Best ways to get Acros to color up?

[Jahkaya]

What techniques do you use to color up your acros? Here's what I know some are:

 

20k Lighting, More Actinic, Higher intensity.

 

Heavier Skimming, more Feeding.

 

I have also head a more nutrient rich tank can also help provide the coral with caretenoids needed to make colors. In My case it has only been green.

 

Other Ideas?

[Jahkaya]

Per Dave in the "could I keep a clam in this" thread, Is the reason that no one is responding to this one is because I am drooling on my keyboard?

 

Drip, Drip Slobber.

 

Well allow me to be more specific.

 

I am more interested on the Role that nutrients play on the Color of Corals. I know we strive for nutrient poor tanks (in most cases) and dose and feed to make up for the lack of nutrients. But what are your opinions on the Colors a coral would have in a High nutrient tank as opposed to a nutrient poor tank. Feeding as opposed to not feeding.

 

Any input, or is every just trying to keep their corals alive no matter what color. I don't know about you guys but I get the corals for their color.

[MrKrispy]

Hey, I got an acro that is friggin white, I am just trying to figure out if it is going to turn ANY color! I see the tiny green polyps so something is going on.

 

Carotenoids? Are you going to throw some Naked Juice carrot wheatgrass blend in?

 

[Crakeur]

jah, I don't know if this helps but in my bryopsis filled 7 I had brown acros (bought them brown) that turned all different colors. One turned red with purple polyps, another turned green with lighter green polyps.

 

In my current tank I am having trouble keeping acros. Some do fine and others, do not. color faded on my highlighter yellow to a deeper green. I have an electric green hydno that has no hair like polyps and a brown hydno (from a green mother that lost it's color under pc's) that is starting to color up.

 

Marc Weiss sells some stuff that claims it helps boost pigmentation in corals. I have tried some of his stuff (dna/black powder mix at the moment) and haven't noticed much of a change but I do see a ton of tunicates and sponges growing in the caves and crevices.

 

I think it's more about the light than anything else really. If there is plenty of food in the tank, the coral doesn't need to rely on photosynthesis as much. However, not enough nutrients in the tank and the coral usually dies.

 

ok, I have no friggin clue. corals are a mystery to me.

[kennerd]

One of the things I've read, the pigement in SPS is a actually a defense against UV burn. This is why wild collected SPS can have some amazing coloration that fades in even some of the most brightly lit tanks.

 

IMO, want brighter colors, more light! I have noticed brighter coloration of corals in my 65 gal when I upped one side from 175 to 250, using the same spectrum bulb (10kk)

[Crakeur]

lower kelvin is supposed to be better too but that yellow light is so damned ugly

[kennerd]

I know the lower kelvin lighting generally has a higher PAR value, which is why a lot of people use iwasaki 6500k bulbs. Agreed that they are nasty looking unless you actinic the living crap out of them.

[tinyreef]

Is the reason that no one is responding to this one is because I am drooling on my keyboard?

not at all, i actually meant to reply a couple of times but i still haven't tried the V8 juice thing yet.

 

carotenoids are the key imo. themselves, the b-carots, are reddish or yellowish colored, absorbing blue and green and reflecting the other colors. while phycobilins absorb blue light (and maybe another, green?). they both shift the light energy of what they absorbed to another spectrum (red/yellow) to 'feed' the chlorophyll present. some of the phyco and carot light shift may 'bleed' out and thus create fluorescence. (btw tiny's making this up as he goes along, sounds good don't it tho?) X)

 

the fact they absorb certain colors and not others defines them as pigments. so logically they should be present in colorful corals (sounds good to me at least).

 

i only say carots are key because it's easily to obtain and dose than the various types of phycobilins or chlorophylls. i'm definitely going to try the V8 but i'm waiting to recover from OTS on my display tank and the eviction of the fugger from my nano.

[Jahkaya]

The Weirdest thing about my coloration is comparing coral in my tank to my friend's.

 

His Tank:

 

150g with 6 VHO's (160w each: 3-actinic; 2-50/50; 1-10k Aquasun) and 2 96w PC actinics. Decent skimmer 24/7. With the exception of a recent move(5 months ago) , tank is about three years old. High number of fish fed daily. No feeding of corals. CA reactor, mixed SPS/softy reef. 29gallon Fuge. little to no dosing.

 

The acro in question (mirothalamus sp. I think) is stark white with hues of pink/blue, light green polyps. VERY LITTLE to NO POLYP EXTENSION.

 

My Tank:

 

Standard 20 with 4 75w VHO (2-actinic; 1-50/50; 1-aquasun). 8 months old. Three gallon fuge, skim with 100g rated prism during lights off only (the only time my space allows me to is with the canopy off.) Over fed with GP's, changed to twice a week recently, only two fish, fed lightly. Water changes once every 10 days or so. Dose with calcuim and buffer alternating each every other day.

 

Acro in my tank has Crazy polyp extension, but is brown with bright green polyps and baby blue tips.

 

Can anyone Tell me WHY?

 

Lighting seems to be very similar, although he has a bit more blue. I have to think it has to do with water quality. If you need more specs, let me know.

[kennerd]

OK, here's another thought.

 

1. his polyps extension issue may be due to the presence of something that is nipping at his corals. I had the same problem before I was able to get rid of the flame angel in the tank (OK, the blackout did it for me, admittedly, and thankfully). Now, I get fantastic polyp extension.

 

2. In different systems, some people have experienced corals turning to a common color. This may be caused by a more dominant type of zoox algae that is better adapted to your individual system.

 

Interesting thread about jus tthat right here:

 

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.p...threadid=253929

 

Next: do you have any leathers or softies in your tank? Other reading I have done had indicated that the presence of leather corals in the tank may cause browing out of some some SPS due to the toxins contained in them.. I have experienced better coloration since removing the big ones in my tank, specifically in the acros that were in the vicinity of the leathers.

[tinyreef]

i'm assuming the two acros are daughter frags from the same original coral thus you're comparing them. otherwise, it'd be comparing an washington apple to a florida orange and wondering why they're different. (btw it's not a slam, jah)

 

if they're from the same coral i would tend to agree that it's water quality, i.e. food input, salt, dosing, plankton internally generated, filtration (water clarity), flow dynamics, and maybe even surface turbulence.

 

are the two corals about the same distance from their respective lights? (altho your friend's are a little lower intensity than yours, watts over area) bulb age the same?

 

edit: ken has a very good point about co-inhabitants affecting the health and appearance of other livestock.

[kennerd]

sank you, Tiny-san (not a jab, either: I know you're not japanese!)

[Jahkaya]

A few More details.

 

Ken, good call on the Polyp extension. He has two flame angels in his tank. That makes sense, now. As for that reefcentral thread, been there, read that, thanks though.. My friend has a Green sinularia in his tank that is about 18"x18" and hundreds of mushroom and quite a few toadstools. I have a small piece of the sinualria, 1 small Toadstool and 2 mushrooms.

 

Okay tiny,

 

Both daughter frags, in fact my frag is directly from his tank. Same exact coral. Same Salt, My friend does more skimming and has three seaswirls with 3/4 in outputs. I am unsure about the GPH on his tank. I have two 300GPH powerheads and an old 200 GPH for the fuge. The Powerhead is blowing ALMOST directly on my frag.

 

My bulbs are newer execpt for his one Aquasun. My acro is about 6-12" closer to the light.

 

I guess we have successfully narrowed it down to water quality and filtration. It seems I just need to test all of our water parameters using the same test kits, then do a plankton test (how the hell do you do that) and I will have my answer.

 

I am just a reefer not a scientist. I will just have to tinker more with my tank and beef up the filtration.

 

I thought it was that I just fed too much. Thanks guys.

[tinyreef]

My acro is about 6-12" closer to the light.

that is a HUGE difference. 1"~3" is not much but your difference is enormous. especially given the scale we're talkin' about, 18" tank vs. 30" tank?

 

besides the fact he's throwing his light over a greater area and probably has more fish pee :x than you, the greater distance diffuses more light the farther you go. logarithmically or whatever. i.e. twice as far, a quarter as much photons.

[kennerd]

Originally posted by Jahkaya

then do a plankton test (how the hell do you do that)  

 

By taste. duh:

 

The effect of having something relatively predatory in an SPS tank is really amazing. My monti digs completely changed growth pattern when they were introduced to the tank with the flame. They went from leggy, branchy corals to encrusting with small spikes so that the polyps could be open and protected between the spikes.

 

 

 

 

Along with a pic of them 2 years ago when I got the frags

[tinyreef]

ken, your monti was givin' you the finger in the last pic!

[kennerd]

hehe: yep! Actually, when I first posted the pics of the pink one, someone called it Montipora Helmetata.

 

OK, you want to see what different lighting will do to the same frag? Here's a series of photos of a frag I got around the same time.

 

 

#1 frag when I got it: came from a 130 with 2x400w halides

[kennerd]

Next, a year later after being under 2x32w PC's & just after it was transplanted into the 65 (had 4x96 PC's on there @ the time of the pic)

 

BTW: The other acros in the background are now purple with blue polyps on the left and purple tipped with neon green polyps on the right .

[kennerd]

and under 175w halide for two months.

 

UNder the 250 now, the tips are nearly a cobalt-navy blue wiith a purple tone and the brnaches are more of a cream color which flouresces green under actinics.

[kennerd]

Last one. This is the coral in the back right two pics ago, as uner 175 a few months ago. The color has turned nearly a pale milk chocolate with transluscent purple tips and major green polyp extension.

 

FYI: The two background corals actually arrived after 3 days in a box and 40 degree weather and all lived without acclimation.

[kennerd]

Well, in truth, I won't go with anything but halides if there are SPS in the tank. The difference in coloration that I've experienced is extremely dramatic.

[Jahkaya]

Okay Ken, Halides being said, What has more Par?

 

300w VHO over a 20H or

 

175w MH 20k with 36w Actinic over an 18H.

 

What'd ya think?

[tinyreef]

What has more Par?

probably the mh as it's spot lighting versus the vho, which spreads light evenly over the entire tank. a lot of the mh light is concentrated, thus more shadows. that said, i prefer the actinic quality of vho's over 20000K mh's.

[Jahkaya]

I agree with the Atinic VHO's. NOTHING beats them. I intend to put the Actinic with the 20k and see how blue it is. I like lot's of blue. If it is too blue I will switch it out for an AB or look into the new Coralvues. I can't remember which 10k had the best par rating. Was it the ushios?

[kennerd]

What type and wattage of halie did you get again, Jah?