ALL YOU EVER WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT Alk, calc, and pH..enough to make u hate reefing

[samstersam]

Trust me...read enough of this and you will HATE this hobby...

 

I EXPECT NO ONE TO EVER POST A QUESTION ABOUT ALKALINITY AND pH and CALCIUM AGAIN...

 

EVER

 

actually, SOME of it is pretty interesting reading this stuff actually jump started my hobby by a few months...i have all of this printed out and refer to it once in a while

 

Calcium and Alkalinity relationships and solutions:

yes ESPI...it is FINE to use baking soda and washing soda read and be educated...

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov...ov2002/chem.htm

 

Calcium:

 

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/mar...ar2002/chem.htm

 

Alkalinity:

 

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/iss...2/chemistry.htm

 

Solutions to pH problems:

 

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/iss...ne2002/chem.htm

 

Relationship to pH and Alk problems:

 

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/may...ay2002/chem.htm

 

yes all this crap was in RC but i only picked out the ones that were of any REAL use...

[Dave ESPI]

way to go super sleuth....

 

Check a Post made by MYSELF back around APRIL last year asshatt.... I believe it was this forum too....

 

Oh and you need to know about MAGNESIUM too.

 

PS: I'm not clicking the links

reason , Tl : Dr

[samstersam]

wassamatta davey boy...feel upset that the articles u posted back in April negated your own comments about baking soda?

[Dave ESPI]

nah. I know better than to take ONE article as gospel.

 

Experience mah boy... get some under yer belt... you will see.

[RobD]

Originally posted by samstersam

...it is FINE to use baking soda and washing soda read and be educated...

 

Why use products of unknown purity? Unless it's the thrill of experimentation, this option really makes no sense for Nano's since the amount of professional grade, purpose specific designed products that are used are so small.

[samstersam]

define professional grade...(hey RobD speaking of professional grade, i'm sure Randy Holmes Farley cares and has a leeeeetle more expertise about "professional grade" than most of us here...his reputation is on the line when he writes those articles!)

 

if it says 100% calcium carbonate it's 100% calcium carbonate.....

 

100% is 100%...

so GENERIC limewater for pickling lime is professional grade huh? use that instead of kalkwasser?

 

so dave, pickling lime manufacturers are professional grade as reef kalkwasser too right?

 

ok so why not 100% baking soda in pathmark as opposed to reef buffers...why is generic pickling lime ok and not generic baking soda?

 

wow...such inconsistent thinking...i thought many of you use super glue...from various companies...as long as it's ethyl cyancrelate, it's fine isn't it? do u trust those companies not to have .01% of surfactants as well? i hear on the reef grapevine that aquarium reef epoxy sticks are overpriced and we can use regular superglue to mount frags... why "generic" non-professional glues and pickling lime are accepted and others like baking soda are not? is there some mystery to baking soda manufacturing that i am not aware about?

 

hehe...

face it like a MAN dave..i gotcha man!!!!

so u are proud u posting up these articles earlier, and yet u defy the articles u post? if u disagree with them, why post?face it up like a man dude...not everyone's right all the time... ki ki ki:D

[LadyClown]

Whoa guys, I'm sorry I started all this :*( I didn't mean to

 

I guess Dave is right as far as Mg is concerned. I don't know what other important ions are present in the ocean, but I will read up as much as possible and let you all know what I found (though if you do know, pls let me know )

 

I think I'll experiment a bit before going into demanding specimen, also because I will have to move around so much (I'm done with college this spring, the off to graduate school)

[samstersam]

Originally posted by LadyClown

Whoa guys, I'm sorry I started all this :*(  I didn't mean to

 

NAH..get used to it...This is the dung heap that starts to fly when i post anything...

 

it goes like this

 

Samster : innocent, tying to help post

 

response: WHOOSH! a blazing fire...

 

Samster: retort

 

response: KABLEWEY! thermal nuclear warfare...

 

 

actually. i kind of like it.

sick child i know...

 

let me be honest for a second: u know self examining myself, i think i get it from my job, dealing with those goddamn Net Admins who think they know everything because they went to MCSE bootcamp, and then get ####ed off when i have to do a security audit that threatens their jobs... maybe i am taking my stress out here..who knows? nano-reef therapy?

[tinyreef]

if it says 100% calcium carbonate it's 100% calcium carbonate.....

100% is 100%...

not to split hairs or take sides but actually, no.

 

you've gots:

ACS grade (pure blow, man )

Reagent grade (as pure as you likely see :angel: )

USP grade (good enuff to ingest and overpay for)

NF grade (it's clean)

Lab grade (it's clean enough to use )

Pure grade (wink wink)

Technical grade ( :x )

Food grade ( :ermm: )

Shovel grade (hey haus, let's go and dig us up some adetifs for this here reef tank, yuk yuk)

 

there's always some impurities involved. some reef inhabitants don't like anything (5N's ain't enough, 99.999%). just can't avoid that, they frickin' died in the wild, what can we do? (maybe leave them out there? )

 

imo you can only just try to get the purest (or cheapest depending on your pers tendencies) goodies for the tank.

[samstersam]

Originally posted by tinyreef

not to split hairs or take sides but actually, no.

 

you've gots:

ACS grade (pure blow, man )

 

 

:D :D

 

u know...i love this place..everyone has this incredible sense of humor..are u guys all like this in real life? i'd SERIOUSLY buy u guys a drink at a bar.....

[RobD]

Originally posted by samstersam

define professional grade...(hey RobD speaking of professional grade, i'm sure Randy Holmes Farley cares and has a leeeeetle more expertise about "professional grade" than most of us here...his reputation is on the line when he writes those articles!)

 

if it says 100% calcium carbonate it's 100% calcium carbonate.....

 

100% is 100%...

so GENERIC limewater for pickling lime is professional grade huh? use that instead of kalkwasser?  

 

so dave, pickling lime manufacturers are professional grade as reef kalkwasser too right?

 

ok so why not 100% baking soda in pathmark as opposed to reef buffers...why is generic pickling lime ok and not generic baking soda?

 

wow...such inconsistent thinking...i thought many of you use super glue...from various companies...as long as it's ethyl cyancrelate, it's fine isn't it? do u trust those companies not to have .01% of surfactants as well? i hear on the reef grapevine that aquarium reef epoxy sticks are overpriced and we can use regular superglue to mount frags... why "generic" non-professional glues and pickling lime are accepted and others like baking soda are not? is there some mystery to baking soda manufacturing that i am not aware about?

 

hehe...

face it like a MAN dave..i gotcha man!!!!

so u are proud u posting up these articles earlier, and yet u defy the articles u post? if u disagree with them, why post?face it up like a man dude...not everyone's right all the time... ki ki ki:D

 

Dude, dial down the drama and take a read at tinyreefs post.

 

If you stop the leg humping about Dave, and think, you will soon realize that you can't pour that crap into your tank for any length of time without risk. It seems more like you want to gratify yourself from your own posts, so don't let any sense infuse you.

 

Are you getting your Ca:Mg:Sr added at normal utilization ratios? How will the "mix" you propose to add affect alkalinity? What will you use to add other trace elements that are depleted over time? How will this mix affect your PH?

 

How much more will YOU be spending to use these home brewed products? Have you ever used them? For how long?

 

Since your thread claimed to be "All you ever wanted to know blah blah" bring it.

 

R

[samstersam]

i never mean it this way..i always post something nice..

someone always must be condescending to me...it always goes this way and someone has to blame me for starting something...

 

Hey Rob:

about DaveESPI - i'm KIDDING. WE JOKE AND JEST and generally have fun..... RobD, it has nothing to do with you so don't even mention it. THERE IS NO DRAMA... no one is angry or upset or anything...don't go making conclusions on how u think i feel...

 

u wanna ask about my tank?

ok. Mg? it's always in good ratio with Calcium don't worry about balances, my pH is always stable 7.8 at crack of dawn and 8.2 -8.3 at lights out pinpoint ph monitor, dkh is nice at 10 and i upkeep 450 calc..Salifert makes great test kits for these don't u think? I use them quite liberally.

 

what other trace elements are u talking about (aside from the important ones in this discussion of Calcium, Mg, and Alk buffers CaC03)? the depletion of these "unnamed" other trace elements come from my regular water changes of 3-4 gallons every 10 days. Correct me if I'm wrong please...

 

What will you use to add other trace elements that are depleted over time?

 

If you don't answer this question don't bother posting a reply...

what the hell does this have to do with whether or not 100% baking soda is ok for raising alkalinity?

Do u think that by asking a series of lightning fast questions (that have not much to do with each other..replenishment of trace elements question in a debate of baking soda vs. "professional grade" reef buffer???) will try to make you look like the man?

 

dude...all i did was post an article by a WELL known and respected expert in this field. PERIOD. You have a problem with that go take it up with him NOT me. As far as I know trust you or Randy Holmes? gee hard decision.. i don't know either of u, but i think i'll go with Randy for 100 dollars Alex...

 

i still take his "so called professional" words with a grain of salt, but trust me, if i take him with a grain of salt then i take YOUR words with all the salt in the entire Dead Sea.

 

How is my post "self-gratifying" i give full credit for the above mentioned articles to Randy, not me.

 

If you were in my shoes wouldn't u feel the same way? You have something written by an expert - a published article..then someone named RobD comes along and starts trolling on a thread that you wrote meant with all good intentions (and a bit of jest which had NOTHING to do with RobD), who would you trust? This silly guy, named RobD who tries to make you (the author of the post) look dumb when all he did was post up articles, or the Randy Holmes the expert in the field who knows more chemistry in reefing than this guy RobD would ever possibly know? who would you trust more?

 

i feel i must stress this point so i shall repeat it:

dude...all i did was post an article by a WELL known and respected expert in this field. PERIOD. You have a problem with that go take it up with him NOT me.

 

christ, remind me never to post up anything by another expert again....it was all fun and jest before, please don't make it too serious.... go outside and do what this guy is doing --->

[Dave ESPI]

I like Tullamore Dew and Gingerales.

 

Tiny Likes Shirley Temples.

 

Crakuer will have a highfeluten 12.00 Martini and toss a 20.00 tip cause he got 2 olives on a toothpick............

 

see ya at the NANO-meet.

 

 

PS: I don't have to fess up to anything. I stand by what I say , and Tiny just posted EXACTLY to the point why

[FlyGTI]

Well, if we're drinkin' this early Dave, sign me up for a Johnny Walker Black on the rocks.

[jameson]

I'll take a crown N coke

[Bikelock]

I love this place!

 

No better way to keep the workday blues away.

 

You guys so damn funny and informative at the same time.

 

OH, I'll buy you guys a drink too, except I spent all my spare change for RO/DI water.

[jameson]

I'll have to agree with you on that one bikelock, i come to "work" and look on here all day...just hope the boss dosnt look at the internet log and find out i spend 7 out of 8 working hours on here.

man, just think how much actual work people used to get done before the internet.....

[Bikelock]

Oh how I know!

 

If I could only apply all this knowlege to my job.

 

The accounting industry would be much better, I need to put a nano on my desk, except then I would have one hand on the key board and the other in my tank. The boss would find out for sure then.

[jameson]

Yeah, and some people on here said their boss let them have a tank at work...i get no work done as it is, if there was a tank here, they would have to start paying me overtime. I would prob come in on sat and sundays too

[RobD]

Easy to break it down for you. Most of what you wrote was drama filled, so I'll try to hit the main points

 

"Mg? it's always in good ratio with Calcium don't worry about balances". Gotta love that "good" ratio, is that somewhere above "kinda weak" and below "totally stoked" lol!

 

 

"..Salifert makes great test kits for these don't u think? I use them quite liberally." This even makes it more clear that fooling around with ghetto solutions like baking soda or washing soda is not because of $$.

 

"what other trace elements are u talking about (aside from the important ones in this discussion of Calcium, Mg, and Alk buffers CaC03)? the depletion of these "unnamed" other trace elements come from my regular water changes of 3-4 gallons every 10 days. Correct me if I'm wrong please..." Yeah, actually you are missing Sr if you want to limit the discussion to Ca related. If you don't cry about it being outside of the discussion, the easiest trace element to point out is iodide.

 

 

 

"If you don't answer this question don't bother posting a reply..." What? More drama? hmm.. not surprising at this point.

 

"what the hell does this have to do with whether or not 100% baking soda is ok for raising alkalinity?" The point is it is not 100%. Yea read the box but it's not. Go back to tinyreef's post for the info.

 

"Do u think that by asking a series of lightning fast questions (that have not much to do with each other..replenishment of trace elements question in a debate of baking soda vs. "professional grade" reef buffer???) will try to make you look like the man?" No, but if it helps for me to put more spaces in my posts, I'll do that. Let me know if this is more readable.

 

 

"dude...all i did was post an article by a WELL known and respected expert in this field. PERIOD. You have a problem with that go take it up with him NOT me. As far as I know trust you or Randy Holmes? gee hard decision.. i don't know either of u, but i think i'll go with Randy for 100 dollars Alex..." So... you're not advocating the use of food products in aquariums?

 

 

"i still take his "so called professional" words with a grain of salt, but trust me, if i take him with a grain of salt then i take YOUR words with all the salt in the entire Dead Sea." <--drama?

 

"How is my post "self-gratifying" i give full credit for the above mentioned articles to Randy, not me." Well, you seem to want to hide behind the skirts of an "expert". You throw out a big claim, that using food products in a tank is a good idea, then post a series of links to someone else. It's still your claim, and you don't seem to like the discussion that it's not a good idea at all.

 

 

 

"christ, remind me never to post up anything by another expert again" Ok!

 

 

"....it was all fun and jest before, please don't make it too serious...." I agree with you, don't take the advice to use food products in your tank seriously. It's a joke!

[Dave ESPI]

^^^^^ Who is Rob talking to in that reply ? ???

 

surely it isn't me.

 

 

PS:

 

[samstersam]

beating a dead horse? that's an understatement...

 

SO when the hell is the date for the NY meeting. I uphold what I say:

 

Originally posted by tinyreef

not to split hairs or take sides but actually, no.

 

you've gots:

ACS grade (pure blow, man )

 

Originally posted by samstersam

:D :D  

 

u know...i love this place..everyone has this incredible sense of humor..are u guys all like this in real life? i'd SERIOUSLY buy u guys a drink at a bar.....

 

i'll buy you goddamn comedians a round of drinks...(that's ONE round, u bastards)