Calcium, DKH, and Magnesium LOW!

[phinfan78]

Hello

 

Having a problem with my Calcium, DKH, and Magnesium. I have a solana system which has been running for 1 year. Using Red Sea salt for my water changes. But even after my five gallon change my readings are as follows. Calcium: 300ppm Carbonate hardness DKH: 8* Mag: 1000 I have both A&B calcium buffer and a magnesium buffer that I am just starting to use. Cant figure out why these seem to n ot go up even after a water change. All other parameters are good. Any help would be appreciated.

 

~PhinFan

[Growerguy]

What kind of coral do you have in there?

[bdare]

Have you measured your freshly mixed water before you add it to your tank???

[Weetabix7]

From what I've been told by other reefers, Kent A & B is not the best supplement to get Ca, Alk, and Mg up.

 

Look into using B-Ionic by ESV, and do test your freshly made SW before doing a WC to make sure that isn't the culprit.

[phinfan78]

What kind of coral do you have in there?

 

I only have some softies right now. zoos and mushrooms, zenias. Purchased a month ago from someone who had the system running for 1year. I have the read sea coral pro salt.

 

I will test my freshly mixed water and see what the parameters are,, also I purchased some of the dd H2o salt because im pretty sure its my salt. Heard good things about this salt so I bought the small bucket to try out. Thank You all I am new to posting but have been reading for a while and appreciate the help!

 

~Phin

[The Propagator]

B-ionic will rais you PH dramatically diredctly after use. I would use backing soad for that instead. which slightly ( and I do me slightly ) and temporarily lowers PH. Then I would use seachem liquid calcium, or old stock Dow flake to raise calcium.

[disaster999]

remember 5 gal is only %14.7 the total volume of the whole tank. dont think that changing 5gal water on your tank will magically bump your parameters to normal.

 

like others said, test the newly made salt water to see what the calc, dkh and mag level is at. also, what type of test kits are you using

[phinfan78]

Thanks I am usung the marine lab reef kit also w the MG kit which takes a while to use. I tested my 5 gal of fresh water with red sea coral pro salt that I have been using and heres what I got. Calcium 1300 dkh 7* Mg 1100. Better readings than my tank but not by much. Also I recently upgraded my skimmer to a tunze 9002 dont no if that could make a difference.

[phinfan78]

just been reading about the red sea mg kit which I have been using, it sounds like a real peace maybe thats the problem.

[disaster999]

red sea test kits are generally crap. esp the mag test. salifert and elos test kits will yield a more accurate result. i would find someone or a LFS with those test kits and compare the results

 

1300ppm for calcium????

[phinfan78]

Ok thanks I will look for another test kit. I hate when I buy something and its not useful. Oh well guess thats what I get for not researching first

 

sorry CA 300

[disaster999]

for calcium, alk nitrate, nitrite, ammonia, phosphate, ph...go with API cheap and good reliable test kits

 

for mag, ill pick elos or salifert.

[phinfan78]

Ok So ? I once again tested my CA, Mg, and KH in My tank and in my freshly mixed water. My readings are still whacked in my tank. Ca: 300 KH:10 which is cool MG: 1000

 

In fresh water mixed with same salt always used CA: 440 KH:7 MG: 1300

also noticed some zenias have slowly started wilting up to the point now there pretty much all wilted.

Help Please!

[Nosey]

Can't realy help, but i'm having problems with my Alc ass well!, just thought i would tell you your not alone!

[bdare]

Ok So ? I once again tested my CA, Mg, and KH in My tank and in my freshly mixed water. My readings are still whacked in my tank. Ca: 300 KH:10 which is cool MG: 1000

 

In fresh water mixed with same salt always used CA: 440 KH:7 MG: 1300

also noticed some zenias have slowly started wilting up to the point now there pretty much all wilted.

Help Please!

 

Something is definitely not right. With the list of corals you have there is no way your water parameter should drop to where they are based on where your freshly mixed water is.

 

Unfortunately, this usually leads to only one thing: User Error.

 

How are you measuring your SG / salinity? In my opinion anything other than a refractomter calibrated with calibration fluid (NOT RO/DI) is inadequate.

 

Are you still using Red Sea test kits? As others have stated they are GARBAGE. You need to get Salifer, Elos, API or LaMotte. Anything else just doesn't hold up.

 

The numbers of your freshly mixed water are pretty close to what one would expect for Red Sea Pro:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthre...hreadid=1287118

 

What is the SG of your tank? What is the SG of your freshly mixed water? I would doulbe check these to make sure we aren't comparing apples to oranges.

 

I know that new tanks and those with a lot of coraline can consume Alk and Ca in pretty demanding rates, but this just looks like WAY too much.

[badbread]

If you choose to use baked baking soda to raise KH be very careful with your PH. I was/still am battling low Alkalinity in my 29 gallon, the system is setup with an RK2 monitoring PH.

 

When I was dosing baking soda even the slightest amount of baking soda water really raised my PH levels by A LOT.

 

Check out this thread:

http://www.bareefers.org/discussion/index.php?topic=6089.0

 

There is some great info in there, especially on salt levels, mag levels and dosing.

[bdare]

If you choose to use baked baking soda to raise KH be very careful with your PH. I was/still am battling low Alkalinity in my 29 gallon, the system is setup with an RK2 monitoring PH.

 

When I was dosing baking soda even the slightest amount of baking soda water really raised my PH levels by A LOT.

 

Check out this thread:

http://www.bareefers.org/discussion/index.php?topic=6089.0

 

There is some great info in there, especially on salt levels, mag levels and dosing.

I had this problem as well when I started using 2 part. I would HIGHLY reccomend dosing with unbaked baking powder when you need to adjust your alk and the baked for smaller doses during daily maintenance.

 

When I started out I ended up with TONS of precipitation on everything because of the Ph spike from the baked baking soda. My sump, skimmer and pumps were all coated. This is because of the localized Ph spike where you add the baking soda.

 

My tank currenly uses 100ml / day of the Alk portion of 2 part. If I were to dose even 50ml at a time of the baked I would get precip. For this reason alone I invested in a Litermeter. Now the doses are much smaller and I get to take advantage of the higher ph.

 

I found that using the unbaked baking powder was MUCH easier. For one the effect on the Ph is much less dramatic and you don't have to worry about precip.

 

Ben

[badbread]

Hrm, didn't think of that. Baking baking soda drives off some of the CO2 that lowers PH, wow, why didn't I think of that?

[bdare]

Hrm, didn't think of that. Baking baking soda drives off some of the CO2 that lowers PH, wow, why didn't I think of that?

I take frags as payment...

[rmalone]

I wouldn't even worry about alk until it's below 7. Isn't natural seawater right around 7-8? One other thing I would say is don't try to get where you want all at once, nudge your values to where you want. I don't have much experience but I have seen more bad things happen with drastic shifts in water parameters than I have with stable, less than ideal, parameters.

[phinfan78]

Thanks I am testing with the API reef kit still have the red sea test for MG. I am using a refractomter. Just dont see why if it was operator error the levels in the frehly mixed water would come out fine but not the tank water? My salinity is 1.025 in both tank and fresh. I am now dosing with two little fishes Part A and B because it was given to me and B-ionic Mg buffer just started this process three days ago and still after testing have the same before mentioned parameters. Ca 300 MG 1000

[The Propagator]

1st..... red sea salt is CRAP. Ditch it and go with a better brand.

Instant ocean has really stepped up their quality. That would be the next best in a cost versus quantity comparison IMHO for you. If you had a bunch of sps of course I would recommend another salt.

 

In a captive reef alk is low when it reaches 8dkh if you ask me.

I say this because in the ocean it buffers its self to a constant 7.5 (?) average and all the coral in the world and animals in it will never deplete this number as it currently stands. Our systems are not capable of this. Which is why we dose for both calcium and alkalinity.

You really want to keep your alkalinity between 9-10dkh minimum IMHO.

If you wait until the drops to 7 it takes more buffer to raise it back up. The more buffer it takes the more things will be temporarily out of whack.

 

IF after the OP gets a reliable magnesium test kit like Seachem, or elos and retests finding that mag is actually low then that is why the alkalinity is being used up so fast, and the CA is low despite adding to it and water changes. Magnesium helps to stabilize usage of both calcium and alkalinity. So if both are constantly out of whack using a reliable kit then its most definitely a low magnesium problem IMHO.

 

Another thing I think people seem to be confusing here that definitely needs cleared up loud and clear.

 

The use of baked baking soda is for use in a tank suffering from LOW PH.

Regular baking soda ( straight out of the bag ) is for use in a tank with NORMAL PH.

Its not so much user preference. Those are their uses.

[phinfan78]

1st..... red sea salt is CRAP. Ditch it and go with a better brand.

Instant ocean has really stepped up their quality. That would be the next best in a cost versus quantity comparison IMHO for you. If you had a bunch of sps of course I would recommend another salt.

 

In a captive reef alk is low when it reaches 8dkh if you ask me.

I say this because in the ocean it buffers its self to a constant 7.5 (?) average and all the coral in the world and animals in it will never deplete this number as it currently stands. Our systems are not capable of this. Which is why we dose for both calcium and alkalinity.

You really want to keep your alkalinity between 9-10dkh minimum IMHO.

If you wait until the drops to 7 it takes more buffer to raise it back up. The more buffer it takes the more things will be temporarily out of whack.

 

IF after the OP gets a reliable magnesium test kit like Seachem, or elos and retests finding that mag is actually low then that is why the alkalinity is being used up so fast, and the CA is low despite adding to it and water changes. Magnesium helps to stabilize usage of both calcium and alkalinity. So if both are constantly out of whack using a reliable kit then its most definitely a low magnesium problem IMHO.

 

Another thing I think people seem to be confusing here that definitely needs cleared up loud and clear.

 

The use of baked baking soda is for use in a tank suffering from LOW PH.

Regular baking soda ( straight out of the bag ) is for use in a tank with NORMAL PH.

Its not so much user preference. Those are their uses.

 

Thanks for the insight. It is very helpful. I actually am getting my bucket of dd H20 this week and hopefully along with a better Mag test kit will clear some things up.

[S197]

just so you know the makers of Red Sea also make dd H20

 

Ive heard amazing reviews and horrible reviews on the salt

[Weetabix7]

just so you know the makers of Red Sea also make dd H20

 

Ive heard amazing reviews and horrible reviews on the salt

 

Where'dja hear the horrible ones, and what were they?

 

Red Sea test kits are VERY inaccurate, and I'm actually going by both my own experience and what I've heard from others.