Dr Tim's not working ?

[Aayyee]

So I am new to this hobby .. I watched mr saltwaters cycle a tank video and I have a 10 gallon tank I have dry rock and dry sand... I put a clown fish in and shook up doctor Tim's one and only I got it froma local saltwater store .. i shook it up and poured about a quarter of the bottle in .. it was a bottle that was good for 120 gallons ... that is why i put a quarter.. 

I checked the parameters today at noon . My ammoina was at about 1.5ppm and nitrite was about .25ppm it was there just barely.. salinity is 1.025

Temp is steady at 78

Ph is 8.4

I can't figure out what I did wrong please help 

[Clown79]

2 hours ago, Aayyee said:

So I am new to this hobby .. I watched mr saltwaters cycle a tank video and I have a 10 gallon tank I have dry rock and dry sand... I put a clown fish in and shook up doctor Tim's one and only I got it froma local saltwater store .. i shook it up and poured about a quarter of the bottle in .. it was a bottle that was good for 120 gallons ... that is why i put a quarter.. 

I checked the parameters today at noon . My ammoina was at about 1.5ppm and nitrite was about .25ppm it was there just barely.. salinity is 1.025

Temp is steady at 78

Ph is 8.4

I can't figure out what I did wrong please help 

What's wrong?

 

Your numbers are pretty normal for cycling.

 

Why is there a fish in the tank? It shouldn't be in there until after the cycle is finished.

[Tamberav]

3 hours ago, Aayyee said:

So I am new to this hobby .. I watched mr saltwaters cycle a tank video and I have a 10 gallon tank I have dry rock and dry sand... I put a clown fish in and shook up doctor Tim's one and only I got it froma local saltwater store .. i shook it up and poured about a quarter of the bottle in .. it was a bottle that was good for 120 gallons ... that is why i put a quarter.. 

I checked the parameters today at noon . My ammoina was at about 1.5ppm and nitrite was about .25ppm it was there just barely.. salinity is 1.025

Temp is steady at 78

Ph is 8.4

I can't figure out what I did wrong please help 

 

These bottles make some big claims eh?

 

 

As you can see... that claim is hit or miss. They will help speed up the process but they are not magic. 

 

I never cycle a tank with fish in it because of this. 

 

You will want to do water changes to keep ammonia low or return the fish. Clowns are hardy but the ammonia burns their gills.

 

 

 

[Seadragon]

5 hours ago, Aayyee said:

So I am new to this hobby .. I watched mr saltwaters cycle a tank video and I have a 10 gallon tank I have dry rock and dry sand... I put a clown fish in and shook up doctor Tim's one and only I got it froma local saltwater store .. i shook it up and poured about a quarter of the bottle in .. it was a bottle that was good for 120 gallons ... that is why i put a quarter.. 

I checked the parameters today at noon . My ammoina was at about 1.5ppm and nitrite was about .25ppm it was there just barely.. salinity is 1.025

Temp is steady at 78

Ph is 8.4

I can't figure out what I did wrong please help 

 

I've used Dr Tim's before, but only in a fishless cycle with ammonia dosing per their instructions.  It took me 6 weeks for it complete the Nitrogen cycle with Dr Tim's.  If I were you, I'd have the LFS hold onto the fish while you complete the cycle using a different cycling method such as ammonia dosing.

 

Personally, I do not like Dr Tim's for the very reason you mentioned in your post -- it just sucks as Starter Bacteria and I hear too many cases where it underperforms horribly compared to what I do myself.  Since you already have ammonia in your tank, I don't think you want to know of the starter bacteria that you should've used or even established live rock would've been a much better solution if you're going to add a fish right away.

[banasophia]

Did you happen to test your water before you added the fish? Where was your water from? Seems odd to me that ammonia would already be at 1.5 after only one day with a fish. 
 

For some reason I keep seeing issues with Dr Tim’s... BioSpira seems to have *much* better results. I mix multiple products personally (Nutri-Seawater, BioSpira, Dr Tim’s)... they can be sensitive to temperature extremes during shipping/storage so I like to have back up. 
 

I would take the fish back to the LFS since your ammonia is high so it’s not harmed. 

[banasophia]

I just sent you a PM, but thought I would mention it here as well that while you’re waiting for your LFS to open to return the fish for now, I would recommend sending a message to Dr Tim’s, and mark it URGENT in the title to see if they can help you troubleshoot what’s going on, to see if there’s some kind of issue they can help you identify/correct:

http://www.drtimsaquatics.com/contact

 

I would also retest your ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels. What did you use to test? Did you add any ammonia source to your tank? Are you sure you used the saltwater Dr Tim’s? 
 

If it was me, this is what I would do:

• retest ammonia and nitrite, and if I confirmed the readings were accurate, I would take the fish back for now since there’s some kind of problem and you want to keep the fish safe 
• order BioSpira and a Seachem ammonia badge from Amazon Prime
• add the ammonia badge and BioSpira to the tank once they arrive (important: remember the ammonia badge is only an indicator, you still have to test your ammonia and nitrate levels daily in the beginning) 
• retest your water the next day... the ammonia and nitrite will likely be zero
• wait another day and double check to see if they are still zero, do not add ammonia or anything else
• proceed per instructions on the BioSpira
• keep an eye on the ammonia badge and test water daily in the beginning if you add the fish back in to be sure the ammonia and nitrite remain at zero as they should 

 

[Ratvan]

16 hours ago, Aayyee said:

So I am new to this hobby .. I watched mr saltwaters cycle a tank video and I have a 10 gallon tank I have dry rock and dry sand... I put a clown fish in and shook up doctor Tim's one and only I got it froma local saltwater store .. i shook it up and poured about a quarter of the bottle in .. it was a bottle that was good for 120 gallons ... that is why i put a quarter.. 

I checked the parameters today at noon . My ammoina was at about 1.5ppm and nitrite was about .25ppm it was there just barely.. salinity is 1.025

Temp is steady at 78

Ph is 8.4

I can't figure out what I did wrong please help 

Daily dosing of Seachem Prime if you can get it along with 25-50% water changes will help get the ammonia down to safer levels.

Basically you're doing a fish in cycle at this point 

[banasophia]

3 minutes ago, Ratvan said:

Daily dosing of Seachem Prime if you can get it along with 25-50% water changes will help get the ammonia down to safer levels.

Basically you're doing a fish in cycle at this point 

Yeah, that’s another option I considered (or add Prime right now to detoxify the ammonia/nitrite immediately, keep the fish, add the BioSpira), but I think that will be much more complicated and worrisome for a new hobbyist with some testing issues I don’t want to get into which I think would make it more confusing for our new friend, so I would not recommend that course of action. The goal is to keep the instructions and process smooth and easy as possible.
 

The BioSpira will most likely get ammonia and nitrite down by the day after it’s added without any extra water changes, repeated dosing of prime, and worrying... just need to add a nitrifying bacteria product that actually works as it’s supposed to rather than the Dr Tim’s which has had similar issues with several other new hobbyists I’ve helped.

 

I’m not sure at what level ammonia and nitrite will harm the fish so that’s why I would recommend rehoming the fish for a few days until the water is safe for it. If the original poster says they aren’t able to get the fish out, then I would provide additional instructions. 

[A.m.P]

Nitrite isn't likely to hurt saltwater fish under 50-100, however essentially any ammonia is causing ongoing, immediate damage.

[Aayyee]

Thank you all for you input it has helped.. I returned the fish and since have went thru a string of problem solving thankx to banasophia I finally found out that some pre mixed saltwater I bought at the lfs had ammoina in it.. MY LUCK.. so doc Tim's SUCKS and SO DOES there costumer service .. they more or less told me that there product was working just not instantly.. I asked with multiple emails y they claim that I can put a fish in instantly .. they stop replying.. so I have put in bio spria  and my ammoina spiked and went down and is holding steady .. at i would say .25 and my nitrite is at 1ppm and it did spike to 2ppm maybe a little more the colors on this api are kinda tricky to get down .. my salinity is 1.025 my ph went down to 7.8ish ... I went thru the ammoina badge stuff I got a faulty badge also .. so I have been sticking with .. TEST TEST TEST .. and test again....  my dry rock is starting to get a orangish brown ... I also have some pink spots about 4 of them to be exact and some of the orangish on my rock is now brown ..... is all this normal.. besides the lfs giving me saltwater with ammoina in it .... 

 

I know everyone hates the fish in cycle I had miss leading info from Mr saltwater on youtube .. I have since learned some valuable lessons ...

1 being fish in cycle is a no no for many reasons 

2 no such thing as an instant cycle 

And many more .. 

 

I appreciate everyone's input 

 

P.s.

I am cycling my light on 10 hours everyday 

[banasophia]

Yes, you have had an extremely unusual and challenging start to your tank. I’d probably just keep doing what you’re doing and just wait for the ammonia and nitrite to clear out at this point and treat it like a regular fishless cycle. Since the fish is no longer in there you can take your time and don’t have to worry about harming the fish.
 

I do personally like the method of using a fish or two along with good beneficial bacteria, kinda like you were originally trying to do, but I do usually wait a week or so and do testing first before adding the fish to be sure my equipment is functioning and everything is okay. 
 

The issue with the initial ammonia really added a challenge in your situation, and this is a good learning example to show why to test first before adding the fish. I think the good beneficial bacteria products can easily handle the small amount of ammonia a fish or two create, and in fact this is the ammonia source to grow the bacteria population when you use this method, but already having 1-2 ppm in the water itself was the problem since that was already a dangerous level for the fish that the bacteria couldn’t process fast enough.
 

One thing I am a bit worried about here is what else could have been in that water from your LFS because it shouldn’t have had any ammonia in it... wondering if it could have other contaminants... would be great to hear input from others whether they’ve seen LFS premixed water with 1-2 ppm ammonia?
 

TBH if it was me I’d probably remove that water and start over with Nutri-Seawater, which is what I use for starting my tanks, along with BioSpira and Dr Tim’s. 

[Clown79]

7 hours ago, banasophia said:

Yes, you have had an extremely unusual and challenging start to your tank. I’d probably just keep doing what you’re doing and just wait for the ammonia and nitrite to clear out at this point and treat it like a regular fishless cycle. Since the fish is no longer in there you can take your time and don’t have to worry about harming the fish.
 

I do personally like the method of using a fish or two along with good beneficial bacteria, kinda like you were originally trying to do, but I do usually wait a week or so and do testing first before adding the fish to be sure my equipment is functioning and everything is okay. 
 

The issue with the initial ammonia really added a challenge in your situation, and this is a good learning example to show why to test first before adding the fish. I think the good beneficial bacteria products can easily handle the small amount of ammonia a fish or two create, and in fact this is the ammonia source to grow the bacteria population when you use this method, but already having 1-2 ppm in the water itself was the problem since that was already a dangerous level for the fish that the bacteria couldn’t process fast enough.
 

One thing I am a bit worried about here is what else could have been in that water from your LFS because it shouldn’t have had any ammonia in it... wondering if it could have other contaminants... would be great to hear input from others whether they’ve seen LFS premixed water with 1-2 ppm ammonia?
 

TBH if it was me I’d probably remove that water and start over with Nutri-Seawater, which is what I use for starting my tanks, along with BioSpira and Dr Tim’s. 

I wonder if the fish store wasn't selling rodi or the filters not changed at all or frequently if that would be a cause for ammonia readings.

 

 

[Aayyee]

1 minute ago, Clown79 said:

I wonder if the fish store wasn't selling rodi or the filters not changed at all or frequently if that would be a cause for ammonia readings.

 

They never really said what the problem was they just told me they would replace it. Haha and they gave me a 50 dollar credit for my troubles. Haha 

 

I'm not going back there unless I need something that is sealed 

[Clown79]

21 minutes ago, Aayyee said:

They never really said what the problem was they just told me they would replace it. Haha and they gave me a 50 dollar credit for my troubles. Haha 

 

I'm not going back there unless I need something that is sealed 

Well to cut costs, filters may not be changed frequently or as needed, some stores only sell RO water instead of RODI.

 

This could be a possible reason for the ammonia levels or other contaminants were in the salt/water.

 

It's far cheaper and less frustrating to make your own water, you have control over the quality of it, consistency of salt used and parameters.