First SW tank - fish died, zoas closed. Need help

[Clown79]

Ok. I don't see anything drastic going on that caused the fishes death. I'd chalk it up to the fish died. We all go through it without a reason.

 

Personally i prefer mixing my own water. I like having the control of the water I choose to use, the salinity, and my parameters.

 

What I would do is:

 

Test your waterchange water(at 1.023 the parameters may be mixing at lower levels)

Document the alk.

 

Test alk after the waterchange- document it

 

Test it the next day.

 

See how much its changing and how often. This will determine how often you may need to dose and how much.

 

Mixing your own saltwater with a better salt may provide you with exactly what you need.

 

You don't have enough in the tank right now where there should be significant drops where dosing is required.

 

The lights on amazon on for freshwater. They won't support corals, they are designed just for viewing.

 

There are a few options for lights and depending on the corals you want to keep, depends on how much you will need to spend on lights.

 

I would not add any more coral until the light is upgraded.

 

Aquamaxx nemolight- good for softies and lps. You can try an sps up high in the tank.

 

Current orbit- same as above

 

Coral compulsion par 38 - the 35watt full spectrum dimmable

 

Ai Prime- you can keep anything

Nanobox- same

Mars Aqua- same

Evergrow- same

[NYfishies]

Lesson learned for sure. I thought I did my research on the firefish part and failed on that end. I do plan on getting two clowns somewhere down the line, a skunk cleaner shrimp, CUC crew, and maybe another firefish or royal grammar.

 

Question... I know it will take some time for my yasha goby to slowly come out more. But if he's eating and pooping in that tunnel of his wont that slowly create detritus build up? Is a pistol shrimp definitely needed to help with the house cleaning and also help the yasha come out of his shell more? I was afraid of getting a pistol shrimp because I didn't want it to make trophies out of my CUC's.

 

Get a little Randall's Pistol. They are adorable. I have never witnessed any of my Pistols going after my CUC - just my corals.

 

Highly recommend a pistol for your yasha!

[Nart]

Ok. I don't see anything drastic going on that caused the fishes death. I'd chalk it up to the fish died. We all go through it without a reason.

 

Personally i prefer mixing my own water. I like having the control of the water I choose to use, the salinity, and my parameters.

 

What I would do is:

 

Test your waterchange water(at 1.023 the parameters may be mixing at lower levels)

Document the alk.

 

Test alk after the waterchange- document it

 

Test it the next day.

 

See how much its changing and how often. This will determine how often you may need to dose and how much.

 

Mixing your own saltwater with a better salt may provide you with exactly what you need.

 

You don't have enough in the tank right now where there should be significant drops where dosing is required.

 

The lights on amazon on for freshwater. They won't support corals, they are designed just for viewing.

 

There are a few options for lights and depending on the corals you want to keep, depends on how much you will need to spend on lights.

 

I would not add any more coral until the light is upgraded.

 

Aquamaxx nemolight- good for softies and lps. You can try an sps up high in the tank.

 

Current orbit- same as above

 

Coral compulsion par 38 - the 35watt full spectrum dimmable

 

Ai Prime- you can keep anything

Nanobox- same

Mars Aqua- same

Evergrow- same

 

I really want another firefish, but at the same time I am afraid of it dying as I heard they are very easily stressed and finicky fishes. I might just get my 2 clowns and be done with it.

I will do all those test later this week. thank you for the great advices!

I do want the more powerful Mars Aqua lights, but the overhead space I have to work with is only about 14-16" from the top of the tank. I might just go with the Current Orbit lights. If I do get any SPS, it will just be the easy ones like birds nest or something.

 

 

Get a little Randall's Pistol. They are adorable. I have never witnessed any of my Pistols going after my CUC - just my corals.

 

Highly recommend a pistol for your yasha!

 

I think you just talked me into it... I have been talking myself out of it because of all the horror stories I read. I guess I will just figure it out in the long run

 

As for now... I really have nothing to look at in my tank. It's so sad. My Yasha goby hides 24/7 and only 1/5 of my zoas are open.

I am going to get the lights this week and stop by my LFS and maybe just pick up a cleaner shrimp and a pistol shrimp.

[burtbollinger]

nothing beats clowns. I'd personally skip the firefish.

 

birdsnest not easy as is claimed.

[Clown79]

There is no "easy" sps. Keeping them happy especially in mixed reef, is a lot of dedication.

 

If goig with lps and softies the aquamaxx(i have one) is great. The orbits will work too.

 

As for the alkalinity test. The API instructions are confusing. I have found various copies online, some say green, so. Say yellow is the final results. My printout said lime.

 

Go with what your instructions say for kh

[Nart]

nothing beats clowns. I'd personally skip the firefish.

 

birdsnest not easy as is claimed.

 

Damn ya'll give great advice.

I think I will skip firefish all together and get a pair of clowns.

 

 

 

There is no "easy" sps. Keeping them happy especially in mixed reef, is a lot of dedication.

 

If goig with lps and softies the aquamaxx(i have one) is great. The orbits will work too.

 

As for the alkalinity test. The API instructions are confusing. I have found various copies online, some say green, so. Say yellow is the final results. My printout said lime.

 

Go with what your instructions say for kh

 

Again. Thank you for the great advices!

 

I am going to just stick with my original plan and please do correct/advise me if it looks off to you.

 

In this order... I will be stocking the tank very slowly letting things establish:

Zoas - 3-5 different colors

Acan

GSP

Frogspawn

Candy cane

Mushroom

 

(Not sure if I should even consider any of these once the tank has aged a bit)

Mini carpet anemone

Duncan

Hammer or Leather

Toadstool

[NYfishies]

 

I really want another firefish, but at the same time I am afraid of it dying as I heard they are very easily stressed and finicky fishes. I might just get my 2 clowns and be done with it.

I will do all those test later this week. thank you for the great advices!

I do want the more powerful Mars Aqua lights, but the overhead space I have to work with is only about 14-16" from the top of the tank. I might just go with the Current Orbit lights. If I do get any SPS, it will just be the easy ones like birds nest or something.

 

 

I think you just talked me into it... I have been talking myself out of it because of all the horror stories I read. I guess I will just figure it out in the long run

 

As for now... I really have nothing to look at in my tank. It's so sad. My Yasha goby hides 24/7 and only 1/5 of my zoas are open.

I am going to get the lights this week and stop by my LFS and maybe just pick up a cleaner shrimp and a pistol shrimp.

 

As for your Zoa's... I have not had time to read through this thread, but i see in your OP that you use a ton of filtration.

 

I, like you, in the beginning used Purigen, CHemi-Pure Blue, Phosgaurd, ect. I do not use any know. Just GAC (carbon) and some ROWAphos in my mixed reef and as of yesterday I run nothing, but a skimmer and filter sock in my zoa garden.

 

1.023 is a little low too for the salinity. I keep mine at 1.0264 (35 ppt).

[burtbollinger]

this might be unpopular, and just one opinion....but I'd avoid acans for a long while....to me, they are an advanced LPS no matter what people say. I had a run with them but they went downhill and it was depressing...because they were so beautiful and expensive. seeing them shrink and die was a memorable low point of the hobby for me.

 

if you do get acans, I'd ensure your tank was super stable and you've read yourself up to expert level.

 

for your order...i'd go softies first then LPS, with acans last.

 

this is a better order...and please note this is an ambitious mixed reef, but your rockwork is set up pretty sweet and would seemingly accomodate....

 

1. Zoas (3-5 different colors)
2. GSP (skip this....OR small chunk, off rocks, on a seperated island)
3. Leather (a small neon green toadstool or a small frag of green crown leather) (I'd keep on a side away from my LPS)
4. Mushroom (these can spread...I'd personally skip or be very selective....or go with ricordea)
5. Candy cane
6. Frogspawn
7. Duncan
8. Hammer (I'd go with branching, probably avoid wall hammer)
9. Mini carpet anemone
10. Acan (don't go crazy here, one colony at a time. You might have great or bad luck)

Also, with all these LPS, youre certainly gonna need to be up to speed on dosing your tank with something like 2 part to keep alk. and calcium (and magnesium) in check....

[Clown79]

Corals need some nutrients so don't go heavy on filteration. Use phosguard as needed, when needed.

Use carbon and purigen in smaller quantities.

 

Leathers and zoas are great to start with.

 

Gsp, keep on singular rock or glue them on the back wall.

 

Frogspawn, duncans, hammers are fairly easy but stick to branching not anchora.

 

For me, I've had great success with acans and favia. Some ppl have issues with these and others not. Its the same with zoas and certain sps. There is no known reason.

 

The one thing for certain, acans and favia don't like high flow or high light.

 

Don't get peppermint shrimp, they love eating acans and zoas.

 

Carpet anemone, I'd wait until the system is more stable. Fyi: these pack a good punch so don't touch it with bare hands.

[Nart]

@burtbollinger I love the recommendations! Will definitely use it as my coral stocking guideline. Thank you for the kind words on my rock work. Really means a lot especially to an amateur just starting.

 

@clown79 understood. I can be a it excessive when I go extreme so I thought there would be no problem with over chemical filtration to remove the origami a and by-product.

 

I have since removed pretty much all my chemical filtration. The only thing I have in my HoB filter is my Matrix bio-media and filter floss. I have a ton of space left in the HOB now that I removed the chemical bags. Do you guys have anything you would recommend putting back there? I was thinking some chaeto? Or macro algae of some sort... But then I'll have to run a light.. And heard that it might not help at all being that it is just a small quantity of macro algae.

 

Thanks all again. I am stopping by my LFS to pick up some RODI water and MIGHT get a pistol/cleaner shrimp. Will keep ya posted and post some pics of my tank progress.

[Clown79]

Carbon. I'd use matrix carbon.

 

Phosguard use as needed.

[ninjamyst]

Carbon. I'd use matrix carbon.

 

Phosguard use as needed.

+1. I like mixing my own so I control the quantity I add in. Seachem Matrix + Phosguard is a great mix.

[burtbollinger]

micro algae in that small of a space isnt gonna do anything. skip it.

[Nart]

Carbon. I'd use matrix carbon.

 

Phosguard use as needed.

Roger that.

 

+1. I like mixing my own so I control the quantity I add in. Seachem Matrix + Phosguard is a great mix.

 

Yeah. When I go to my LFS today I will ask them what salinity do they mix their saltwater at. when I tested, it was 1.022. But their digital scale usually reads .001 higher than my refractometer. If it is in fact 1.022, I will just buy RODI from them and mix my own with Reef Crystals. The only trouble I will have is figuring out how much KH buffer to add to my saltwater mixes, but when I cross that bridge I will reach out to ya'll.

 

micro algae in that small of a space isnt gonna do anything. skip it.

Roger that.

 

 

Tested my water parameter last night. Everything is about the same. I am in the process of getting a new light by the way. However, my zoas are weird. On one of the colony, the big polyps will not open, but the tiny ones are open wide. As for my other colony, about 1/2 is open. Yasha goby is still alive and kicking.

I did test my KH yesterday though and its at 9 drops. whoo hoo.

[burtbollinger]

if you end up mixing your own water (which you should be...and making your own RO/DI) you have zero need for Kh buffer.

[Nart]

So I stopped by my LFS yesterday... Will need ya'll to help me figure out some chemistry stuff.

 

I brought my water for them to do a full test for me just to double check my numbers. They use a mix of red sea, salifert, and Hannah test kits and tested my phosphate, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, calcium, kh, and salinity. Everything matched up to my tests perfectly except the salinity level. They tested my salinity at 1.021 (with a Hannah digital test) and when I tested my salinity level (I use a refractometer), before and after going to the LFS, it was 1.023. He asked if I used a solution to calibrate my refractometer. I said no, I just use your RODI and calibrate it to 0. Does anyone have advice on this? Do I need a solution to calibrate my refractometer?

 

Oh - I also asked them about their saltwater mix and they say they make it at 1.023 to 1.024 and also said I should not need to buffer my kh. I just remembered, prior to going to this LFS, I was going to another LFS and also used NutriSea water to start my tank, so that's why my KH might have been low to start out with.

 

Sorry for all the questions and appreciate all your help!

So exciting news yesterday... since we chalked up my purple firefish death as unknown and my water parameters came back perfect. I picked up some fishes! My LFS had just received a huge order of clown fishes, ranging from snowflakes, to Darwin F2s, to Onyx, and Da Vincis. I wanted everything... but I was not about to drop that kind of money. I decided to go with this black juvenile clown fish that I have seen there since my first time at this LFS. He's not bonded with anyone so I got my LFS to pick out a regular juvenile ocellaris clown. Went home and acclimated exactly to how everyone recommended here and here they are...

 

 

I decided to go with the Current Orbit Marine LED.
Now I will have to figure out how to do a mesh lid...

 

Again. Thanks a lot all.

 

Oh.... I also found my first bristleworm on my Fiji live rock this morning. Gross and creepy as fudge.

[burtbollinger]

yes, you need a solution that is sold to calibrate the refractometer....it comes in at 1.026. you calibrate it to that.

 

https://www.saltwateraquarium.com/seawater-35-ppt-refractometer-salinity-calibration-solution-60-ml-aquacraft/?utm_medium=googleshopping&utm_source=bc&gclid=CPLInpnHztECFQ2IaQodozQKjg

 

at 1.021, I dont think I'd say your parameters are perfect

 

fish look nice.

 

get your water situation sorted for the next 30 days...no more additions for a month.

 

get your refractometer dialed in, and explore the possibility of RO/DI, mixing your own water, if that was the plan. Relying on store water mixed to 1.023 isn't something I'd tolerate for any longer than I had to. Worst case, I'd be buying only their RO/DI and mixing my own good salt...and mixing it to 1.025 or 1.026.

 

get your light.

[Nart]

@burtbollinger thank you. I just ordered the solution off amazon. My RODI water calibration theory was flawed.

 

I will get the water situation sorted!

Unfortunately, I will not be able to obtain an RODI unit at this moment. I am already way over budget on my saltwater tank. The Mrs. is slowly getting agitated with my spending

 

Light arrives tomorrow! Excited.

 

Oh... so I noticed white dots on my zoas. I thought they were just spec of sand or something. I google up white dots on zoa... and sure enough it matched up to Zoa Pox. Apparently there's no known reasons for zoa pox, but theory is that it may be due to stress. It must've been from my terrible acclimation process. SOB! If it's not one thing, it's another. Furan-2 is on it's way. Hopefully I will be able to save these zoas. Stay tuned...

[burtbollinger]

sounds good....do consider just buying RO/DI and doing your own mixing when you can.

 

new light gonna make a big difference...your current light is just not up to it.

 

As far as zoas...thats one coral I don't have any interest in anymore outside maybe one or two specific colorations. http://vividaquariums.com/products/orange-bam-bam-zoanthids

some varieties just are not any fun.

[Clown79]

Yes, calibration fluid is nore accurate than any other method. I suggest calibrating refractometers monthly to ensure accuracy.

 

I would slowly increase your salinity.

 

If you can't invest in an ro/di unit, buying distilled for top ups and mixing waterchange water is the next best thing because the water you buy may be mixed at lower salinity therefore it will always be an issue

[RayWhisperer]

I skimmed through this. I agree with most all advice given. However, I didn't see much thought given to the zoas closing up and the low alk. IME, zoas are among the first to react to low alk. In all of my tanks they were always my "canary" for alk levels. Anything below NSW, and they close up. Once below 6 dkh, they start melting away.

 

Now I see you have white spots on them, as well. If it is zoa pox, I don't have any experience with that. However, have you considered other pests? I know you said you've dipped them. As for zoas, the only dip I trust is fresh water. I've tried all kinds of products. Nothing gets the critters out as fast as fresh water.

[Nart]

Thought I update everyone on my tank progress.

 

Received my Furan-2 medication, calibration fluid,and new light fixture! The Zoas after two furan2 dip and with the new lights are opening up nicely. Calibrated my refract to 1.026 with the calibration fluid. Slowly raising my salinity level. It is currently at 1.023. All other water parameters are perfect. Nitrates went to < 10ppm. Did a 25% water change.

All fishes are alive and well. The yasha goby is starting to dig himself a home in various parts of the rock work.

 

I am seeing a light diatom bloom. Any recommendation for removal? Or do I just water change and wait this out as my water chemistry balances out?

 

Also, I am looking into building a 10g sump right below. I might need help with the overflow pipes ?

[burtbollinger]

 

I am seeing a light diatom bloom. Any recommendation for removal? Or do I just water change and wait this out as my water chemistry balances out?

 

 

wait it out, keep up with water changes.

[Clown79]

Diatoms are normal. They exhaust themselves and disappear. I never really saw any cuc eat them.

 

Nitrates at 10 isn't a huge deal. You want some nutrients in the water.

[Nart]

That's what I was thinking. To just keep up with weekly water changes and wait it out. I wasn't sure if I had to manually brush them off my rock. I saw some diatoms on my zoas too I think and read that it could possibly overtake and kill them?

 

My new lights are in and also made a DIY mesh lid. My only concern currently with this setup is that I am getting some light water splashes onto the light cover on the left side of where the HOB is. I might cut a piece of acrylic to block that portion off. I am afraid of the moisture add up, and salt creep mixed along with the electrical lighting can be a fire hazard. Thoughts?

 

Also - how long do you guys run your lights and at what intensity level?

 

So here's the before picture of my two zoas with not getting enough lighting and just starting to get the zoa pox.

 

Here's a picture of them now after 3 Furan-2 treatments and with the new lights running for a few days.

 

If you notice my yellow/blue zoa looked like it lost some polyps on the top-mid section, but is quickly growing more polyps on the bottom. As for the purple/green zoa it is really fluffing up more. I am going to monitor it for a few more days, if all is well I am going to putty it down to the rocks.