Kill or Spare the Hair?

[Marmot Man]

I've been a lurker on this site for many months. After reading lots of the

info posted here, elsewhere on the web, and in multiple books, I finally

decided what kind of tank I wanted to setup in my office at work. I do the

`planted Discus tank thing' at home. I wanted to do something radically

different at work. So a nano-reef it is!

 

On 2003-02-03 I setup the following in my office:

 

Eclipse 5G Hex

Included Carbon/BioWheel Filtration

MicroJet 404 PowerHead

Mini 50W Heater

Retrofitted 13W 10k/Actnic03 Bulb (External Ballast)

 

After filling the tank with 4 gallons of RO water, I added the required

amount of Instant Ocean, turned on the filtration/powerhead/heaters and

let everything sit for a couple days. On 2003-02-05 I added 10 lbs of

Nature's Ocean pseudo-live sand. Two days later, on 2003-02-07 I added 7

lbs of Marshall Islands live rock. `Cured' accordingly to the LFS - like

they'd tell you anything else.

 

After aquascaping the rock with some help from my wife, I setup my lights

on a 3 hour cycle. Over the next week I slowly increased the photoperiod

up to what I expect will be the full 12 hour cycle.

 

I did a 32oz water change on 2003-02-14 and then took a week off from

work. Didn't see the tank again until I returned to work on 2003-02-24.

 

Oh my God how things have changed...

 

The supposedly live rock looked pretty damn dead when I got it. My `goto

guy' at the LFS had steered me towards the Marshall Islands stuff. Two of

the pieces, in particular, were `really good'. What did I know? At least

they didn't stink. Let me describe what I've got going on right now.

 

There are no less than a dozen separate patches where coralline algae has

taken root. Dark purple, purple, pink, and bright green. In several places

there are large patches of some type of fuzzy brown/black stuff (another

type of algae I'm assuming). Green bubble algae is growing from multiple

different locations. Thicker dark hair-like projections are popping up in

various places. There is at least one sponge-like object. A few days ago I

nearly jumped out of my skin when I saw a little translucent worm thing

inching across one of the rocks. And just in the last day I've noticed a

couple other things growing that almost like some type of Zooanthus sp.

Either that or its Aiptasia that is just too small right now to identify.

And then, of course, there is the bright-green hair algae... Its on rocks,

on front panels, and on the sand.

 

On my first day back I did a slow 32oz topoff. Lots of evaporation during

that week I was gone. Yesterday I did another 32oz water change and took

the water home for some testing. Here is what I was able to find:

 

Temperature = 78/80 deg F (Lights Off/On)

Specific Gravity = 1.025

Alkalinity = 9 dKH

pH = 8.4

Ammonia = 0 ppm

Nitrite = 0 ppm

Nitrate < 5 ppm

 

I have not added ANYTHING else to this tank. No flake food to `kickstart'

the cycle. No herbivores. Nothing. Heck, I haven't even cleaned the front

panels yet. I'm just adding water and watching the show. So what I'd like

to hear from anyone who has read through this rather length dissertation

is:

 

1) Am I doing OK thus far? I thinking now that I maybe should have left

the lights on a shorter cycle. I've read opinions both ways...

 

2) Do I need to take pro-active steps now to extinguish the hair algae? Or

can I simply ride it out? I'm thinking that with the nitrates as low as

they are, it may `burn out' soon. The algae on the glass already seems

to be showing signs of this. Several patches have turned into smeared

grey masses.

 

3) My eventual goal (over the course of many months) is to populate the

tank with:

 

5-10 Snails (various sp.)

1 Formia sp. Star

1-2 Zooanthus sp.

1 Euphyllia glabrescens

1 Amphiprion ocellaris

 

Does that sound realistic? Or would I be way overstocked?

 

Thanks in advance for the feedback everyone! There is some really great

info on this site.

[Christopher Marks]

1.) You're doing ok so far, although I'm not too certain your tank has cycled yet, seeing how you did some partial water changes during the process. That's not that say there is no way the tank has cycled, but I would wait about 1-2 more weeks just to be safe. The lighting cycle you chose was fine.

 

2.) Being a new tank, chances are the undesirable algae will die off with time. You usually just have to ride it out in the first 1-3 months. If you do remove it, be careful not to spread it around much in the tank, and be especially careful not to break the bubble algae bubbles.

 

3.) I wouldn't keep more than 5 snails in a 5 gallon tank. Any more, and you might find them knocking corals over. The clown should do fine as long as you're sure the tank is stable. Or maybe concider a shrimp instead of the fish?

[duckhuntboy]

I decreased my lighting from 12 hour to 10 hour cycle (somewhat permanently for now). This was suggested by Bryan (logicalreef) and it took care of my hair alae problems completely. I removed what I had, and so far (in the 2nd month of my tank) nothing has come back. You could try that. I just use walmart water, and still everything is good.

[Pets Shop Boy]

It's funny. Our situation is nearly identical. While reading your post, I thought what are the odds. I keep discus in a 55 gallon aquarium at home. I'd been wanting to do a saltwater tank for the longest time, but I didn't have the heart to give away my discus which includes a pretty breeding pair (whose young never gets past the wriggler stage--and just as well as I don't have the space to grow out and raise fry, though it's good to know I can if and when I want to attempt to seriously breed them). Don't get me wrong, discus are about as close to marine fish in terms of bright colors as one can hope to find in the world freshwater fish. But I felt that, with the rigorous water change routine and dedication discus require, I was probably ready to take on the challenges of saltwater. But my wife would not have another fish tank in our home (it's somewhat small).

 

So what was I to do? I did some quick research and found that what I once thought impossible or impractical--the keeping of a small saltwater tank--was quite popular and even had it's own niche on the net. I picked up a 10 gallon economy tank for my desk at work and set it up. After two months, I've got two clownfish who greet me every day when I come in to work. I bought a small toadstool leather coral to host them, but haven't had luck. I have to admit it was probably the one mistake I made since it was supposed to be a fish only tank, at least this early on. I just didn't want to make the investment in lightling that would be required to properly care for it, and as a result regret buying it. It sheds constantly and never extends it's polyps. Oh well. Otherwise everything is great in the tank, the fish eat well and get along fairly well, although there is occasional chasing, but not constant.

 

Well, anyway, I originally just wanted to wish you luck with your tank and introduce myself as a fellow discus keeper. So, good luck with both the reef and the discus.

[Marmot Man]

Pets Shop Boy,

 

Almost identical indeed!

 

At home we have a 75 gallon planted tank. Lots of annubias, lilies, and

swords. Current residents are a large red turquoise male and a slightly-

smaller pidgeon blood female. And, although its easy to forget sometimes,

there are also a few assorted tetras, three clown loaches (for snail

control), and a small-breed pleco.

 

Our two discus lay eggs on a regular basis - about once a week. Like

yourself, they have never made it past the wriggler stage. Normally what

happens is that they come to the surface for feeding time and the clown

loaches swoop up to eat the eggs. The only way they even make it to

wrigglers is if I force the discus to fast for a few days. No worries

here though. We aren't intentionally trying to breed them and do nothing

to entice them. They are, apparently, just very happy where they are!

 

Like yourself there is no way I could give those buggers up. I'm too

attached to them. I hand feed them and they are tame to the point where

I can go up to the tank WITHOUT food and they'll let me `stroke' their

fins and bodies. Of course if anyone else (other than my wife) approaches

the tank, they flee back into the large sword and hide. Very smart fish!

 

Good to hear you have had success with your little clowns at work. I'm

hopefully I'll be able to report similar success in a couple months! What

kind of lighting did you have on your 10 gallon? This is something I've

been a little worried about myself. There seems to be a lot of ranting on

this site (and others) about "More light! More light!" I've been unable

to determine at this point how much is simple hype and how much is true

need.

[Marmot Man]

duckhuntboy,

 

Hmmm. I'll think about doing this. I guess it stands to reason that most of

the coralline will tolerate the reduced lighting. But reducing the lighting

may hasten the process of killing the hair algae which, I'm infering, needs

a higher light level?

[Marmot Man]

Chris,

 

First off, congratulations on a great site. Seems like a very high signal

to noise ratio here. Your cautious approach is a great service to people

like myself that are converts from freshwater.

 

I'm not positive the tank has completely cycled either. No worries here

though. I'm a very patient guy and I don't mind leaving the tank `idle'

for many more weeks as necessary. I had no intention of adding any more

livestock (other than the rock and sand) for at least a couple more weeks.

Unless, of course, a consensus indicated I need herbivores for the algae.

 

The water changes were a small percentage of the total water volume. I was

very careful to measure the water volume of the tank after the live sand

and rock were added. My tank contains almost exactly 4 gallons of water.

So that's 512oz of which I was changing about 32oz - only 6.25%.

 

My purpose in changing the water was two-fold. I wanted to get some water

home for testing. And, since I'm not dosing, I wanted to add at least a

little more calcium via the water change for the coralline algae. I have

yet to acquire a calcium test kit, so obviously this is just a shot in the

dark.

 

I think I may just leave the hair algae in-place for now and not try to do

any manual removal. This morning I notice even more patches that have begun

to `smear out'. And since the beginning of the week the quantity of this

algae does not appear to have increased appreciably. As suggested by

`duckhuntboy' I may decrease my photo period to 10 hours to hasten the

process.

 

The snail population I was considering was something like:

 

3 Astrea

2 Nassarius

2 Trochus

2 Bumble Bee

 

My reasoning was a split between snails known for rock/glass cleaning

habbits and those known for sand stirring ability. I want to avoid having

any crabs in the tank due to problems with predation. Is this combination

still too out-of-balance in your opinion?

 

How about the Formia sp. star? Is it realistic to have one in a tank of

my size?

 

Finally the question of `the fish'... I don't know for certain at this

point. Originally I thought I would definitely want a fish in the tank.

And a clown seemed like the best combination of personality, attractive-

ness, and suitability. Now I'm not so sure. I never imagined a bunch of

sand and rock would be this entertaining! I may be perfectly happy with

the addition of the snails, couple corals, and star. A shrimp might be

a possibility too.

 

I do know that if add the fish, it would be the last thing in the tank.

And only after a very gradual stocking period. The order I listed the

livestock in the original post was my planned order of introduction.

[lizbeth]

Marmot, congrats on a job well done. You are going slow and watching the show. Personally I love the live rock, it's my favorite part of reefing. There are so many interesting things that show up. I've had my tanks set up for months and I am still discovering things that hitchhiked in. The newest find being a crab that is in the fuge for the 20, I saw it the first time last week.

 

I really enjoy my yellow tailed damsel Newman. Since your tank is "one fish" size and you enjoy bright colorful fish you might want to consider a damsel. There are several varities that suit a five gallon tank.

 

 

I really like Nassarius snails and Cerith snails. I haven't had much luck with Asteras. I have no experience with Bumble bees, there is some question about them being reef safe.

 

Welcome to NR!

[Pets Shop Boy]

That's just it. I didn't intend to keep anything other than fish. When I bought that leather coral, it was an impulse buy based on something I'd read about some types of leathers being a good alternative to the anemone as host for clownfish. I still don't have proper lighting or the recommended live rock, so I'm not expecting much until I go out and get the proper additions. Right now, I'm just concentrating on keeping the fish healthy. So for the question of lighting, I'm really not sure. Standard aquarium lighting, from what I've read, is adequate for the keeping of marine fish. However, for reefs, I know only that the lighting requirements are more important. Look around at other posts here to see what others have set up. I hear lots of talk here about PC (I think it stands for Power Compact) flourescent lighting and metal halides being the recommended types. As for wattage, I'm not sure what is best. I've added as much as I can and am hoping for the best. I'm pretty sure, though that my two 25 watt and single 13 watt (a PC light I found in the office that I stuck at the side--very makeshift, I know) are not nearly even adequate, but it's the best I can do for now. When/if I decide to get serious about reef keeping, I'll do it right. Right now, I'm happy with two healthy clowns.

 

As for my discus, I've got a turquoise (the male of the pair), a red spotted green--according to the LFS guy (the female of the pair, and the shining star of the tank, nearly perfect form and brightly colored), a standard brown discus and one that I can't quite identify. Its colors are so subdued. It is also, to some degree, a slight bit stunted at only about 3 1/2 inches after a year and a half. Anyway, they share their space with two tetra that were left over from an old 10 gallon tank. My tank is not heavily planted, but I do have some water sprite, some anubias and some foxtail here and there.

 

Question--have you ever been to simplydiscus.com? They seem to be pretty avid hobbyists over there. I lurk there sometimes and post once in a while, but it seems like a pretty comprehensive knowledge base and a forum with helpful and knowledgeable posters.

[Marmot Man]

Thanks lizbeth,

 

I can't claim, as of yet, that live rock is my favorite part of reefing. But

that is only because I really have experienced much of reefing yet! I can admit

to also being absolutely fascinated at the wide variety of critters that have

hijacked their way into my tank. Truly amazing stuff. Two days ago one of my

colleagues came into my office and asked "Did you PAINT those rocks purple?"

Pretty funny...

 

There are several damselfish that I've seen that looked suitable for my tank.

The yellow-tail was one of them. But the goofy behavior of the clownfish is a

definite plus in my book. Especially in a one-fish tank. But heck. Its not a

decision I'll have to make for many months.

 

Anyway, thanks again for the welcome!

[Marmot Man]

Pets Shop Boy,

 

As far as lighting goes... `PC' is definitely `Power Compact'. That is what I

used on my planted freshwater tank - a JBJ 4 x 55W PC fixture. In my eyes, metal

halide lighting for a 5G (or even 10G) tank seems WAY overkill. Although I know

for certain that others on this site would disagree.

 

I knew from the beginning that I wanted to keep some corals. No clams or higher

light SPS corals. Several other people on this site went with the 13W 10k/Act03

PC lights in an Eclipse 5G Hex tank. So that is what I ended up doing on mine.

The one `enhancement' I added was to use an external ballast in order to reduce

the amount of heat introduced into the tank. I pulled out the existing lighting

and reflector. These were replaced with a socket, bulb, and reflector from

HelloLights.com.

 

Then I went to Home Depot and bought a $15 13W PC shop light. I selected this

particular light because it was the same type of bulb being used in the tank,

had a power switch on the handle, and had a `utility outlet' on the handle for

plugging in another tool. First I removed the bulb and shielding from the light.

Then I opened the plastic yellow casing of the base and rewired the ballast and

outlet. Now I have what amounts to a yellow `transformer box' that can stay on

the floor. A standard power cord is used to connect the light socket in the

tank to the ballast on the floor (via the utility outlet). And I even get a

manual power switch in the process! Of course I have the light on a timer

anyway...

 

I guess I'll find out in a few months if this amount of lighting is truly

sufficient. Given the proximity of the bulb to the water, and the shallow depth

of the tank, I'm hopefully it will be. There isn't enough room in the hood for

another bulb - or a longer bulb for that matter. So this will pretty much HAVE

to do.

 

Haven't been to `simplydiscus.com' but I'll have to take a look. One can never

have enough discus sites bookmarked for future reference!

 

So you have four discus in your tank and two still lay eggs on a regular basis?

Interesting. We had a real problem with that about five months back. Originally

we had two red turquoise in the tank - our current male and a similarly sized

female. They were laying eggs on a regular basis and everything was peaceful.

 

Then we added the pidgeon blood female. Big mistake...

 

At first everything was fine. But then we began to notice the male `hanging out'

with the pidgeon blood more than the female red turquoise. Then BOTH of the

females started laying eggs. When one would try, the other female would become

enraged and eat the eggs.

 

This went back and forth a couple times before we determined that one of the two

females had to be adopted out. We ended up adopting out the red turquoise female

because we had a friend who would take her (he didn't like pidgeon bloods).

[Marmot Man]

Hair Algae Update

 

My "do nothing" strategy seems to be working with respect to the hair algae.

Nothing has been done to the tank this week other than to top off the water as

necessary. I even resisted the temptation to monkey with the photo period - not

that this suggestion from `duckhuntboy' was a bad one. Heck. I haven't even

gone so far as to clean the front panels of the tank.

 

There is still appreciable hair algae. But when I came into the office this

morning it was clearly on the decline. Patches on the front panels continue to

thin, turn grey, and then disolve into a smeared mess. The algae in the sand is

diminishing. Areas of rock that had previously been covered in hair algae are

beginning to show through again. And, better yet, the patches of coralline

algae continue to grow larger!

 

Wow. This has definitely been an educational experience. Like most males of our

species, my immediate thought when coming into work last Monday and seeing algae

was to do something really quick. Buy an algae scrapper. Get some herbivores.

Just do SOMETHING. Anything to make the situation better. And, as is often the

case, the best answer may very well have been to do nothing at all.

[lizbeth]

Marmot, I'm glad to see your hair algae seems to be on the decline. You don't have to wait to put in your clean up crew. If you have a local store pick up a couple of snails and if you want them a couple of hermits. That will start the stocking of the tank and give you a few more things to gaze at.

[Marmot Man]

lizbeth (and others),

 

Haven't had much time this week to read NR... Too much going on at work

and home this week. Also haven't had time to put any other critters into

the reef.

 

Most of the hair algae on the front panels was dead by mid-week so I used

a MagFloat (for Acrylic) to remove it. Made sure most of the dead stuff

was sucked into the Eclipse filter intake and after about an hour I rinsed

out the mechanical filter pad. I've still got hair algae here and there.

Especially in the high-light areas of the tank. But its not multiplying

out of control anymore. All the hair algae that had been growing on the

sand bed is now dead. But it has left a mat of organic material in the

sand bed. Will my cleanup crew break this down?

 

The patches of coralline algae continue to grow. So I'm happy about that.

The weird little translucent worm things appear to be multiplying. I've

seen as many as four of them at a time on the back panels of the tank. I

don't know whether that is good or bad. So I'm assuming good for now...

 

I think its about time to add the initial cleanup crew. So I'm planning on

doing that next week. I could use a little advice...

 

My LFS has the following snails available: Mexican Turbo, Nassarius, and

Cerith. They didn't have any Asteras or Bumble Bee. And I don't really

want to pay $25 in shipping to purchase $15 in snails from LiveAquaria.

My understanding is that Mexican Turbos are specatular for removing algae

from rocks and glass, but are maybe a little too large for a Nano.

Nassarius are good sand stirs, but not much for wandering the rocks and

glass. And that Cerith will do a little of both. Is that about right?

 

I've been thinking that I will avoid having hermits or other types of

crabs. Heard too many stories of them attacking and killing the snails for

their shells. Given my previously state tank configuration, and given that

I'm aiming to use snails for both cleaning the rocks and stirring the

sand, which should I add? And in what quantities?

 

I'm thinking of starting with:

 

2 Mexican Turbo (selecting initially small specimens)

2 Nassarius

3 Cerith

 

Does that seem a reasonable plan?