So You Want A Centropyge In Your Nano

[pulpsmack]

TO THE READER: Forgive the long-winded manifesto but it is critical that you read every word of this post. Though some of it may not be necessarry (or even silly), vital info is spread throughout.

 

Obviously if you are reading this you love fish. I can't think of a hobbyist that I have ever conversed with who hasn't pined for an enormous tank of their own with beautiful Imperator Angel or maybe a striking Koran slicing through the water column. Most of us however were quickly disappointed when we found out how much they themselves, and the necessarry tank and equipment cost, and/or the amount of space we would need to house them. Alas, Our prayers were answered-- THE CENTROPYGE!!! Sure they aren't quite as dramatic as the Imperator, but they have a beauty of their own, and they will accept our tanks as proper homes!!!

 

Now nanos are popular and rather than accept the FACT that centropyges are not suitable for nanos as we accepted the Fact that queen Angels don't do well in 55s, people are just pushing their luck (more accurately the fish's). So why all this business about "the obvious" (I used to think it was the obvious anyway)? Because there is a solution.

 

If you won't be happy in life until you have crammed an angel in a nano then there is 1 (one, uno, ein, A, Roman numeral: I) less-radical approach. First of all if you have a five gallon nano then just press the X button at the top right corner. It is bad enough that you have a small fish in your tank, let alone a centropyge. Seriously, the only way this thing will work is if you get a 20 gallon tank. That of course means that 20% of all readers are scaling this back to a 15 gallon, 20% are scaling this to a 10, and some smartass is preparing another shotglass joke (good post BTW). No, get a 20 and be happy an option exists. If you have a 7 then you are out of luck. The fish's needs come first. This X-mas get a 20 and until then, have some patience!

 

Now that you have your 20 gallon tank with suitable liverock and substrate bed set up to your tastes you can fool around with cleanup teams and the like for a while. Why? Because centropyges REQUIRE well-established tanks. If it is true for a 75 then why the hell wouldn't it be true for a nano?! If looking at a fishless nano bores you then you are in trouble. There can be only one fish when this thing is set up so unless you have another tank or one hell of an understanding LFS that takes returns leave it fishless and wait six (not 4) months.

 

Ah! you bought a 20 gallon tank, set it up and waited 6 months and there are no fish in it. You sir/madam are proof that miricals exist since it seems that people can't follow directions these days- getting back to the post... Now that you have done everything necessarry you can add your new centropyge argi. NO, you don't get a flame, a bicolor, a coral beauty, or a keyhole. You get a Cherub Angel (centropyge argi) and add it to your tank. NOTE: you are on your own with corals as they may be nipped. The only purpose of this post was to cool centropyge fever down a few degrees by presenting a viable solution.

 

Q & A Time

 

Q: Why a cherub?

A: Because they can live "reasonably happy in a 20.

 

Q: How do you know?

A: Because they have bred plenty of times in a 20.

 

Q: Why can't I put my clown, "Mr. Smooches" with my cherub?

A: because Mr. Cherub will give him 2 new #######s. Cherubs are rather mean and become more and more vicious with every square inch of tank space that you deprive them of.

 

Q: My friend has a bicolor angel in his nano. Why can't I?

A: your friend is selfish and doesn't care about the welfare of his animals or his tank.

 

Q: YES HE DOES!!!

A: Bullsh*t, and that wasn't a question.

 

Hope you all had fun reading this. It really will work. And please put the flame angel in your 75 instead.

[kryptonite]

Good post!  Thanks for the great reading.

[sjpresley]

Though I suppose I am probably the proximate cause of this thread thoughtfully began by Pulp, I would like to add that you may also try an african flameback angel (Centropyge acanthops) which actually stay smaller than C. argi at a max of 2.8" or a brazilian flameback (also called a fireball angel sometimes) that is of similar size.  By all accounts neither of these species are quite as aggressive as C. argi and have similar reef suitability characteristics (may nip some corals).

 

By the way Pulp, this evening my C. argi has less ich (maybe about half as much or less) than he has had each of the last few days and continues to act normally.  Still no treatment administered other than a few failed attempts at getting him to eat some garlic soaked algae and careful monitoring of the water parameters.

[pulpsmack]

Thanks for the replies. No Steve you aren't the sole cause by any means, though your situation helped inspire things. I am not so sure I would agree with the other angels listed (not saying that I disagree), as I am not sure about their contentedness in that size tank. I am glad the fish is still in stable health though it really needs that hospital soon (I am aware of your plans to do so). BTW, Don't you have a flame angel, (C. loriculus)?

 

(Edited by pulpsmack at 10:07 pm on April 19, 2002)

[sjpresley]

That is what I meant by "proximate", my situation precipitated the post.  Anyway, nope, I've never had a flame angel.  I did buy a flameback that showed signs of an intestinal infection (about which I posted) so I took him back to the store.  I have a pretty good relationship with the store owner so he agreed to give me store credit if the fish didn't make it and the fish if it did.  It didn't.

[sjpresley]

Pulp:

 

Lights just came on....the angel has NO white spots at all on it and continues to act normally (it seems to have a mission to clean every bit of hair algae in the tank before it rests).  Is it possible that the white spots were something else (besides ich)?  I still plan to set up a hospital tank, but at this point should I just keep an eye on the fish and see if he is rid the parasite (or whatever it was) instead of moving him?

 

Thanks in advance for the advice,

[tosi]

the Centropyge flavicauda as well stays relatively small like the fireball, argi, and flameback. Though its not as common in the trade. I think reason why you usually dont see people asking about flamebacks or the fireballs because they command a much greater price.

 

Also admit i got a flame in my 20g. It's quite small right now and im getting an itch to get to convert my 50g cichlid tank to a fowlr, or maybe by a used 75g for the extra 12" of space and convert to fowlr. Might even concider making some rock myself heh. an angel/butterfly tank would be nice..

[pulpsmack]

Yes, pay close attention to it. It is good that you aren't lulled into a false sense of security and choose to forgo the tank. One possibility is that you have a tough SOB who has a good immune system or some unfavorable conditions beset the parasites. Nonetheless they are probably infesting the system and will be quite visable the moment that he stresses again. Whatever the situation, it seems imperative for the overall well-being of your system to quarantine and/or treat the animals seperately and hold them in the hospital for the month. If the spots come back, you can be sure it will be far worse.

[sjpresley]

Thanks, do you happen to know if wrasses are less susceptible to ich as the 6-lined has never had any visible evidence of an infestation?

[pulpsmack]

It is not going to matter. The only way this erradication will work for certain is if you go fishless for an extended period of time. I never kept a sixline, but for some reason many of them would crap out at the store. What I hope to get across by mentioning this is the wrasse's propensity to succumb from stress caused diseases.

[Delph]

(Edited by Delph at 10:10 am on June 3, 2002)

[iFish]

I broke all the rules. I saw the COOLEST Sailfin Tang (Desajrdi) that was about 1.4 inches long + fins. I bought it for my 29 gallon reef. No worries though, when he outgrows the tank (Hopefully not for a while) he goes into my parents 250 gallon.

[pulpsmack]

You had better worry!!! I saw your earlier post and held my tongue, but this time I would like to tell you that your attitude is complete BS and you are acting the same as those reckless irresponsible people I rant and rave about all the time. A sailfin tang has NO place in a nano. You also don't know how to care for it. In addition, you can't just throw whatever you want into your parents' tank because you are liable to ruin that setup eventually. Also I understand that you bought a hard coral that you don't have the lighting for, and likely did not research enough before you put it in your tank. It really upsets me when I spend time to help people out with all their questions and then they just flat out disregard everything and do whatever the hell they want. Your parents' 250 is not going to bail you out of keeping a demanding hard coral, and it's offensive that you are so cavalier about your reckless behavior. I thought that spending some tome on this post would tech you better than that!

[iFish]

Ouch! First of all, I called the guy who runs my parents tank, and he said that my sailfin would be a great addition. The man at the LFS told me that a Plate Coral would do fine under my lighting. (130 watts Acintic/Daylight) The coral is extending fully, and the tang is eating and shows no signs of stress. When it gets bigger, I move it. I see no harm in what I did. I posted about it just to see a what other people think (as opposed to Russ, the man who runs my parent's tank) I was told that I would know when the tang was getting to big, both visually, and by the fact that he would pace about the tank. He dosen't.

[fish04]

You know Pulp, I admire your ability to be upfront and call people on their stubborness and lack of common sense.  (iFish don't read too far into this I have no opinion on your situation....your choice, good or bad). Pulp just hit a chord for me and I thought I would add to his self proclaimed Manifesto.

I too get annoyed with the folks who decide to forgo the helpless captive animal's well being for their own personal satisfaction. I sometimes wonder why people post some of this stuff, they have already decided what they are going to do and no one is going to change their mind.

Why do people post questions when they don't want to hear answers that might be counter to their own selfish needs?

I love answering questions, I love helping people who really want help, but there are too many people who are going to do what they want, no matter how many times experience shows they are wrong.

There are too many posts here with people saying that they just bought a so and so how big will they get, what do they eat, what kind of corals can I keep under my baby sister's night light, do I really need water in a reef tank....geesh!

 

Newbies....Ask questions there's nothing wrong with that, I love newbie questions, just don't set everything up with no idea then ask questions. Do research, do more research, then buy a book, buy 2, read other forums, read members web pages...THEN after you are informed set everything up.

 

I LOVE questions that start off... I 've been researching for a while now I need to decide between this and that what would you suggest. See, it shows thought, concern, knowledge.

 

I HATE questions that start off...Well I've had guppies for six months I like the pretty colors in a reef....I think I want a reef, my sister has a ten gallon with a screw in light what can I keep? This just shows poor thought, no reasearch, selfishness, and dare I say...stupidity!

 

Of course these are two extremes but you get my point...and niether is very far from the average "good" or "bad" post!

 

Hey, we all need to learn, I learn something new every day here but.... I made my mistakes, made alot of em. That's why I answer questions I don't like seeing people make the same mistakes I've made or have seen others make. That's why I get frustrated, because some people won't learn from the mistakes made by others in this forum, they will insist on doing it their way.....maybe someday they'll learn. I wonder why I bother sometimes........