~_~ Posted July 22, 2003 Share Posted July 22, 2003 What salt has higher calcium? Like 380-400+ or something. Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 of 2 batches per each brand tested...the winners(+400 both tests) were: Bio-Sea: http://www.aquacraft.net/w0002.html Coralife: http://www.aquacraft.net/w0004.html Marine Environment: http://www.aquacraft.net/w0018.html Instant Ocean tested at 400 once out of 2 tests: http://www.aquacraft.net/w0014.html The worst performer in the Calcium category was Crystal Sea: http://www.aquacraft.net/w0008.html Natural Sea Water NSW has a rating of 400 Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 IME, Instant Ocean has also mixed to dangerously high PH levels like the tests reveal. ( http://www.aquacraft.net/w0014.html ) That can be a huge problem depending on how fast it is added to the tank during a water change. I know LFSs that refuse to sell it...sometimes "industry mainstays" are a result of greater profit margins Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Reef Crystals: http://www.aquacraft.net/w0024.html Link to comment
digitallinx Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 but don't you think that maybe aquacraft speaks so highly of these names of salts is because thats what they sell. i mean i wouldn't sell you a mercedes if i'm a bmw dealer Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 true.....but i think they won the test sample so they will be the ones to gloat. kinda like JDPowers and cars. if they had conducted their own tests I would be more sceptical. The PH issue is what had me worried about IO. I once got 3 bags for $40 so I was stuck with it. I use a digital PH testing electrode. When PH runs that high you have to add the sw very slowly to your tank. PH swings are dangerous. the claims some of these companies make also bug me...from bio-wheels to skilters to false GPH claims....it's all bogus attempts to validate overpriced equipment made overseas from cheap plastic it's impossible to test for these trace elements at home....but who knows....that's why i am posting links and holding them responsible for content interpretation Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 i like to think of it this way......a bad filter, skimmer, lighting, powerhead, airpump will not hurt my babies....companies can say what they want about their product specs. .....but don't F@$% with my heater, supplements or SALT MIX Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 digitallinx.... what about reef crystals MrKrispy ..... This is my first nano, but have a bunch of marine exp. I have always used Instant Ocean, like my father before me. I saw the Reef Instant Ocean, don't really know anything about that... marketing? read this....i thought that packaging all looked similar....marketing marketing marketing. http://www.aquacraft.net/sp0003.html Link to comment
dickwayne Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 fishbabies, how much of what you're saying is from experience? This is not a ment as a flame, I am just curious. I have tested calcium and magnesium levels in my Marine Envirionment and they have come up lower than what the s-15 report has said. Also, after changing about 7 gallons in my 20g tank, I tested my magnesium levels. They dropped from 1250ppm to around 950ppm. A big change, so I doubt the levels were very good in the fresh saltwater. And I tested the day after the second WC, so there was not enough time for the levels to be seriously depleted. I am going to change salts after this bag of ME, maybe to Tropic Marin, or IO since that seems to be the standard for many. Has anyone done personal tests on their water to check trace element levels? I'm not interested in reports from anyone, just anecdotal test evidence. Link to comment
cmoreash Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 What test kit are you using, dick? some test kits are inferior to others. Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 none of my posts on this thread regarding the survey are from experience...that is why i posted links....for your own interpretation, not mine. I use Coral Sea which didn't score all that great either. But I have had terrible experiences with Instant Ocean and always thought their claims were a little over the top. I would rather not feel like I am acclimating my fish with inconsistent seawater on a weekly basis.....and as consistently as I would mix replacement water to match my tank water, my fish would kinda go into stress mode after the change. I also take about 30 minutes to empty one gallon of new water into the tank using a IV style drip because the PH read so high on my digital PH reader. I thought this was due to using an airstone to mix the water, but readings of 9 were awfully high. After reading the articles I determined that it was problems with IO salt mix. SG, PH and temp are the only things I test for. I think i test my tank water enough to leave it in good faith that the salt mix manufacturer is doing their job in providing accurate batch consistencies......despite packaging claims. So now with my experiences and my interpretation of the survey, I do not trust Instant Ocean, Reef Crystals, Kent or any Aquarium Systems manufactured salt mixes. That's all. Make your own conclusions, but just remain informed.....wink-wink. All I can do is back up my info with links...... Link to comment
onthefly Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Still lookin' for someone to "pony up" and say why red sea sucks!!! Catspa and Cjm have both made statements about it being the worst thing since the Edsel.......Not a flame, just want to know why? Saying "you think" it's made from a de-salting process..... doesn't cut it for me. I'd like to know why it sucks or what are the adverse effects of running in your system. Again, not a flame!!! I do scientific research (thus the need for evidience) and just want a little more than "I said so". Thx Link to comment
cmoreash Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 IT KILLED MY F'N CORALS loooong timee ago Link to comment
adinsxq Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 i use mike's miracle salt too. yeah it's BS in a bag, but the coral are fluffy and all is well in nano-land. onthefly: i believe chris-marks started a thread on red sea salt and announced his switch to the bio-sea (before aquacraft became a sponsor) Link to comment
cjm033 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 i had horrible algae outbreaks,hair,diatoms,redslime,and i alway got some sort of phosphate reading and after i switched everything wasfine andi used the same distilled water with both salts and on top of that had low ifnot all of the trace elements needed for a reef,Chris Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 onthefly .... i think many people who have switched to Red Sea noticed diatom or algae outbreaks shorty after switching even though all the other variables in mixing their water remained the same. ......oh look, CJM already said it I think the most important thing about the S-15 test is not who manufactures the best salt, but rather DON'T BELIEVE THE HYPE.....after all, this is the stuff that your little investments are going to be swimming in. the S-15 test and AquaCraft mixes have been brought up a million times before on this website. What fascinates me about the test is how the bs packaging claims for different mixes are refuted, then the test results are given as compared to Natural Sea Water .....as opposed to simply giving a list of best to worst. Looking at the results of the test didn't get me to go out and buy all of AquaCraft's mixes and additives, but now (no matter what the damn brand is) I thouroughly test my new SW for PH......I also use a heavy metals detoxifier even if my brand of mix says dechlorinators and detox agents are already in there or just iin case there ARE metals in my mix......I use a phosphate remover just in case my mix has phosphates or silicates........and I don't simply get the cheapest salt mix anymore. These are the things I worry about more than the exact amount of 70+ trace elements. Before I was only paranoid about getting the perfect heater and filter and lighting and blah blah blah .....now I can add that I'm also paranoid about what my fish and inverts are breathing, swimming and eating in.......oh jeeeezus....so tired Link to comment
Jandree22 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 maybe I'm just outa the loop and I should know this, but fishbabies, who in the hell is that person in your avatar and that you've been posting right and left?!: Link to comment
dickwayne Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Jandree, I've been wondering the same thing!!! And cmoreash, I used a salifert test kit for Mg, and a seatest for the Ca. I did a seond test last night, and put my results here: http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthread...&threadid=15176 Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 it's Jerri Blank( actress Amy Sedaris) from Comedy Central's discontinued Stranger's With Candy ....she cracks me up just lookin' at her Link to comment
Aquarist20 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Just my .02 but I use Red Sea and I have never had any problems. I have been using it for about 2 yrs now. I used to use IO. I had no outbreaks of any type of algae when I changed brands. Link to comment
onthefly Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Thanks guys for the info!!!! Like I said, I used the last of my red sea bag when I set up my cycle last week, but since I need a new bucket-o-salt, I can use whatever I want when I start the w/c's.........Thanks Chris! Fishbablies - man that chick has a big mouth!!!!! Link to comment
fishbabies Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 The Saga Continues...... Here’s another study that is more favorable to Instant Ocean but curiosly makes Reef Crystals look defficient…and doesn’t include AquaCraft salts http://saltaquarium.about.com/gi/dynamic/o...features%2F1%2F A discussion among scientists / aquarists regarding IO, Reef Crystals, Red Sea, Coralife, and Hawaiian Marine…..some issues regarding Red Sea are discussed: http://saltaquarium.about.com/gi/dynamic/o...salt-mixes.html this is another very complex test favorable to Bio-Sea Marinemix and Crystal Sea Marinemix. Instant Ocean and Coralife were also tested. The test determined toxicity of synthetic seawater mixes by tracing the survival of certain marine larvae within 4 brands of mixes. Skip to the conclusion if it gets too convoluted to interpret… http://saltaquarium.about.com/gi/dynamic/o...ure%2Findex.htm My personal conclusion is that I think I'll give Bio-Sea a try.... Link to comment
Gunfury Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 I've never had a problem with Tropic Marine. Been using it for 5-6 years off and on with various tanks I've set up. No reason to switch I guess. It does mix a bit under weight imo. I think I get about 40 gals worth of salt from a 50 gal box at 1.023 sg. Disolves quickly and doesn't leave much of a residue ... Spend some time googling on the S-15 Report. I think somebody had a decent debunking of Aquacraft's claims. Something about Aquacraft spinning the results to favor their products maybe. I'm not sure. I don't have any direct experience with their products so I'm not trying to bash them. Just spend some time reading up and make your own informed decision. There was another independent test done out of Hawaii I think but I can't remember the link .... Link to comment
tinyreef Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 just ordered 150g worth of bio-sea. it's actually cheaper than the other mixes if you order in that quantity, i believe (adding the NR discount into it). my xenia have been perking up lately with the bio-sea (disclaimer: it could also just be the fact i recently re-started wc's), we'll see long-term. Link to comment
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