Low PH and dKH

[dawz2]

Long-time lurker, first-time poster!

Issue: First, I don't dose anything. Having problems with low PH and low dKH. Did 5 gallon water change on 7/13 (normally do weekly 2.5 gallon changes). Left for vacation. Did another 5-gallon water change on 7/23. Today, noticed the RFAs not opening fully. What's the best method to increase both PH and dKH without screwing everything else?! Thank you, in advance!

Jamin

 

7/24:

Calc (Red Sea test) - 420

dKH (Red Sea test) - 7.7

Mag - didn't test

pH (generic digital amazon) - 7.8

Salinity (refractometer) - 1.025

 

7/25:

Calc - 400

dKH - 7.7

Mag (Red Sea test) - 1340

pH - 7.7

Salinity - 1.025

 

Tank specs:

Age: started with 10 gallon standard in September 2016. Transitioned to 28 gallon in June 2017.

Equipment:

28 gallon JBJ nano cube

2 ea. Jebaeo SW-2 wavemakers

AI Prime HD

ATO

InTank filter chamber

  filter floss

  poly filter pad

  Chemi-Pure Blue

bag of Seachem Matrix

Inhabitants:

30 zoa polyps

12 green button polyps

2 large rhodactis

5 purple spotted mushrooms

Small colony green star polyps

15 rock flower anemones

1 small head purple tip frogspawn

1 blue velvet damsil

2 small clowns

1 cleaner shrimp

various cuc 

[romperstomper]

PH can be increased with good surface agitation and air flow (a well vented room ) and a lid with some air gaps ,I keep my alk near NSW levels so can not comment .

[Clown79]

When your alk is higher it should correct ph. They work together.

 

Surface water movement will help ph.

 

Oh also changes throughout the day. What time do you test it?

 

What salt are you using?

 

Have you tested your alk right after a waterchange? 

Have you tested your alk every day to determine if it's consumption?

 

You have to find out if your corals are consuming alk before doing anything for alk.

[bob115]

What are your typical parameters?

 

More gas exchange will help pH, open a window if you can.

 

Baked baking soda will raise alkalinity more or less alone. 

[dawz2]

On 7/29/2017 at 4:46 PM, romperstomper said:

PH can be increased with good surface agitation and air flow (a well vented room ) and a lid with some air gaps ,I keep my alk near NSW levels so can not comment .

The JBJ return pumps agitate the surface sufficiently and I don't use a lid.

 

On 7/29/2017 at 11:01 PM, Clown79 said:

Oh also changes throughout the day. What time do you test it?

I was aware of that so I tried to do the test at the same time each evening. About 7ish.

 

On 7/29/2017 at 11:01 PM, Clown79 said:

What salt are you using?

I purchase pre-mixed water from my LFS. I'm not certain which brand they use. I will find out.

 

On 7/29/2017 at 11:01 PM, Clown79 said:

Have you tested your alk right after a waterchange? 

Have you tested your alk every day to determine if it's consumption?

Yes and Yes. However, I've only recently purchased reliable test kits.

 

On 7/31/2017 at 4:26 AM, bob115 said:

What are your typical parameters?

My alk usually runs consistently at 9.5 and my pH used to sit on 8.3.

 

On 7/31/2017 at 4:26 AM, bob115 said:

More gas exchange will help pH, open a window if you can.

I will try this on a low temp evening (only gets down to 80 - 85 F typically).

 

On 7/31/2017 at 4:26 AM, bob115 said:

Baked baking soda will raise alkalinity more or less alone.

Do you have a link to an article that describes how to properly use baked baking soda? I don't want to chase a single parameter if it's going to cause an undesirable swing of another parameter!

 

Thank you, all, for providing assistance!!

[bob115]

20 minutes ago, dawz2 said:

Do you have a link to an article that describes how to properly use baked baking soda? I don't want to chase a single parameter if it's going to cause an undesirable swing of another parameter!

Baked baking soda, you could also just use baking soda for some of it, is basically just the alkalinity part of two part. It will raise alkalinity and pH. Over long periods of time it will also raise salinity because of the Sodium ion component.

[burtbollinger]

just my 2 cents... i'd shy away from baking some baking soda when there are wonderful and easy to use alternatives like ESV Bionic out there. 

 

My guess is 2-3 ML about 2x a week will be ideal...

 

unsolicited advice:  

• remove the button polyps...youre asking for trouble with them taking over
• follow the above advice on Ph then stop worrying about it...focus on Alk.
• buy a Hanna dKH checker ASAP
• tank sounds pretty, post some pics.

 

 

[dawz2]

1 hour ago, bob115 said:

Baked baking soda, you could also just use baking soda for some of it, is basically just the alkalinity part of two part. It will raise alkalinity and pH. Over long periods of time it will also raise salinity because of the Sodium ion component.

Thank you, I'll do some additional research.

 

1 hour ago, burtbollinger said:

just my 2 cents... i'd shy away from baking some baking soda when there are wonderful and easy to use alternatives like ESV Bionic out there. 

 

My guess is 2-3 ML about 2x a week will be ideal...

Hmmm, I'll have to look this stuff up.

 

1 hour ago, burtbollinger said:

• remove the button polyps...youre asking for trouble with them taking over
• follow the above advice on Ph then stop worrying about it...focus on Alk.
• buy a Hanna dKH checker ASAP
• tank sounds pretty, post some pics.

• I may eat my words, but I wish the button polyps would take over...or at least open. I've had them for just at 2 months and they refuse to open. They don't appear to be dying, but they aren't happy to be alive either. I've moved them around multiple times to test flow/lighting and nothing seems to help them.
• Which advice on pH? I don't have a cover, additional surface agitation would slop water over the edges, and the outdoor temp is currently too high to leave windows/doors open even for a brief period of time.
• The Red Sea test is super clean and quick. Seems to work just fine for me, but I have been drooling over the more dummy-proof testers.
• Thank you, I plan to start a build thread soon. In the meantime, here's a vid of my office 2.6 gallon pico (6 months old) https://youtu.be/CU40l4L_t68

[Clown79]

Using a 2 part like esv bionic is easier as it will keep your ca and alk balanced and no issues with salinity.

 

 

[Ebn]

What's your nitrates at? I don't see any issues with running at that dKH and it's what I run in my mostly SPS tank. 

 

 

pH swings throughout the day and I wouldn't worry about or chase it. 

 

 

Zoas and the corals you have listed do not mind dirtier water and if anything you might be stripping it out of the water by running the stuff in your intank chambers. Just run floss instead and see if their condition improves. 

[dawz2]

15 hours ago, Ebn said:

What's your nitrates at? I don't see any issues with running at that dKH and it's what I run in my mostly SPS tank. 

 

 

pH swings throughout the day and I wouldn't worry about or chase it. 

 

 

Zoas and the corals you have listed do not mind dirtier water and if anything you might be stripping it out of the water by running the stuff in your intank chambers. Just run floss instead and see if their condition improves. 

I appreciate your response. Like I said in an earlier response, these parameters are lower than what I'm used to. I'm trying to maintain the same levels as my water-change water to keep from large swings. Stability. My tank has always run undetectable nitrates and phosphates. 

[Ebn]

Okay, so let's examine this closer. You mentioned that you're currently at 7.7 to 7.8 dKH on the 28 gallon tank after doing 5 gallon water changes (~17.86% total volume if you had no rocks in the 28 gallon tank). We'll just round this down to 15% instead due to displacement from the rocks, sand, corals, etc. You also were at 9.5 and you want to head back into that dKH even though you don't need to be since you're running a ULNS (ultra low nutrient system) with no detectable nitrates and phosphates. At the same time you don't dose...

 

The only way that you can bring the dKH up higher than that and maintain it without dosing is by doing water changes. Let's also assume that your tank doesn't use any alk daily since you did back to back measurements from one day to the next (this will definitely change once things settle back in and grows). Do you know what your dKH is by chance from your source water that you're doing water changes with?