Anemone species tank

[idog]

I realize it is generally frowned upon to mix clown species, but I want to run this idea past the more experienced reefers here...

 

Due to the massive growth of my GBTA, and the negative impact it is having on my other corals, I have decided to make my 24 a species tank. I am basically starting over and have sold everything but the nem.

 

The guy I got my BTA from has had his split again, and he has another clone for sale. I was thinking of picking this one up as well. It is quite small.

 

My question is, has anyone here mixed clown species? I mean like a skunk and a clarkii. Or a pair of ocellaris and single maroon. The dominant clown should have their pick of nem's and the loser should get the consilation prize, right? If they don't have to compete for hosts, will they be agressive to each other? I've seen people keep multiple damsel species in a tank, but there seems to be a consensus that clowns don't mix. Is this based on fact, or just conjecture.

 

If they were all juveniles, and introduced at the same time, might this be an option?

 

Opinions please.

 

[Fishfreak218]

i have tried it with a juvenile Maroon and a juvenlie perc...

the maroon was beating up on the perc... so i took the maroon out..

also.. the dominant clown will claim all the anemones for himself..

and pick on the other one to death..

[travisurfer]

mixing the bta's is fine, but mixing clowns ends in disaster

[idog]

Hmm...

 

I'm gald someone has tried this and I can learn form their mistakes.

 

I makes me wonder how multiple clown species exist together on reefs.

[travisurfer]

they just need more room. than such a tiny tank.

[Fishfreak218]

at my LFS there is a tank that is 20x4x5 FEET!

and there are multiple clowns in that tank..and it works out.

also in www.oregonreef.com he has multiple clowns and ALOT of anemones..

[geekreef_05]

A trio of clowns is likely to end in disaster. Yet if you mixed, say a Clarki and a O Clown (which Ive seen done) they seem to get alone fine as a pair.

 

Ive seen this done before in a local reefers tank, and it was an old tank. When I asked about the situation he said they'd both been there for quite some time and never fought. They shared a host anemone too. The tank was a 90 gallon cube.

 

Use this info as you will, this may have been a unique situation.

[idog]

On another note,

 

I am thinking of getting a maroon clown pair. What might be the result if one were to get a yellowstripe maroon and a whitestripe? The taxonomy is the same.

[idog]

I know morrons get too big for a nano...

 

Hypothetically.

[Clownfishcrazy1117]

I have 2 different clowns species in my tank. A maroon and a percula. I know that I am very lucky and this is a very rare case. And don't say that they will end up fighting, because I know they won't. They squabble occasionally, but aside from that they have been living peacefully for 5 months together in a 46 gallon bowfront.

[Charlie97L]

i've talked to a few people about this, and mixing works better if you have multiple pairs.. of coures, that makes for a larger tank.

 

also, getting them young, captive bred, and keeping them on flake reduces aggression. once they sex and get huge, then they get really irritable.

[idog]

Alright, so here is the update.

 

I've decided to go with a single maroon clown. He/she is captive bred and has been living in a more aggressive community FO tank at my LFS. I've always loved the way this one looks as his coloration fades to black on his fins.

 

insert low res video clip of his first hosting my nem

 

 

Anyways, I got him home and to my delight, he hosted immediatley in my BTA. In fact, he won't leave the safety of the nem at all. He eats, but only when I spot feed in his vacinity, and he can just dart out an grab it. Is this normal? I also noticed that the BTA's tenacles would not attach to food. (i fed mysis) It is usually very responsive when fed. IS this a reaction to losing nematocysts while stinging the clown?

 

Also, my tank has only been set up in it's current config for about a week, but my BTA settled on a perch and has seemed content there. This morning, it has moved to a new spot and the foot is attached to the side of the tank rather than a rock. I assume this is a stress indicator.

 

Any experience/advice would be appreciated.

 

Thx

[BrassMonkey030]

beautiful anemone and fish. my stupid clown will not host anything.

 

can you send me a file of that video so i can play it in a loop in front of him?

[TikiJosh]

Hi to all. My first post. Been lurking around a bit, looking for info on a refugium for my Nano-Cube 24. But I digress. I've got a bit of info about the clown mixing question, might be helpful.

First, about the clown mixing question-- I've seen a display tank at the Long Beach Aquarium that had several clownfish in it but also had tons of anemones. It's been a while, so I can't recall if they had multiple species, but I want to say that they did. In any case, I'd agree with travisurfer that it's probably more of a space issue than anything else. That and food availability.

I'd defintely say not to put maroons in with any other type of clown. Maroons are pretty aggressive, especially as they get older. IME, when they're small, they're as good natured as can be, but once they hit a particular size, they'll attack anything that gets too close to the anemone. Literally. Anything. Your hand, other fish (wrasses, angels, whatever).

I believe you might have some experience raising other clownfish species together. Try something like clarks and sebaes, that kind of stuff. Oftentimes, the mixed species pairings can result in hybrid offspring, too. There's more information in the "Clownfishes" book by Joyce Wilkerson. Excellent book, and well worth the cover price. I bought one a few years ago and haven't regretted it.

 

Regarding the yellowstripe and whitestripe question, no personal experience, but if you pair the clowns off correctly, you shouldn't have any trouble. Not sure what offspring would look like either. Interesting idea.

When I made my first pair of maroons I started with a small guy that I'd had for a long time. I then added a big maroon, about 3 times the size of the small one. Pretty much no fighting, the little guy did his "twitchy dance" and they got along pretty well. The little guy wasn't allowed in the anemone at first, then he was allowed in at night, and then he was okay in the anemone 24/7. It took a while, but as long as they're not actively fighting, you should be okay. The little clown will have to do the "twitchy dance" several times a day for the rest of his life. Not really sure how to describe it. Sort of looks like he's having a seizure, or just wiggling funny. You'll notice him do it when the big clown sort of "charges" at him. It looks really odd, but it's perfectly normal.

Definitely avoid trying to pair similarly sized individuals. Probably the most important part. Try to get one really small, and one large. Sorry if you already knew that. Hopefully someone will benefit from it.

 

BrassMonkey030--

I had the same trouble with my first maroons years ago. The lone little guy I had wouldn't go in an anemone, and would actually take food from it. Eventually the anemone died. The clown did like hanging out in the branching hammer coral and would also sort of "sit" in some of my mushrooms. No luck getting him in an anemone. I think I tried twice.

Then I had luck. I bought a big clown for pairing, and also got a sea anemone from the tank where the big clown was being kept. Big clown was already used to the anemone, so once they were acclimated, he hardly ever left it. Once the little guy caught on, he tried to get right in. They had to work out their pair-bonding issues first, but in the end the little guy went in the anemone.

Aside from trying to pair off the clown you have, I have no other good advice for getting a clown in an anemone.

 

Lastly, about the aneomone "walking" around, moving from perch to wall of tank-- not to worry. The anemone will move to wherever it decides is optimal. It is most important that you not try to move it, or place it where you think it will do best. The anemone will decide for itself. The one I've got originally came to me attached to a shell. I put the shell in a great spot in my tank, and was so pleased. Then, about two days later, I notice the anemone had crawled to the back of my tank and wasn't visible at all. About a week and a half later, it had moved again, to a spot in the center of the tank and it pretty much hasn't moved from that spot in almost 4 years. I've tried moving anemones before, and all that kind of thing, and it just seems to stress them out. You'd be best off just leaving it alone. It'll move to wherever it's happiest. One good way to keep it from moving once it finally settles might be feeding it. Good luck.

Yikes. This turned into a really long post. Sorry!

[Fishfreak218]

yeah,

most BTA's when new will hide in the rockwork for a little while, so if you see that happening dont freak out

[idog]

Wow Tikijosh, what a post.

 

much appreciated.

 

My concern is the roaming. I've had the anemone for about 5 months, and it was stable till I got the maroon. Now it is literally climbing the walls. the maroon which was quite social at the LFS is guarding it like a hawk and won't leave it at all.

 

My BTA has not done the hiding thing in months. Can a clown love an anemone to death?

[TikiJosh]

My concern is the roaming. I've had the anemone for about 5 months, and it was stable till I got the maroon. Now it is literally climbing the walls.

 

Hmmm. That is a little strange. I've not had experience with the anemone moving after such a long stretch of time. Is it continuing to move, or has it selected a spot on the glass and stayed there? If it continues to move, then something is definitely not right. That would imply that it's trying to see if its living conditions can be improved by checking out other places.

There's a lot of speculation as to whether the anemone benefits from hosting clownfish. Some scientists say that clowns protect the anemones from butterfly fish and other would-be predators. Some say that the swimming activity helps to aerate the anemone and sweep away waste (sort of like housekeeping, I guess). It could be that your anemone liked it's old spot as sort of a happy medium of current and light. All of that to say this: perhaps with the clown it's receiving a different amount of water movement and now it wants to change its light exposure.

In any case, I'd only be concerned if it continues to move, and does so on a regular basis. You might find that after things settle down a bit, the anemone might go back to its old spot.

The thing that concerns me most upon re-reading your old post is the non-responsiveness of anemone to food. When was it fed last? Did it eat okay then? I've known anemones to shrug off food when recently fed. Of course, if it's stressed from re-configuring the tank, that might explain the loss of nematocysts, and may have very little to do with the clown. What type of reconfiguring did you do? Just move a few rocks around? The anemone may be stressed from the reconfig and also the new fish and subsequent change in water chemistry. However, if it looks as good today as it does in the video when you posted it, I wouldn't worry too much. The anemone moving around may also be partially due to the reconfig. It may have decided after a week that it didn't have such a good spot after all.

 

My BTA has not done the hiding thing in months. Can a clown love an anemone to death?

I have had experience with a clownfish buffeting the anemone so much that it sort of just dies. It just gets pulverized. That happened to me once, but the clownfish was probably too big for the anemone.

It looks like you got a relatively small maroon and that your anemone is a pretty good size, so you probably don't have to worry about it. I'd be concerned only if you notice a change in the anemones appearance.

 

the maroon which was quite social at the LFS is guarding it like a hawk and won't leave it at all.

I also might have an answer to this, too. Looks like he's small, about an inch and a half? When maroons are that size, in an anemone as large as the one you've got, they pretty much don't leave the anemone. The larger clown in the pair is the one that does all the swimming around, and checking things out and defending the anemone.

The maroon pair that I have in my tank at home does this exact thing. The smaller fish is only about an inch long. The big is about 2 and a half or so. The little guy stays in the anemone all day long. The big one swims around and checks things out, but even then doesn't stray far. I'm not even sure they've realized there's a royal gramma in there with them.

I think the reason your maroon was so social at the LFS was because he probably didn't have a place to "hide". He was out because he had to be out. Several years ago, when I got my very first maroon clown, he didn't have an ameone, and he acted very social, just like you said. He'd swim around and sort of visit with the other fish in the tank. Once he got paired up and had an anemone though, he pretty much never left it.

Yikes! Another novella sized post. I better get back to work!

[idog]

I did do a major rearrangement of the tank. I am turning it into an Anemone species tank. This has involved me getting rid of most of my rock and other corals. I do not have much rock in there right now, I have more curing. I have a huge clump of Chaeto to soak up nutrients until the rock is ready. I fractured the rock the anemone was on so as not to displace the foot, and left the piece of rock it was on.

 

Here is why I had to get rid of the rock...

 

Hair algae was taking over. And the rock work was really limiting my aquascaping.

 

Anyways here is a video of the clown feeding behaviour and the position of the Anemone. This can't be the best place for it... and I really don't want it there.

 

[TikiJosh]

Looks like the anemone is okay. If it was being killed by the clown it would look a lot worse, IME. Shrunk up all the time, that kind of thing. It's been staying in that one spot then, huh? I sympathize with you not liking where it went, but I don't know that you can do much about that. You can pry it off the glass, but even if you didn't damage the anemone, it'd probably just crawl right back up to where it is.

Since you've got more live rock curing and you're not done with the setup, I wouldn't worry about it yet. Once you add the rest of your rock, the water currents in your tank will change again, and the anemone might make another move.

The BTA I've got at home has been on the same rock for about 4 years now, but that rock hasn't changed really. It's also remained in the same location despite any other aquascape changes I've made. It's been sort of a pain, but I didn't want the anemone to feel the need to move around.

Best of luck to you. Keep posting pics.

[idog]

I hope you are right. When the new rock is ready It should move. I think it is drawn to be higher up in the tank.

 

Thanks for the advice.

[TikiJosh]

It might like to be higher up to get better light exposure. Looks like it was pretty high up in your old set up. What kind of lights you got over your tank? Maybe it couldn't get up high enough in the new arrangement and decided to go up the glass.

Best advice I can give is to keep your water quality up and keep an eye on the anemone, be alert for the slightest hint that it's not doing well.

[idog]

Man, I am so upset today...

 

I added my new rock and figured everything was great. My anemone was still up on the glass under the outflow nozzle. When the rock was in there for 2 days, I noticed it was slowwwwwly moving a bit and was now on the back wall. Great, I figured. I assumed it was getting used to the new flow dynamics and would soon find a place to settle.

 

This morning I woke up and the anemone was nowhere to be found. My clown was swimming around looking ###edm and he never leaves his anemone. I began searching for it with a flashlight (my lights hadn't come on yet). I then noticed a green strand sticking between the slats of the surface skimmer. Sure enough, it had gotten itself stuck in the overflow. I tried to ease it out, but it was extremely tangled in the slats. I shut off the pump and put a PH in the tank for current.

 

It is not dead, as it is still photoreactive but the foot looks ripped. I turned the lights on and hopefully it will back its way out toward the light.

 

Man, I am sick about this.

 

I'm at work right now so I can't check on it. I'll be home around 5. I am wondering if it can't get itself untangled, would it be possible to cut the part of the foot that was not caught to try and save it?

 

Advice would be appreciated.

[Tony]

I sold a RBTA clone to a guy and when he tried removing it from my rock he ripped a chunk from the anemone's foot. I called him about a week later and he said that the anemone was healing well. It is possible that it will recover if part of it's foot gets cut off.

[CGNano]

My anemone used to look like that.

 

it lived for a realllyyyy long time.

[BrassMonkey030]

these things are more hardy then ppl say. i had one get stuck in a rio 1100 for a while. little pink specs all over the tank. he was looked fine after 3 days.

also had a clone really get on my nerves. tore a whole strip foot to tenticles off. hes doing great now and aggravating corals.