High nitrates ...help!

[lillwook]

So I have had my NC12 since Easter and so far everything has been great. Doing regular water changes...have a CUC of 4 turbo snails and seven redlegged crabs and only one Clown Fish. I have 2 Xenia, a toadstool, two mushrooms and a Zoa frag. I noticed over the past few weeks that I was growng Aipastia and so i bought a Peppermint Shrimp to try and get rid of them before I tried Joes Juice. I acclimated him and he seemed to be just fine and then the next morning he was dead. I normally just test for my PH, Nitrites and Ammonia per the advice of my LFS. So I went today and bought a master test and my Nitrates are at 40 and my ALK is at 240.

 

HELP!!

 

 

P.S. I also have a Profile Powerhead 600....am I not getting enough water circulation maybe?

[inferno2113]

Do a big water change. The reason your nitrates are high now is because your shrimp died. After you do the change retest.

[greeneyes]

I would increase water changes to 2-3 a week and see if that helps.

Today I would do a 50%.

[lillwook]

wouldnt my ammonia be high too if it was from the shrimp?

[greeneyes]

Not always.

IMO 4 turbo in that size tank is a bit much.

[lillwook]

Yeah I kinda thought so but the guy at PetCo who sold the Cube to my husband reccomended it... " you can never have too many"

[HankB]

That's funny. I test nitrates daily (still in second week of startup) and occasionally ammonia and nitrites. Very early in the cycle the bacteria develop to convert ammonia to nitrite and soon after nitrite to nitrate. So past the first week or two you need a pretty big disturbance to see ammonia or nitrites. (We never detected ammonia or nitrites.)

 

So the things I wonder about are - did the shrimp moult and may be still hiding? Did it really die? Were nitrates already high and lead to the demise of the shrimp? Or did the shrimp start to decompose and pump nitrates up? I'd bet that the nitrates were high before the shrimp entered the picture.

 

I suggest testing nitrates once or twice weekly to establish a baseline and monitor. Once the tank is stable and everything is sailing smoothly I would drop back to maybe once or twice a month. But I'd be sure to check it before adding anything or at the first hint of trouble.

 

I agree with the others that frequent and larger water changes will help you get through this. Be sure to carefully match temperature and salinity of the change water to avoid further disturbance to your tank. Test nitrates daily and others less frequently during this phase to monitor progress.

 

You might also back off on feeding a bit as that could lead to higher nitrates.

 

Good luck solving your water and pest anemone problem!

 

-hank

[lillwook]

That's funny. I test nitrates daily (still in second week of startup) and occasionally ammonia and nitrites. Very early in the cycle the bacteria develop to convert ammonia to nitrite and soon after nitrite to nitrate. So past the first week or two you need a pretty big disturbance to see ammonia or nitrites. (We never detected ammonia or nitrites.)

 

So the things I wonder about are - did the shrimp moult and may be still hiding? Did it really die? Were nitrates already high and lead to the demise of the shrimp? Or did the shrimp start to decompose and pump nitrates up? I'd bet that the nitrates were high before the shrimp entered the picture.

 

I suggest testing nitrates once or twice weekly to establish a baseline and monitor. Once the tank is stable and everything is sailing smoothly I would drop back to maybe once or twice a month. But I'd be sure to check it before adding anything or at the first hint of trouble.

 

I agree with the others that frequent and larger water changes will help you get through this. Be sure to carefully match temperature and salinity of the change water to avoid further disturbance to your tank. Test nitrates daily and others less frequently during this phase to monitor progress.

 

You might also back off on feeding a bit as that could lead to higher nitrates.

 

Good luck solving your water and pest anemone problem!

 

-hank

 

 

Hank You must be clarvoyant because I went to my LFS and bought some water to do a change and picked up a new powerhead (couldn't hurt right? ) So I went home and went to install the powerhead and had to move around some rocks and sure enough there was the little bugger!! He must have molted and those were the parts I saw floating around. So I did my water change and now my nitrates went from 40 to 20 so Ill probably do another one either tonight or tomorrow morning.

Thanks so much for the advice

[JourneyReef]

If there was a death in the tank, I would expect to see the ammonia spike, then nitrites, then nitrates. Not, just nitrates and not nitrates first. But, I'm new!

 

Water changes will help to prevent damage to the critters in the tank while you figure out the real cause of the problem and attend to that. Unless, the Nitrate peak is really because of a death, it will just re-peak over and over again until the underlying cause is fixed.

 

Overfeeding can cause nitrate problems...they are usually the result of organic build up - often in the sediment. Do you have a refugium? Macro-algae is a good long term nitrate fix.

 

I added cheato to a homemade fake fuge and within days the trates dropped by 20 points (I was stuck at 40 for the longest...ugh!). I also used a baster to blast the detritus build up off the rocks every few days to help it get sucked up in my filtration system.

 

I hope this helps. Since I'm new, please let me know if there is anything wrong in here...don't want to pass on bad advice.

[Pickle010]

" you can never have too many"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[HankB]

... and had to move around some rocks and sure enough there was the little bugger!! He must have molted and those were the parts I saw floating around. ...

 

That's not the first time I've heard this because the moulted shell looks just like the shrimp or crab that squeezed out of it. I'm glad to hear he's OK and things are on the mend.

 

-hank

[johnmaloney]

The first molt always tricks people! Happened to me with my first cleaner shrimp. I was pulling the exoskeleton from the tank, (thought it was the shrimp though) and it jumped on me! Thought it was a ghost shrimp... Anyway, get some chaeto or a macroalgae that soaks up nitrates and you should be fine. Do a water change for now, as you have to get that level down ASAP.

[Greenstar]

If there was a death in the tank, I would expect to see the ammonia spike, then nitrites, then nitrates. Not, just nitrates and not nitrates first. But, I'm new!

 

Water changes will help to prevent damage to the critters in the tank while you figure out the real cause of the problem and attend to that. Unless, the Nitrate peak is really because of a death, it will just re-peak over and over again until the underlying cause is fixed.

 

Overfeeding can cause nitrate problems...they are usually the result of organic build up - often in the sediment. Do you have a refugium? Macro-algae is a good long term nitrate fix.

 

I added cheato to a homemade fake fuge and within days the trates dropped by 20 points (I was stuck at 40 for the longest...ugh!). I also used a baster to blast the detritus build up off the rocks every few days to help it get sucked up in my filtration system.

 

I hope this helps. Since I'm new, please let me know if there is anything wrong in here...don't want to pass on bad advice.

 

+1

 

Nice to at least one person in this thread understands how the cycle works.

[Sctn4Elk]

...

IMO 4 turbo in that size tank is a bit much.

 

1 to 2 cleaners per gallon is what I and many others I know use as standard CUC. I am pretty sure that is not leading to higher nitrates if that is what you are saying. If it were, my 5 should be a trate playground, but it has always read 0 and continues to do so...

[HankB]

1 to 2 cleaners per gallon is what I and many others I know use as standard CUC. I am pretty sure that is not leading to higher nitrates if that is what you are saying. If it were, my 5 should be a trate playground, but it has always read 0 and continues to do so...

 

Yabut...

 

What snails or cleaners do you have? I have 2 turbos and about 15 other snails in a 34 gallon RSM. The 2 turbos probably match the other 15 snails in algae eating ability based on what I've seen (and probably contribute to nitrate production by a similar amount.) The snails have been in the tank about a week and needed about 3 days to take care of the algae. If I added half again as much, I'm sure I'd be overstocked on those, but take the turbos out of the equation and it could be entirely different.

 

Also you may have more denitrifying bacteria than what the OP would have in a new tank.

 

-hank

[The Propagator]

Hank You must be clarvoyant because I went to my LFS and bought some water to do a change and picked up a new powerhead (couldn't hurt right? ) So I went home and went to install the powerhead and had to move around some rocks and sure enough there was the little bugger!! He must have molted and those were the parts I saw floating around. So I did my water change and now my nitrates went from 40 to 20 so Ill probably do another one either tonight or tomorrow morning.

Thanks so much for the advice

 

Wait a day in between water changes. You'll risk shocking your tank into a mini cylce if not.

That would suck. In a tank that small I woul dnever do a 50% water change unless I absolutely had to. If you had NITRIES that high I would say "YES DO IT !" but trates at 40 isnt good but wont kill every thing off overnight if you dont do a massive water change with what your keeping. Do you skim? What type of mechanical filtration do you use ? Is it the built in type? if you have an all in one or an HOB be sure to check your filer pads for exces waste build up. That will cause what your experiencing as well.

[The Propagator]

Yabut...

 

What snails or cleaners do you have? I have 2 turbos and about 15 other snails in a 34 gallon RSM. The 2 turbos probably match the other 15 snails in algae eating ability based on what I've seen (and probably contribute to nitrate production by a similar amount.) The snails have been in the tank about a week and needed about 3 days to take care of the algae. If I added half again as much, I'm sure I'd be overstocked on those, but take the turbos out of the equation and it could be entirely different.

 

Also you may have more denitrifying bacteria than what the OP would have in a new tank.

 

-hank

 

It really depends on what type of snail he actually has.

A LOT of places sell snails as turbo snail but they are not actually turbos.

Example.. I see astrea snails at jacks ALL THE TIME labled "turbo snails" Pets mart too.

I also see large Caribbean snail species sold as astreas and turbo's all the time as well.

( I forget the actual name but they get fricking HUGE and have an astrea shaped shell with out the nubs or spiral. Ya know what I mean?) I see margaritas sold as turbo's.. etc etc etc....