disaster999 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 so i have this DIY tank that i made and want to get it started again. tank is 20in wide, 14in deep 10in high. i have 2 returns one on each side of the tank. the overflow is in the center of the tank. the sump is right under the tank, theres minimal head difference. its less than 1.5ft. i had a mag7 for my return, hose goes to a T that splits the flow in 2, then to a 90degree elbow on each side and out the nozzles. im not getting the flow i want, it seems like the pump is struggling to go through all the plumbing. i took the tank down bcause i had to move, and now im setting it up again. i bought a new pump, quiet one 3000, tried it on the same setup and the same thing happened. went to RC to check the head loss calculator and turns out all the elbow and bends really killed my output. something has to be done and what im thinking of right now is instead of having twin outputs, im just gonna cut it down to 1. increase the pipe diameter and see if that helps. probably do a split nozzle to help with directing the flow. anyone else got any other ideas that could help? picture of the plumbing Link to comment
scokill Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 I did a couple of hypotheticals on the head loss calculator, one outlet with no elbows or couplings, vs. 2 outlets with 2 90s 3 couplings and the difference is roughly 8% less, not really impactful. Could be something else??? Maybe bad pump? Link to comment
Sctn4Elk Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Increasing the pipe diameter will increase output, but reduce pressure I believe....don't quote me on that..but I think that is right.. Link to comment
121a Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 what flow do you want? your probably not going to get what you want because you really cannot judge how much flow there is. if your trying to eliminate the need for powerheads in the tank then you might be able to get away with what you have. IMO it looks fine to me. not much you can do to increase it without upping the pump. Link to comment
disaster999 Posted July 20, 2008 Author Share Posted July 20, 2008 i tried the pump with my original plumbing and just a straight tube dumping into the tank and there is a huge difference in flow. I might experiment a bit and see if upping the diameter would help. flow wise, i guess ill aim for around 600gph. the QO 3000 is 780gph so theoretically it should be more than enough. Link to comment
chickendude10 Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Another thing to note is when using soft tubing, the pvc connectors have significantly smaller openings than rated. For example, a 3/4inch connector really has an opening of about 1/2 inch. I usually try to get the next size up. So for 3/4 inch soft tubing, I use a 1 inch connector. That could be slowing down your flow also. Just a thought. Link to comment
disaster999 Posted July 21, 2008 Author Share Posted July 21, 2008 that could be it, also, 1/2" tubing is too small for a pump of that size. im going to try 3/4" with new nozzles and other hardware and see if that helps or not Link to comment
hyperbole Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Another thing to note is when using soft tubing, the pvc connectors have significantly smaller openings than rated. For example, a 3/4inch connector really has an opening of about 1/2 inch. I usually try to get the next size up. So for 3/4 inch soft tubing, I use a 1 inch connector. That could be slowing down your flow also. Just a thought. this depends if you're using CPVC, or PVC, both use different measuring standards. Link to comment
nano_nick Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 that piping looks too small upgrade it to a bigger diameter and you will get better results. i was running 12mm pipe (return) from my eheim 1000 compact in my all in one tank and upgraded to 16mm stuff with 1/2 in loc line dual return flanges and the flow rate from the 16mm setup was almost double with pump noise reduced so if it sounds like its straining it probably is Link to comment
disaster999 Posted July 22, 2008 Author Share Posted July 22, 2008 thats what im planning on doing, the pump is straining to pump through the small diameter tubes. i got to find a T for the 16mm tube the guy suggested me using. when you say "stuffed with 1/2" locline dual return flanges" what do you mean? do you have a dual return like me with bulkheads and all? Link to comment
nano_nick Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 Its actually off one bulkhead and i used a locline Y flange which splits it into 2 1/2 pipes to get more accurate flow direction around the tank with reduced velocity (head pressure) as it returns( it was too much from a single) . If any restirction should exsist on your returns it should only be at the very end of the return if you would like the water to exit at i higher pressure rate.... otherwise a more open end nozzle will create a softer flow.... same goes with the more you split off the one blukhead return with extra nozzles the slower the rate of flow will become at each nozzle end.... its just a trial and error game really but with what i can see u have there i would increase the diameter of the pipes running to the back of your bulkheads to the pump and run 1 dual locline return on each for good controled multi directional flow . im surprised your even getting sufficent return to the tank without the tank draining below your overflow box your drain is 5X bigger than the return pipes ! unless theres a ball valve i can see (which id say there is?) Link to comment
disaster999 Posted July 23, 2008 Author Share Posted July 23, 2008 my overflow isnt floating in mid tank, its all the way down to the bottom of the tank. the drain pipe is only 1inch, its not that much bigger, i have ballvalves restricting the flow right now to quiet it down. Im definitely gonna try bigger tubing and see if that helps. ill keep my original bulkhead and loclines and see if the bigger tubes makes a difference. i really dont wanna hack my tank up to enlarge the bulkhead holes for a bigger bulkhead. im not in the states right now and sourcing for new bulkheads and locline might be hard. hopefully just upping the tube diameter would significantly increase my flow. Link to comment
nano_nick Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 ahhhh i see okay well best of luck with it anyway im sure it will be a hell of alot better with some bigger pipe work as for the bulkheads any local hardware store sells them in the plumbing section ....and the locline is all over the internet , im from Australia and tracked it down in one 5 min google search Hope that helps ? Link to comment
disaster999 Posted July 23, 2008 Author Share Posted July 23, 2008 yeah, im sure i could track them down (im in hong kong...pretty much anything i need is here) but just a matter of going to shop to shop and ask. if else fails, ill just bring the part and show it to them. just wondering, what size pump your using in your system? Link to comment
disaster999 Posted July 26, 2008 Author Share Posted July 26, 2008 so i went and bought 3/4in tube from pump to the T. then used 16mm tube from the T to the nozzle, and finally to 1/2" locline nozzles. flow is 10 billion times better. but i gotta say...the quiet one pump isnt so quiet. still getting a humming noise. but i can tell the pump isnt struggling at all Link to comment
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