and is available via the link above.


#112
albertthiel

albertthiel

    Helping Others Succeed ....... if I can

  • Premium Members
  • 14,415 posts
  • Joined 04 Jun 2012
  • Alpharetta, GA

Link to page that deals with Bubble algae that are often causing issues but not always (also lists the various types - I wrote this many years ago)


Bubble Algae and the Types Information

Albert


Another link to grow Corallne Algae

http://www.sgreefclu...lgae-growth-r71

Albert

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Information on my Book "Nano-Reef Aquariums" is available at  :  http://www.nanoreefs.info

No Printed Copies remain but: 

 

The  e-Version costs ONLY $ 20.00, and is available via the link above.


#113
d0lph1n

d0lph1n

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 840 posts
  • Joined 02 Feb 2011
  • Newport Beach, CA

Any suggestions for a short type of seagrass that likes strong current and PAR 50-200 for my left part of the tank?

Also where can i purchase it pests free from? What's the acclimation procedure for seagras? can I treat it with TLF ReVive since it's a plant extract product?

 



#114
Subsea

Subsea

    subsea

  • Members
  • 958 posts
  • Joined 20 Oct 2012
  • Austin, Tx
http://marineplantbook.com/

You can buy pest free macro at the link. Take the time to read the reference book. It will answer many questions. It seems that many want to fertilize plants in the tank. This is unnecessary in most cases. For most of us, the macro is a nutrient reduction mechanism.

#115
d0lph1n

d0lph1n

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 840 posts
  • Joined 02 Feb 2011
  • Newport Beach, CA

Interesting site. I think it's one of the best sites about macro algae and marine plants I've seen so far.



#116
Subsea

Subsea

    subsea

  • Members
  • 958 posts
  • Joined 20 Oct 2012
  • Austin, Tx

Interesting site. I think it's one of the best sites about macro algae and marine plants I've seen so far.


I have dealt with Russ at GCE for ten years. Always happy with there service and product line. In one conversation, he put me on the best aquacultured rock that I have seen in 40 years of reefkeeping. Dale is diver owner of Gulfview. His live rock farm is 30 miles offshore Tampa Bay in 30' of water. Richard Harker of Tampa BaySaltwater is in half the distance offshore in 15' of water. Both sites have beautiful farmed rock, that is covered in sponges, tunicates, gorgonians and much macro.

http://www.gulf-view.com/

#117
Amphiprion1

Amphiprion1

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,149 posts
  • Joined 06 Mar 2010

Any suggestions for a short type of seagrass that likes strong current and PAR 50-200 for my left part of the tank?
Also where can i purchase it pests free from? What's the acclimation procedure for seagras? can I treat it with TLF ReVive since it's a plant extract product?
 

If you can find them, Halophila species fit the bill perfectly. I grew it for a few years and it is very hardy and fast growing, especially by seagrass standards. I never bothered with acclimating mine. You potentially could treat it, but I have no experience in doing so. I
As far as retailers go, I recommend both GCE as already mentioned, as well as reefcleaners.

#118
loyalhero90

loyalhero90

    college nano reefer

  • Members
  • 260 posts
  • Joined 09 Jul 2010
  • Dallas, Tx

Does shoal grass have a high turnover rate? A lot of the grass gets lodged in my pump all the time and I thought it was dying due to nutrients but after a closer look the grass doesn't seem dead or more sparse than before.

Also the individual grasses change color from dark green to light green and to brown. This is not an allover thing but I was wondering if those color changes meant anything important like should I dose or something...



#119
Amphiprion1

Amphiprion1

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,149 posts
  • Joined 06 Mar 2010
How long have you had it? New transplants will shed. If none of the plants show growth, you should consider more nutrients. If you absolutely need to give them a boost, I'd try a phosphorus-free root tab, like seachem. If you use some, use little fragments of a tab--use as little as possible.

#120
loyalhero90

loyalhero90

    college nano reefer

  • Members
  • 260 posts
  • Joined 09 Jul 2010
  • Dallas, Tx

How long have you had it? New transplants will shed. If none of the plants show growth, you should consider more nutrients. If you absolutely need to give them a boost, I'd try a phosphorus-free root tab, like seachem. If you use some, use little fragments of a tab--use as little as possible.

I'm studying abroad in australia so I haven't checked presently. But when I had last checked I had had them for over 3 months. Before I left I had had them for about 4-5 weeks so the grass that I saw after my three month stay was probably new transplants. I saw some growth when I returned but I was disparaged by the large amount of shedding but since that is healthy then I think my shoal grass are probably okay. Have you tried Co2 dosing? I used a little because the Co2 was mainly for freshwater just to see what happens. I only dosed about 3 times then stopped because I didn't know how it was going to affect chemistry. I have heard strange comments about the root tabs so I was warry but I could try those I guess when I return.

 

Thanks!



#121
Amphiprion1

Amphiprion1

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 1,149 posts
  • Joined 06 Mar 2010

I'm studying abroad in australia so I haven't checked presently. But when I had last checked I had had them for over 3 months. Before I left I had had them for about 4-5 weeks so the grass that I saw after my three month stay was probably new transplants. I saw some growth when I returned but I was disparaged by the large amount of shedding but since that is healthy then I think my shoal grass are probably okay. Have you tried Co2 dosing? I used a little because the Co2 was mainly for freshwater just to see what happens. I only dosed about 3 times then stopped because I didn't know how it was going to affect chemistry. I have heard strange comments about the root tabs so I was warry but I could try those I guess when I return.

 

Thanks!

 

Wow, Australia, eh? I would've loved to have studied there.

 

Anyway, if there is growth, then I wouldn't be overly concerned. If all shoots just stay pale, etc. or just start dying, then I'd consider nutrients. These plants are well adapted to low nutrient conditions, surprisingly. Some shedding will be normal, just like any plant and more growth will yield more shedding.

 

No, I've never used CO2 in marine systems. It shouldn't be necessary for seagrasses, since they derive much of their carbon needs from carbonate/bicarbonate. That is why I do try to maintain adequate alkalinity (and calcium) in a seagrass system, regardless of whether or not corals are present. I think the handful of people that used CO2 had mixed results, with some saying it does help and others not noticing a single bit of difference.

 

I mentioned root tabs as a last resort, really. If you try them, again, be sure they have no phosphorus. Be very, very careful with them. They can cause green water within a day or so if done in excess or improperly. What other strange things have you heard about them?



#122
Subsea

Subsea

    subsea

  • Members
  • 958 posts
  • Joined 20 Oct 2012
  • Austin, Tx

Does shoal grass have a high turnover rate? A lot of the grass gets lodged in my pump all the time and I thought it was dying due to nutrients but after a closer look the grass doesn't seem dead or more sparse than before.

Also the individual grasses change color from dark green to light green and to brown. This is not an allover thing but I was wondering if those color changes meant anything important like should I dose or something...

I think it means a lot for grass to turn brown.  I have no experience with shoal grass.  While I always add nutrients to promote growth in all of my mixed reef tanks, I also control using nitrate at 1-2ppm.  

When a teresteral plant turns brown it is either dying or it is self protecting by going dormat, to prevent dying.

I would do nothing.  How is the rest of the tank doing?



#123
loyalhero90

loyalhero90

    college nano reefer

  • Members
  • 260 posts
  • Joined 09 Jul 2010
  • Dallas, Tx

I think it means a lot for grass to turn brown.  I have no experience with shoal grass.  While I always add nutrients to promote growth in all of my mixed reef tanks, I also control using nitrate at 1-2ppm.  

When a teresteral plant turns brown it is either dying or it is self protecting by going dormat, to prevent dying.

I would do nothing.  How is the rest of the tank doing?

As of now I only have a few macros, hermits, snail and the seagrass. Everything is doing fine though. The macros are growing alright and I think my ochtodes are growing out more (those things can really cover some area). The seagrasses tips are what turns brown not the roots. There is sometimes a clearish sheath around the actual shoots of the grass that are exposed and those are clear with the actual root being green changing into the brown root. But the browning usually starts from the top and then travels down or there are brown spots that start.



#124
loyalhero90

loyalhero90

    college nano reefer

  • Members
  • 260 posts
  • Joined 09 Jul 2010
  • Dallas, Tx

Hello I have returned from Australia and my shoal grass is actually doing well. I wanted to try to plant star grass. I was wondering how many stems with leaves I should get if the shoal grass is doing well? I can get 2, 4 and 8.



#125
Speaker73

Speaker73

    Nano Reefer

  • Members
  • 292 posts
  • Joined 18 Jun 2012

i would get 8 stems. more is always better!