Dosing via water top-offs (what can I combine)

[ddwbeagles]

Guys, quick question for you. I have limitted cabinet space and wife is a real stickler that everything needs to be hidden. Anyway, straight to the point. In addition to the two part alk & calcium solutions, I still find myself needing to routinely dose with Magnessium, liquid calcium, Iodine/Iodide. Truth be told, these (other than the standard reef tests (Nitrate, Nitrite, Ammonia, Phosphorous, etc....) are all that I test for. Straight to the question. Would it be safe to combine these three elements together in my single ATO container?

[~Reefur~]

Would it be safe to combine these three elements together in my single ATO container?

 

No harm in trying, I would recommend putting a circulation pump of some kind in the Top Off container. I have heard of people doing similar things, including mixing phyto as a top off. I however haven't really asked what the outcome has been like. All I can say is that this was common practice with a few people I share the hobby with, I just don't have any experience to share on this subject. I would try and find out if the items you does have any reaction to fresh water opposed to saltwater.

[Militant Jurist]

Be sure to check the containers of each supplement. I know my iodine has a warning to not mix with other supplements outside of the tank.

[bluefunelement]

I just use ALK in it and when I did mix ALk+CA it precipitated so no go for me -

Following along though....

[dutch27]

The only downside I can see to dosing via top-off is if your evaporation rate fluctuates with the season. i.e. in the summer you evaporate out more water if you use fans to keep the tank cool, so you end up dosing more heavily than intended as you use up more top off than in other times of the year.

 

Other than that I don't see why you can't just combine it all into the ATO other than checking up on warnings like Jurist suggested.

[yardboy]

First, why would you need to dose 2 part calcium and liquid calcium (whatever that is)?

Mixing calcium chloride and sodium carbonate (the two part will result in a precipitate calcium carbonate, no good for dosing.

I also thinking you may not be measuring your magnesium accurately as you shouldn't have to do a daily dose of magnesium. Just thinking.

[Amphiprion1]

You can add the calcium and iodide together, but not the magnesium (unless you only use magnesium chloride). If you use magnesium sulfate, you'll get calcium sulfate precipitation. Just remember to keep track of how much you use and the concentration. IMHO, it'd be easier to keep up with separate additions, though. Also remember that you won't get the same solubility--depending on the strength, there would be little added magnesium in solution with calcium chloride and vice versa. One other reason to keep them separate.

 

Edit: I agree that magnesium shouldn't have to be added daily. I add some diluted magnesium solution daily (along with 2 part), but that is for convenience only.

[ddwbeagles]

First, why would you need to dose 2 part calcium and liquid calcium (whatever that is)?

Mixing calcium chloride and sodium carbonate (the two part will result in a precipitate calcium carbonate, no good for dosing.

I also thinking you may not be measuring your magnesium accurately as you shouldn't have to do a daily dose of magnesium. Just thinking.

 

Good question and I'll try to explain or clarify. I use the Kent two part Alk/Cal suppliment routinely. However (and this may be my downfall or misunderstanding). I use them on a 1 to 1 basis. Meaning (hypothetically) if I need a 5ml dose of Part 1 to reach my desired Alk level, I also use 5ml or Part 2 to raise calcium. Yet, by doing that, my calcium tends to stay around 400-420 ppm. So, I have been using a sererate liquid calcium (not a 2 part solution) to furter raise calcium levels up to about 450 ppm. Make sense? .....and I know you can NOT combine the two part solutions together due to them precipitating out of the water column. Hence why I was wondering if the straight liquid calcium could be added to the ATO?

 

As far as Magnessium, Here I'm baffled too. Without dosing at all and with 10% weekly water changes using Instant Ocean's Reef mix, my MG levels stay way too low (i.e 1200 to 1300 ppm). Currently I'm not manually dosing any of the above on a daily basis, but do it about twice a week. And I can not explain why I have such a MG depleation rate. I did test using two kits (Red Sea & API) and got the same results. As you can tell, I am no reefing chemist, but have to wonder if MG depleation is due to skimming as I don't think my tank inhabitants (mixed reef) are using it that quickly.

[Amphiprion1]

Good question and I'll try to explain or clarify. I use the Kent two part Alk/Cal suppliment routinely. However (and this may be my downfall or misunderstanding). I use them on a 1 to 1 basis. Meaning (hypothetically) if I need a 5ml dose of Part 1 to reach my desired Alk level, I also use 5ml or Part 2 to raise calcium. Yet, by doing that, my calcium tends to stay around 400-420 ppm. So, I have been using a sererate liquid calcium (not a 2 part solution) to furter raise calcium levels up to about 450 ppm. Make sense? .....and I know you can NOT combine the two part solutions together due to them precipitating out of the water column. Hence why I was wondering if the straight liquid calcium could be added to the ATO?

 

As far as Magnessium, Here I'm baffled too. Without dosing at all and with 10% weekly water changes using Instant Ocean's Reef mix, my MG levels stay way too low (i.e 1200 to 1300 ppm). Currently I'm not manually dosing any of the above on a daily basis, but do it about twice a week. And I can not explain why I have such a MG depleation rate. I did test using two kits (Red Sea & API) and got the same results. As you can tell, I am no reefing chemist, but have to wonder if MG depleation is due to skimming as I don't think my tank inhabitants (mixed reef) are using it that quickly.

 

What are the magnesium concentrations in the mixed water? FWIW 1300 ppm isn't too low and right around what natural seawater values are (~1280 ppm). Your calcium may not be staying that high because it is eventually precipitating--meaning that you may be perpetually precipitating it by adding more--due to the alkalinity. So that also brings the alkalinity into question and how high it is. But if magnesium is low, you'll get poor solubility of either, so it comes full circle. If your salt mix is low, you are tossing magnesium away every time you change the water. Therefore, your first course of action should be to verify that and add accordingly. Also keep in mind that precipitation will also reduce soluble magnesium, assuming that is occurring.

[ddwbeagles]

Clear as mud now.....lol Joking, what you say makes a lot of sense and I know I'm not using a premium salt. I've been chasing this "circle or cycle" for a few weeks now. Your train of thought has really help and gave me one of those head slap moments. I'll mix up a new batch of SW (heated, covered and agitated) and test that after a 24 hour period. It may be at least partially the source or cause of some of my headaches. Thanks Amphiphrion !

[Amphiprion1]

No problem. I had done this in the past and had racked my brain trying to find out why when it suddenly dawned on me.

[moto826]

i put fuel in my top off and works good after i started it a few weeks later my zoas started to grow faster hope that helps