Hair Algae... Running low on ideas

[Old Gregg]

Let me start off by saying hello to everyone, I post nearly as much as I should considering everything I have learned from you all on this forum over the past 8 months

 

I have a problem. A month ago I was given a small bowfront tank from a friend who was moving. He said it was 30 gallons but it looks significantly smaller than that to me. It's 19 inches long, and 9 inches wide (excluding the bow) and I don't remember how tall. I think 14 or 15 inches. When I got it there was a little bit of hair algae growing I figured that wouldnt be a huge problem I'll scrape it off in a bucket when doing a water change and reduce feedings and lower the bioload by taking out the anthias which shouldnt be in there anyway. Currently the only major bioload in the tank are 2 ocellaris clowns, a pygmy African Angel, cleaner shrimp, and a few decent sized brittle stars. Now the angel should be taken out asap because it's not happy in a tank this size anyway imo, he's going when I move in a month and relocate the tank. I can only catch it if I take out all the live rock lol.

 

The tank had no sump. So I added a wet dry sump rated for 75 gallons, took out the bio balls and converted that area into a fuge with chaeto. There is small skimmer I think it's the biocube skimmer rated for biocube 14 and 29. I have mechanical filtration in the overflow box and in the trickle down filter. Clean them every 2 days. I feed the tank sparingly 3 times a week. Water change every Friday, about 4 gallons worth. I've changed the lighting to marineland reef capable led last week (and everything is loving it btw )

I make my own Ro/Di water.

 

Lights on a timer, 8 hours in the display and 16 hours in the refugium. no light from the refugium spills over into the display. I don't know what else I can do to help!! Oh and I always run carbon. And I rip out small chunks every other day with my fingers to keep it from getting out of control, being as careful as I can not to let small filaments float off as best I can. I've been in the hobby for 7 months. and the tank was established for 2 years before it was given to me

 

Any ideas are greatly appreciated! HELP!

 

ps I didn't proofreed anything above so I probably repeated myself more than once but my time is limited at work hehe

 

Pics

1. When I first got the tank

2. When the tank was first set up at my house

3. as off 3 or 4 days ago

[brandon429]

the peroxide thread is 9 pages for a good reason lol

 

your tank looks nice! should be an easy fix. It could be clear of algae by Wednesday in fact.

[Old Gregg]

the peroxide thread is 9 pages for a good reason lol

 

your tank looks nice! should be an easy fix. It could be clear of algae by Wednesday in fact.

 

 

 

 

But... but... but.... I'm scared!! lol

[wtdREEF]

I'M OLD GREG! PLEASED TO MEET YA WHATCHA DOIN IN MY WATERS?

[brandon429]

all you would have to do to knock out 90% of that algae by wednesday is drain the tank for a 75% water change, leave enough for your fish to swim in, and while the tank is drained use a small spray bottle to accurately spritz peroxide onto only the algae, just one pump per area of algae is enough. Wait two mins, then refill, it will fall off in three days white and you have added the equivalent of a few drops overall to your tank. The huge water change dilutes it, and small amounts are not harmful in the system anyway it only raises systemic oxygen for a flash

 

I figure you've already known, read and applied the common algae solutions. None of them fix ya by wednesday lol

 

it doesn't make the algae grow back faster either, thats a misnomer. That amount of algae you have for an aged tank that was just moved/relocated and kicked up all that waste really isn't that bad. Couple peroxide sprays and it will be clean, easy fixins.

[Lawnman]

There are 2 people I take advice from on this forum. Brandon being my go to guy. If he is telling you something it will work. He wouldn't tell you to do something if it would hurt your tank.

[brandon429]

thanks lawnman I also appreciate friar1's feedback regarding GFO, I saw him turn a reef that had a lot of algae into pristinely clean with just granular ferric oxide use as a phosphate binder in his filter, there are many ways to find the same outcome. he didn't alter anything other than using a phosphate binder so at least there are some tech options as opposed to the tried and true using clean up crews that sometimes miss the mark...i would assume you have an array of crabs and snails in the tank old greg? what kind, just wondering

[SbCaes]

1. natural predators : in order of punch

sea hare, sea lettuce, turbo, emerald, and so forth. (reefcleaners)

2. chemical filtration (starvation method)

gfo/chemipure/carbon/ dosing/ h202 *very very effective.

3. mechanical filtration

uv filters / skimmers . ( best combined with a dosing method )

4. manual removal

 

i generally prefer using the natural approach with manual removal. and some h202 to boot. works well in my experience.

[maxwell]

Gregg, I'm just about to finish a long fight with hair algae. I was really about to throw in the towel and sell everything associated with the tank(yes, it was that bad). I tried every conventional method out there. It was working me to death doing double duty water changes, pulling manually, every cleanup guy out there, gfo, you name it. I wish I would have read brandon's thread before I did what I did but it has worked out for me. As a last resort I started vodka dosing. I read up a lot on it and decided I was comfortable enough to try it. I have been vodka dosing for about a month now and it's just about all gone. So glad I did it. Not saying it's for you but just another option to try. Goodluck with it and hang in there.

[Old Gregg]

Mandatory Old Gregg retort: Just taking the air, you know. Not fishing hehehe

 

Brandon, I skimmed your post a while ago with the peroxide and it put me on edge a bit because I couldn't bare somehow mucking it up and hurting all the animals. But I didn't catch the idea of using a spray bottle, I thought of dipping the entire rocks. I shall return to the post and read every reply and maybe talk myself into it

 

I don't have many snails that seem remotely interested in this algae nor my emerald and hermits.

Current clean up crew:

1 emerald

3 blue legged hermits

10+ ceriths which pretty much eat diatoms and such

2 nerites

A dozen of sluglike snails with small shells. These guys reproduce like crazy in my 55 gallon and hitchiked into this tank

[SbCaes]

Mandatory Old Gregg retort: Just taking the air, you know. Not fishing hehehe

 

Brandon, I skimmed your post a while ago with the peroxide and it put me on edge a bit because I couldn't bare somehow mucking it up and hurting all the animals. But I didn't catch the idea of using a spray bottle, I thought of dipping the entire rocks. I shall return to the post and read every reply and maybe talk myself into it

 

I don't have many snails that seem remotely interested in this algae nor my emerald and hermits.

Current clean up crew:

1 emerald

3 blue legged hermits

10+ ceriths which pretty much eat diatoms and such

2 nerites

A dozen of sluglike snails with small shells. These guys reproduce like crazy in my 55 gallon and hitchiked into this tank

 

nothing there with any real cutting power to eat gha btw.

[Old Gregg]

nothing there with any real cutting power to eat gha btw.

 

yeah... I know =/ I suppose I brought that on myself. I'm thinking a few astrea snails would be wise to keep in here to help keep things in check. I'd get a turbo.... but I couldn't deal with it knocking things over left and right lol

 

On a side note, it is 2:30 in the morning and I just got back from walmart with a spray bottle of hydrogen peroxide and I gave them the treatment. I will keep you all posted over the next few days.

 

Also... bristleworms HATE H2O2

[SbCaes]

yeah... I know =/ I suppose I brought that on myself. I'm thinking a few astrea snails would be wise to keep in here to help keep things in check. I'd get a turbo.... but I couldn't deal with it knocking things over left and right lol

 

On a side note, it is 2:30 in the morning and I just got back from walmart with a spray bottle of hydrogen peroxide and I gave them the treatment. I will keep you all posted over the next few days.

 

Also... bristleworms HATE H2O2

 

id strongly reccomend a natural solution. if you can do it. urchins. turbos. slugs. whatever floats your boat. turbos arent as bad as some ppl say.

[brandon429]

wow they already make it in a spray what a trip!! Thats amazingly convenient they should just sell it as a reef use product lol. Please post after pics, there's no chance of it not working on algae, its the strangest algaecide Ive ever seen after Reefmiser posted what it did for his tank. One nice changeup you can run is using the peroxide to wipe out what you have, then all natural methods to prevent recurrence. Can't wait to see how it turned out, algae simply cannot live in the presence of a spray of peroxide, it will be white within 3 days and strangely the clean up crew is more attracted to it when its dying lol.

 

Some of the recommendations for natural removal like sea slugs can't be left in the system after the algae is gone, so they are rather temporary as well but are an animal-based approach. that algae will probably be white within the next ten hours, watch this w be neat.

B

[brandon429]

I wouldn't even use a whole pump's worth on the algae, just a quarter pump enough to get the smallest dose of peroxide out on that algae carpeting. Even though its work intensive, consider the option next time of doing a double 75% water change when spot dosing the peroxide...one change is to drain the tank to have access to the algae, treat/wait 2 mins then refill....the second drain and change of 75% accomplishes near complete dilution/export of the runoff peroxide from the first treatment. This large change is also very refreshing to your tank, you will see a clarity difference in your corals and tank today when the lights come on, they love good changes. it exports nitrate and phosphate well.

 

Since you keep a fair fish bioload in the tank i would always do successive 50 or 75 pct changes leaving enough water for them to swim in. Peroxide is not stressful to the fish in these small doses, my local fish store keeps gallons of peroxide on hand in the storage room for possible power outages in our city. Its happened in the past, and they dump liquid peroxide right into their $20,000 display reefs when they notice the fish gasping at the surface hours after the power went out. This is an old aquaculturists trick from the 80's, peroxide has been used in the fish industry for decades its only recently we started using it in nano reefs as I google the activity to see how far back it goes. this was a neat article as well, even though i would nEVER use more than 3% store bought solutions for tank work. This guy was using 35% pool solution lol, that stuff is strong enough to turn live rock into liquid lol

 

http://reefbuilders.com/2010/03/29/uses-fo...-algae-removal/

[Old Gregg]

You're 100% right SbCaes. I'm going to get a turbo and secure all the rocks to protect them from nature's bulldozer

 

And at Brandon. 35% solution? Just inhaling that would stroke me out! I walked all over walmart looking for a suitable spray bottle then I went through the medicine section and I just had to laugh at the convenience of the spray bottle lol

[brandon429]

whats the verdict! can we get pics...if you treated late sat night then the algae should be dying by now in a clear manner, can we see it!

B

[Old Gregg]

Here's an update with a few pictures I snapped heading out to work this morning. They aren't high quality pics, but neither were the previous ones hehe

 

The lights were on roughly 20 minutes when the photos were taken. The algae is receding moderately fast and there has not been one angry coral in the tank. Instead of draining the tank I plucked two of the major rocks out and sprayed them with copious amounts of H2O2 to ensure mass destruction. I rearranged a bit afterwards but I think you all can still make out which rocks were where.

 

On the left side of the tank under the sinularia, I didn't spray those rocks yet. The algae there is still going strong. I'll do that area in a few days to play it safe and prevent a mass die off. Well ok that isn't entirely the reason... It was late and I was tired and I didn't want to mess with getting everything out.

 

 

 

 

FTS

[brandon429]

how great!! thanks for the follow up glad it worked I knew it would

B

 

will link this to the peroxide thread fo the skeptics lol

[emc2]

Thanks Brandon fot the positive information. I recently have had surge of gha and am tired of plucking it off my rocks. None of my cuc are too interested in it. I am going to try the h2o2 option this weekend. Will let you know how it goes.

[brandon429]

oh Im so happy this will turn out great, just minimize the contact with other corals like we've been doing. A drain and spray is ideal like what greg did above...or even a treatment taken out of the tank, that's great too, I just like to minimize tank contact with delicate corals. It will work though! be sure and try to avoid dosing the whole tank as popular as that is, its a last resort only for the worst-off tanks. With the methods above, it won't harm anything. Glad to have ya on board, I use peroxide every two weeks during normal maintenance and it never lets me down

[brandon429]

I have a different take on algae battles after taking part in the peroxide thread on my own reef, I think sitting back and watching algae exist in your tank if you don't want it is a tragedy. If you do want it, set up an algal turf scrubber but don't be in the middle, thats a sign of a reef controlling you vs the other way. Some tinkering types like to have a challenge and control algae growth naturally or through water purification methods, thats totally fine, my options are just geared for people who hate algae and want it gone which is how it is for me lol im ocd about it.

 

 

Use all these supposed clean up crew animals to *prevent it*- never rely on them to clean it up, especially if they didn't prevent it in the first place is my philosophy. We've been told for a decade to use a clean up crew, if that worked we'd have no more algae loss threads. CUC's do not work consistently, however certain actions will and they are fire and peroxide.

 

Using a cig lighter to burn organisms off rock is preferable to peroxide in some situations, here's me doing it in my vase. The theme is taking control of a reef when the first algae patch is the size of a dime, no larger. Then it can never take over anyones tank.

 

The downside to fire is it bleaches coralline quickly, but the area soon patches back over only minus the algae. In the vid below Im burning red algae off an incoming airline into the tank. The animals you burn, from a stand of algae to a few aiptasias, do not leak poisons into a reef I've been testing this in a one gallon vase for a decade. It will not hurt you guys' large tanks thats for sure. common pests are of insignificant biomass and are nearly fully reduced upon being fried, its harmless i let the shrimps pick their bones off the reef lol

 

 

Before I tried peroxide this was my sole method of control. I don't chase perfect water params, I don't even test for them, simple removal of the primary growth sprig works wonders and I don't have to do work more than a few times every few months.

 

 

Its not true when people say using a direct kill method will not eliminate the problem, it does. Algae can exploit *incredibly* lacking nutrient measures which is why plenty of people with perfect water params still get algae.

 

Enjoy algae free tanks I sure do lol these methods are the best algae removal Ive ever seen hands down or I would change to something better in a heartbeat.

 

The fire removal method is better in tanks housing delicate macroalgaes because it is pure to the reef, harmless in that only the target organisms suffer. My friend Kathryn lost some macro algaes she'd purchased due to the runoff of the peroxide back into the tank after a spot treatment, even though the large water change was quite a dilution and we think peroxide made that happen, stuff HATES plants Im telling ya. So I promised going forward to set apart that kind of setup from a non-plant setup when recommending peroxide use.

[brandon429]

should add that on some tanks using external filtration people are getting great results with algae prevention using the various phosphate binding media, but in my case an external filter wasn't an option so these basic removal options were the only thing that really worked.

 

Other manual removal methods disperse fragments around the tank, able to regenerate and reseed other areas of the tank. fire and peroxide kill the biomass, another helpful side effect of use. the entire holdfast/anchor system affixing the algae to the rock surface if it gets touched.

 

Its common for one or two follow up treatments to be required on healthy sized patches of algae, but when its gone its so easy to prevent with 1/10th the effort going forward.

[Old Gregg]

I'm in agreement with bradon on his stance that even a beautifully maintained aquarium, algae can create a small foothold. Manually pinching that initial GHA strand with tweezers, fingertips, even placing a cuc directly on the patch will not in most circumstances get the roots and it will grow back. And spread like the plague.

 

A complete tank blackout for 3 days didn't help me in my battle. Perhaps 6-10 days would have done the trick but 3 days is hard enough on the majority of coral.

 

Using media to control phosphates is something I have not done. This is my next step to ensure this never happens again. I do however have chaeto in my fuge which is probably working great. But at the time of the original post, it had been installed for all of a few days.

 

Natural methods of GHA removal is another preventative method I lacked in my tank and I have sbCaes to thank for convincing me to get a turbo snail or two. I'll also be giving away my angel because it's just too large and has an appetite too great for my little tank. It will be happier somewhere else =)

 

Thank you brandon for kicking my butt and getting me to try this method! I was terrified at first lol. The aglae is nearly totally gone now with the exception of a few small patches that missed the mist. Many of my shrooms were directly sprayed and had no ill effects whatsoever. Zoas bubbled a bit, but when the lights came on the next day opened up. Other than that, I was careful and didn't spray any other coral.

 

And lastly, and most importantly, in an odd sort of way, thank you Lawnman! Without your endorsement of brandon I'd never of had the guts to try peroxide!

 

My despair is gone and I have a renewed zest for nanoreefing. Thanks you all so much

[brandon429]

Im glad it worked out. i wouldn't have tried it if ReefMiser hadn't started the peroxide thread w pics, type alone wouldn't have got me

lol we are all buddies here

 

now the next dilemma, we need to get this out far past nano reef.com, Im telling you its the new wave of algae control. keep brainstormin!