My custom 18x18x18 inch cube in England diary

[jemram]

After doing alot of research I've worked out all the plans for my 18x18x18'' cube. The tank is going to closely follow fish's foot cube (Click here to see that), and I need to say a BIG thanks to Fish for the idea and the help via PM. The tank is going to be as 'minimalist' as possible with no visable equipment anywhere other than the metal halide pendant hanging from above.

 

The equipment will be the following (being in England, some of the equipment you guys use in not avalible here (or wont work with our 220v power):

 

# Custom built 18'' cube with two 1 inch bulkheads in the centre of the base, all put together with black silicone (will hold 25 US gallons).

# Eheim 1262 external pump rated at 900 US GPH

# 150W 14,000K Arcadia Metal Halide pendant (is 150W enough/too much?)

# DIY cabinet which will also be 18x18x18'', and the will sit in the middle of my lounge

# 200w Hydor External Heater

# Hockey pucks to sit the tank on

# Live rock for filtration (I could use some advice on how much I need)

# 1 inch layer of live sand

 

Thats about it other than pipework and wiring (unless you guys point something out). It's going to be fun, and I'll keep this thread updated with pictures etc. The first step is going to be buying the pump this week so I have have the bulkheads in the base of the tank a matching size to the connections in the pump.

[Capt_Nemo]

Wow, that is really nice. Pictures, pictures and pictures please. the glass is regular glass or starphire? I have always wanted to do a tank like that but just afraid it is too difficult for me. 150 W is bright but i don't think it is overkill. What kind of fishes are you going to keep in there.

keep us updated.

 

good luck.

[jemram]

Wow, that is really nice. Pictures, pictures and pictures please. the glass is regular glass or starphire? I have always wanted to do a tank like that but just afraid it is too difficult for me. 150 W is bright but i don't think it is overkill. What kind of fishes are you going to keep in there.

keep us updated.

 

good luck.

 

There's no pictures yet but I'm a keen photographer so there will be lots of them.

 

What is Starphire glass? It's not something I've heard of, and I'm not sure it's avalible in the UK.

 

Fish wise, it's just going to be 2 or 3 small fish, as yet undecided.

[reefinnewb]

Starphire is low iron glass. It is not as green as regular plate glass. Im gonna be building a tank soon also. 30x30x20. Its no longer a nano but im ready for a larger tank. This tank will take awhile to complete but will be my project for the next little while.

[jemram]

Starphire is low iron glass. It is not as green as regular plate glass. Im gonna be building a tank soon also. 30x30x20. Its no longer a nano but im ready for a larger tank. This tank will take awhile to complete but will be my project for the next little while.

 

Thanks I'll look into that. Any idea how much more Starphire glass is than normal glass?

[psidriven]

Starphire is a brand name. Just do a search for low iron glass in your area. Not sure as to price though sure to be more.

[reefinnewb]

I think it is about double the cost of regular plate glass.

[jemram]

150 W is bright but i don't think it is overkill.

 

Any more opinions on if 150W is enough/too much for an 18x18x18'' cube? Also how much live rock am I going to need for a 25 gallon tank?

[jemram]

I've arranged to go and see the guy who is going to be building my tank on Monday. The tank is going to be very simple, but I want to be sure he has a clear understanding of exactly what I want. I also want to see some of the tanks he has built, just to be sure.

 

I have asked him about using low lead glass, but it's going to cost another £100 and he says it's not that noticable anyway. As it is the tank is going to be made from 10mm (3/8s) thick glass and with the holes and the bulkheads is going to cose just short of £200.

[fras]

£200 seems like alot, who's the builder? I'm pretty sure you could get someone like acaquactics to build AND deliver the tank for you for half that. I agree I don't think low iron is worth it on a tank this size, imo it only makes sense on larger tanks with thicker glass(unless you have money to burn).

 

As for the setup it looks good, a concern of mine would be lack of filtration/space for media & topup. I don't think I'd run a tank without at least a bag of phosphate media and you're going to have to do daily manual topups to keep up with evap. Fish dealt with the evap problem well but it looks expensive, as for filtration you probably can't get a canister that will give enough circulation for a 25G. In that case I think I'd be tempted to T the inlet and have 2 returns, one for flow and 1 from a canister/phosphate reactor or whatever. Another thought on cirulation, you could think about testing how 900gph shooting vertically through 18" of water works out. You may well find it breaks the surface - possibly another good reason to have 2 outlets (share the total flow on each).

 

Like I said though it sounds good, would love something similar myself.

[ninjafish]

Wow, and here is the thread. It sounds like you are off to a great start and I can't wait to see how it progresses. My vote is for the 150w halide - it definitely isn't too much light but I think it will be enough for your needs. To give you an example, I had a 70w halide over my 8" (2gal) cube and it was probably a little too much light. When I switched to the 12" cube though, I noticed a big reduction in brightness. I think for an 18" cube, you would find that a single 70w would be too little. If you had the money and could afford two 70w's I would say go with that. I didn't have the budget for it but I really wanted to set up dual 70w bulbs over my tank. That would have allowed me to have a dawn/dusk effect with halides. I would have a 20k come on first and then a 10k a bit later.

 

If you have to go with just one bulb though, I found 14k to be a really nice compromise between color and par.

Cheers,

 

- Chad

[deacon hemp]

I agree with fish,not too much light,i had a 16" cube with a 175w and it was perfect.

[jemram]

£200 seems like alot, who's the builder? I'm pretty sure you could get someone like acaquactics to build AND deliver the tank for you for half that. I agree I don't think low iron is worth it on a tank this size, imo it only makes sense on larger tanks with thicker glass(unless you have money to burn).

 

As for the setup it looks good, a concern of mine would be lack of filtration/space for media & topup. I don't think I'd run a tank without at least a bag of phosphate media and you're going to have to do daily manual topups to keep up with evap. Fish dealt with the evap problem well but it looks expensive, as for filtration you probably can't get a canister that will give enough circulation for a 25G. In that case I think I'd be tempted to T the inlet and have 2 returns, one for flow and 1 from a canister/phosphate reactor or whatever. Another thought on cirulation, you could think about testing how 900gph shooting vertically through 18" of water works out. You may well find it breaks the surface - possibly another good reason to have 2 outlets (share the total flow on each).

 

Like I said though it sounds good, would love something similar myself.

 

It does seem alot for an 18x18x18 tank, but it is being made from 10mm glass with two holes and he's supplying the fittings etc too. I'm going to pop over and see him on Monday. It's being built by www.tankbuilduk.com.

 

As for filtration all I'm going to use is live rock, nothing else. I want the tank to be a simple as possible. To maintain water quality I'm simply going to do reqular waterchanges. I'm going to look into ways of performing waterchanges by slowly adding the new water over about 4 hours. I'm also looking at auto top off setups and a Fishs' dosing pump looks like a good idea (not cheap though!)

 

I don't think that 900gph is going to cause a problem. It it does, I've got a few ideas to stop it looking like a fountain!

[jemram]

I've just found this to use as an auto top off system plumbed into the hose running from the tank to the main curculation pump.

 

http://www.williamsonpumps.co.uk/AQUADOSER.pdf

[ninjafish]

Hey that pump looks nice, as long as you were going to hang it over the top of your tank and let it drip in. However, you could not plumb a peristaltic pump into your return line, like I did with my topoff pump - that is a recipe for disaster! This type of pump is not made to handle the kind of backpressure that your would get from your circulation pump and 25gallons of water sitting on the bulkheads. I have never heard of anyone connecting a topoff pump into their return line before I did it, but as soon as you tap into that closed loop, you open up a weak link for the water to drain out of. Any time you do it, you are taking a risk - the difference is that my weak link was an industrial grade piston-fired diaphragm pump that could dose into systems that had up to 110psi of pressure. I wouldn't have risked my livestock on an IV pump. If there was a way that you could dose your topoff water from above the water level, it would eliminate the risk of your tank draining and would allow you to go with a less-expensive pump like the one you listed. Best of luck.

 

- Chad

[jemram]

Hey that pump looks nice, as long as you were going to hang it over the top of your tank and let it drip in. However, you could not plumb a peristaltic pump into your return line, like I did with my topoff pump - that is a recipe for disaster! This type of pump is not made to handle the kind of backpressure that your would get from your circulation pump and 25gallons of water sitting on the bulkheads. I have never heard of anyone connecting a topoff pump into their return line before I did it, but as soon as you tap into that closed loop, you open up a weak link for the water to drain out of. Any time you do it, you are taking a risk - the difference is that my weak link was an industrial grade piston-fired diaphragm pump that could dose into systems that had up to 110psi of pressure. I wouldn't have risked my livestock on an IV pump. If there was a way that you could dose your topoff water from above the water level, it would eliminate the risk of your tank draining and would allow you to go with a less-expensive pump like the one you listed. Best of luck.

 

- Chad

 

Thats a good consideration Chad, and I've already thought about it. With a 4 roller peristaltic pump I cant see how it can backflow, even in the event of a power outage. I've emailed the manufacturer asking about backflow etc. I'm going to plumb it into the hose that runs from the tank to the intake of the pump, so it wont be under the same preasure are the hose that the main pumps through. Also a oneway valve in the peristaltic pumps line is an option to make back flow absolutly impossible.

 

Hanging any pipes etc over the tank is NOT an option. The ONLY peice of equipment that will not be hidden in the cabinet will be the metal halide.

[ninjafish]

Sounds good, and I hope that it works for you, but an important thing to always remember is that the only way to make 'back flow absolutly impossible' is to keep the loop closed. Even with the superiour equipment that I was using, I was constantly aware that back flow was still a possibility (even if it was remote).

I am not trying to burst your bubble, I only want to help you avoid any disasters - I'm sure that when you're done, your tank is going to be stunning. One thing to bear in mind though, is that a peristaltic pump is probably the most likely pump design to fail under pressure. The rubber tubing stretches and wears down as it is used - that part of the pump is really designed to be disposable and replaced. For most applications, it will work for a long long time - however, if your had the weight of your entire, expensive reef sitting on it -> Murphy's Law says it WILL fail. And it will probably do it while you are on vacation...

You mentioned the use of a one-way or check valve as a backup. Most reefers will recommend against relying on a one-way valve because, over time, they will build up with gunk that might cause them to fail right in your moment of need. I don't really mind the theory of them as long as it was used as a backup and not your primary line of defense.

However, for your application, a one way valve will do absolutely NOTHING to help you. The important concept to understand here is "cracking pressure". That is the minimum amount of upstream pressure that is needed to cause the valve to close. If you were using a check valve on your 5/8" eheim tubing and the water started to pour out of your 5/8" line, (and the valve was clean and working properly), then the weight of the water would/should shut the valve. Your eheim tubing isn't the problem though - the leaking water is going to be coming out of a 2mm or 5mm dosing line. I seriously doubt that anyone makes a one-way valve for 5mm plumbing. Even if you could find one, it is unlikely that your dosing pump is just going to suddenly let go and release all the water back through the pump head; more likely, the backflow will be a smaller trickle that escapes through the rollers due to thinning and stretched hose... and you can backflow water through a one-way valve all day... you could empty a whole swimming pool backwards through a one-way valve ---------> just as long as you are pouring it slow enough that it is less than the minimun required cracking pressure. Any leak that begins slow will probably not be enough to activate the check valve. Hope this makes sense.

 

- Chad

[jemram]

Sounds good, and I hope that it works for you, but an important thing to always remember is that the only way to make 'back flow absolutly impossible' is to keep the loop closed. Even with the superiour equipment that I was using, I was constantly aware that back flow was still a possibility (even if it was remote).

I am not trying to burst your bubble, I only want to help you avoid any disasters - I'm sure that when you're done, your tank is going to be stunning. One thing to bear in mind though, is that a peristaltic pump is probably the most likely pump design to fail under pressure. The rubber tubing stretches and wears down as it is used - that part of the pump is really designed to be disposable and replaced. For most applications, it will work for a long long time - however, if your had the weight of your entire, expensive reef sitting on it -> Murphy's Law says it WILL fail. And it will probably do it while you are on vacation...

You mentioned the use of a one-way or check valve as a backup. Most reefers will recommend against relying on a one-way valve because, over time, they will build up with gunk that might cause them to fail right in your moment of need. I don't really mind the theory of them as long as it was used as a backup and not your primary line of defense.

However, for your application, a one way valve will do absolutely NOTHING to help you. The important concept to understand here is "cracking pressure". That is the minimum amount of upstream pressure that is needed to cause the valve to close. If you were using a check valve on your 5/8" eheim tubing and the water started to pour out of your 5/8" line, (and the valve was clean and working properly), then the weight of the water would/should shut the valve. Your eheim tubing isn't the problem though - the leaking water is going to be coming out of a 2mm or 5mm dosing line. I seriously doubt that anyone makes a one-way valve for 5mm plumbing. Even if you could find one, it is unlikely that your dosing pump is just going to suddenly let go and release all the water back through the pump head; more likely, the backflow will be a smaller trickle that escapes through the rollers due to thinning and stretched hose... and you can backflow water through a one-way valve all day... you could empty a whole swimming pool backwards through a one-way valve ---------> just as long as you are pouring it slow enough that it is less than the minimun required cracking pressure. Any leak that begins slow will probably not be enough to activate the check valve. Hope this makes sense.

 

- Chad

 

 

I can see exactly what you're saying Chad. I'm trying to work out a way of doing it, but so far drawing a blank. It is one of those things that most likely wont happen, but if it did I'd have a very wet floor and lose everything in the tank.

 

I have found this check valve though http://www.bio-chemvalve.com/product.asp?n...mp;x=60&y=6

[fras]

If things don't work out and you're going for a lamp style halide (same as fish) I guess you could hide a pipe in the fixture and have a simple timed release based on calculated evap loss. It's basic but it would work without worry.

[jemram]

If things don't work out and you're going for a lamp style halide (same as fish) I guess you could hide a pipe in the fixture and have a simple timed release based on calculated evap loss. It's basic but it would work without worry.

 

I'm going to be using an Arcadia 3 Series Pendant so thats not really an option.

 

Another option is to run silicone airline hose through the wall of the 1 inch hose that will feed the circulation pump and into the tank, then use silicone sealer to stick it to the bottom of the tank, and up the inside of one corner of tank to finish about 1/2 an inch from the water surface. It would be barely noticeable and in the event of backflow, I would only lose 1/2 inch of water which would be put into the RO bucket sitting in the cabinet. But it's a comprimise to the clean look of the tank, and adds the risk of a leak where the silicone airline hose goes through the wall of the 1 inch hose.

[ninjafish]

That is a good find mate! I stand corrected, they do make them that small.

It looks like it may work as a backup to your pump...

I would make sure that you weren't dosing anything else with your topoff water (like calcium etc). As long as there was only pure water going through the lines, it should prevent the valve from getting gunked up. Maybe run some vinegar through the line once in a while. Let's see what the manufacturer says about the pump's pressure rating. The only other option I was thinking was to run the line up along your halide so it was overhanging the tank and dripped the water right it. You could camoflage it so it looked like a wire or part of the fixture...

 

Great work.

 

- Chad

 

EDIT: Oh Fras, already came up with that idea

[jemram]

That is a good find mate! I stand corrected, they do make them that small.

It looks like it may work as a backup to your pump...

I would make sure that you weren't dosing anything else with your topoff water (like calcium etc). As long as there was only pure water going through the lines, it should prevent the valve from getting gunked up. Maybe run some vinegar through the line once in a while. Let's see what the manufacturer says about the pump's pressure rating. The only other option I was thinking was to run the line up along your halide so it was overhanging the tank and dripped the water right it. You could camoflage it so it looked like a wire or part of the fixture...

 

Great work.

 

- Chad

 

EDIT: Oh Fras, already came up with that idea

 

I will only be running RO water through the pump/check valve so it should stay nice and clean. Also the manufacturer of the dosing pump recomend that it's run on a timer, rather than 24/7, so the valve will be opened and closed frequently so that should stop the valve seizing up.

 

I might be tempted to run two check valves in line though

 

Let's see what the manufacturer says about the pump's pressure rating.

 

It does say on their website that it has a max head pressure of 10m. Not sure what that is in PSI though

[jemram]

Ok, I've got an email back from the peristaltic pump manufacturer who have said there should be no problem with backflow though the pump but that a check valve would be a good idea, which they can supply.

[jemram]

Just to add, the tank is being built next week. I can't wait

[jemram]

I'm still unsure on if I should go for clear or black silicone