Flow issues, corals not opening after new pump

[RickvD]

Hello,

 

After a prolonged battle with Dino's, I have successfully overcome them. Throughout this struggle, there were significant swings in all my parameters, including Alkalinity.

 

My current parameters are now stable and better than ever. Following the removal of my UV, I introduced the new AI Axis pump for improved flow and control, set at the maximum of 185GPH. Additionally, I have the AI Nero 3, which has been in the same spot for months. However, after receiving some advice, I elevated its position. While my zoa's in the 15G Waterbox Peninsula are gradually recovering and reopening after the Dino fight and parameter fluctuations, they now experience less flow due to the new Nero placement. In contrast, my hammer is receiving much more flow and is no longer opening.

 

I've provided my schedules and placements in the screenshots, and I would greatly appreciate any tips or suggestions.

 

As shown in the screenshots, my Nero is currently set at 30%. I've tried reducing it to 15-20%, but I still achieve at least 700 GPH. Additionally, I've increased my lights by approximately 7-10% to ensure they receive the same PAR levels, and this adjustment seems to be well-received!

 

 

[Reefkid88]

Everything should open up and becoming happy as they adapt to the new flow pattern. Just get things stable and you'll be good. 

[RickvD]

41 minutes ago, Reefkid88 said:

Everything should open up and becoming happy as they adapt to the new flow pattern. Just get things stable and you'll be good. 

Glad to hear that. So the flow isn’t too much for the hammer?

[ml86743]

2 hours ago, RickvD said:

Glad to hear that. So the flow isn’t too much for the hammer?

Euphyillia doesn't love direct flow generally, and it looks like it's pointed directly at the coral.  Was it opening fully before you moved the nero?  The fact that everything is closed leads me to believe there is some sort of chemical imbalance.  You mentioned params have been stable since beating the dino's, how long is that?

 

Peninsula tanks can be tricky - in my 14 I ended up with a vortech (on reefcrest) opposing the return to create some clashing flow.  I hate the look trust me..but it worked out to be the best position for that tank.  I also added an RFG on the return nozzle which helped tremendously, if I didn't keep any SPS, I'd probably just roll with return/RFG.  

[Reefkid88]

8 hours ago, RickvD said:

Glad to hear that. So the flow isn’t too much for the hammer?

 

 If the powerhead is pointed directly at the lps then yeah it can cause some issues. They have been down to bail polyps when the flow is way too high/direct. 

[fenderchamp]

move the hammer out of the direct flow and/or turn down the flow. 

 

I think you might have glossed over the history of the tank a bit.

 

How long has the tank been up?

 

When did the dinos start? 

 

When did the dinos stop?

 

What was the old flow/light pattern like?

 

When did the pattern change.

 

Mention equipment/settings changes over the timeline,

 

Mention maintenance schedule and changes to the same over the timeline.

 

In the above timeline when was the introduction of the hammer and following that the behavior of the hammer over time up until the present.

 

that should give everyone and yourself some good hints about what's going on with the hammer.

[RickvD]

23 hours ago, ml86743 said:

Euphyillia doesn't love direct flow generally, and it looks like it's pointed directly at the coral.  Was it opening fully before you moved the nero?  The fact that everything is closed leads me to believe there is some sort of chemical imbalance.  You mentioned params have been stable since beating the dino's, how long is that?

t doesn't really seem "direct" but maybe I'm wrong. I can change the Nero settings to random the whole time.  The hammer used to open before the Dino's, but before my Dino's, the Nero was a lot lower. On another thread I made about Dino's I got the tip to move the wavemaker more to the top for better circulation. The zoa's are slowly opening. I think it has been about a week since everything started to stabalize.

 

 

23 hours ago, ml86743 said:

Peninsula tanks can be tricky - in my 14 I ended up with a vortech (on reefcrest) opposing the return to create some clashing flow.  I hate the look trust me..but it worked out to be the best position for that tank.  I also added an RFG on the return nozzle which helped tremendously, if I didn't keep any SPS, I'd probably just roll with return/RFG.  

A RFG really that good? If it's really that great in a nano, then I will start looking for one that sends to the Netherlands. In the picture, where would you place the Nero? I only look at it from the side. So as long as it's not directly in front of my, I guess it will be fine until I work out a better flow pattern.

 

17 hours ago, Reefkid88 said:

 If the powerhead is pointed directly at the lps then yeah it can cause some issues. They have been down to bail polyps when the flow is way too high/direct. 

Alright... For me it doesn't seem pointed directly at it but maybe it's still too much. For now I've turned of the wavemaker to see if the Hammer will open up again. If not, then it's an issue with the new return. 185GPH for a 15G really isn't that extreme right?

 

14 hours ago, fenderchamp said:

move the hammer out of the direct flow and/or turn down the flow. 

 

He never had a problem but maybe things simply have changed. It would suck as that spot on the rocks was supposed to be a small Euphyllia garden, but I do have another spot I can put him to test if he likes it there.

 

14 hours ago, fenderchamp said:

How long has the tank been up?

 

When did the dinos start? 

 

When did the dinos stop?

 

What was the old flow/light pattern like?

 

When did the pattern change.

 

Mention equipment/settings changes over the timeline,

 

Mention maintenance schedule and changes to the same over the timeline.

 

In the above timeline when was the introduction of the hammer and following that the behavior of the hammer over time up until the present.

About 8 months

 

Had a hard time getting my nitrates and phosphates stable from the start. Dino's followed quickly. Seemed to have gotten rid of them but came back 4 months later. Installed a UV, and after a week all Dino's were gone. I had too much Dino's die off to quick which caused a lot of poisening. Barely managed to save my fish and most corals by doing 2 30% waterchanges. Since then I haven't touched the tank.

 

Old light pattern was the same, just 10% less intense. Blue's used to be 40% and are now 50%. Zoa's seem to appreciate it a lot. Flow from the wavemaker hasn't changed until I tried a few options from this thread. I only moved it up a few CM. Yesterday I did also change my stock pump to the new AI AXIS 20. The Axis 20 does 185GPH, while the stock pump did +-130GPH. This change would mean my Nero settings should be lowered, but the Hammer stopped opening before installing the new pump. It closed when the Dino's came, during the dino battle I changed the Nero position and it still hasn't opened.

 

Nothing else has really changed TBH... I used to dose Phosphates, but that isn't neccesary anymore now that the Dino's are gone.

 

Maintenance is also the same. Only difference was 2 big waterchanges a week ago for the dino poisening. Checked parameters almost daily and they actually look amazing...

 

Hammer has been in the tank for months. I think 5 months or so. It opened up almost instantly and has been open ever since. Only no growth.

 

 

[Elizabeth94]

I would suspect that the flow is too much. I have two nero 3’s on a 2ft cube tank and they are only on 45% pulse mode. 

 

Constant flow of 25% is probably really strong considering how small the tank is and the placement of the hammer. 
 

- keep it simple, change your flow setting to be pulse all day, and change the flow to maybe 25%. I would also raise the pump a higher- usually the top 1/3 of the tank is a good spot. Will also help with surface agitation.

 

Change one thing at a time and give the tank a week or so to settle. Don’t change a bunch of stuff at once. 

[mcarroll]

On 12/27/2023 at 7:04 AM, RickvD said:

I introduced the new AI Axis pump for improved flow and control, set at the maximum of 185GPH.

I don't know what the old pump was like, but if this was a significant increase in GPH/flow then that might be the issue with your corals that aren't opening.  The flow coming out of your return is "usually" not a big factor since it's "usually" only enough to operate the back compartment.  But the flow that comes out of it is strongly laminar, and definitely not very coral friendly.  Try aiming that flow more at the surface or a different wall to see if it helps.  Reducing the pressure of that flow with something like a flow eductor might help too, at the cost of space in the tank.  CPR Aquatics and others make eductors.  Someone else suggested the VCA brand.  There are lots out there.   Another option is an outlet splitter, for example:

Red Sea and others offer these.  This might be the more ideal solution in your case, IMO.

 

Anything to reduce flow pressure (ideally without reducing flow rate) would help.

 

On 12/28/2023 at 10:41 AM, RickvD said:

The hammer used to open before the Dino's, but before my Dino's, the Nero was a lot lower. On another thread I made about Dino's I got the tip to move the wavemaker more to the top for better circulation.

It still seems on the low side.   With it being even lower before this photo, weren't you pretty limited on how much flow you could get into the tank?  If a pump is too low, usually the sand starts blowing around before you can get decent flow to the rest of the tank.

 

I still suspect the return flow as the "problem".

 

 

[RickvD]

On 12/28/2023 at 10:27 PM, Elizabeth94 said:

I would suspect that the flow is too much. I have two nero 3’s on a 2ft cube tank and they are only on 45% pulse mode. 

 

Constant flow of 25% is probably really strong considering how small the tank is and the placement of the hammer. 
 

- keep it simple, change your flow setting to be pulse all day, and change the flow to maybe 25%. I would also raise the pump a higher- usually the top 1/3 of the tank is a good spot. Will also help with surface agitation.

 

Change one thing at a time and give the tank a week or so to settle. Don’t change a bunch of stuff at once. 

I have changed my flow pattern to 25% pulse. I also raised it higher. Is this better? The hammer still showed absolutely no change in behavior so I ended up placing him somewhere else. He is now between both sides of flow and has absolutely no straight flow. He hasn't opened more yet, but I will wait a few more days as I just placed him there.

 

On 12/29/2023 at 7:52 PM, mcarroll said:

I don't know what the old pump was like, but if this was a significant increase in GPH/flow then that might be the issue with your corals that aren't opening.  The flow coming out of your return is "usually" not a big factor since it's "usually" only enough to operate the back compartment.  But the flow that comes out of it is strongly laminar, and definitely not very coral friendly.  Try aiming that flow more at the surface or a different wall to see if it helps.  Reducing the pressure of that flow with something like a flow eductor might help too, at the cost of space in the tank.  CPR Aquatics and others make eductors.  Someone else suggested the VCA brand.  There are lots out there.   Another option is an outlet splitter, for example:

I expect the old pump to throw something like 125-130 G/H. I will look if I can get one of those in the Netherlands, otherwise I will look into 3D printing one.

 

On 12/29/2023 at 7:52 PM, mcarroll said:

If a pump is too low, usually the sand starts blowing around before you can get decent flow to the rest of the tank.

The sand wasn't blowing. But I did put the wavemaker a lot higher.