Jump to content
ReefCleaners.org

Cyano fix?


fishhands

Recommended Posts

I have been looking and can't find an answer. My question is would some kind of biosphere or slab help with cyano outbreaks. I have a 24g cube with only 10 to 15 lbs of live rock. I feed two small fish every other day and still have out breaks. It will clear up then come back a month or so later. I did add 5 small drags recently. I don't think that would have caused it though, but I did re scape when I put them in. Any thoughts?

Link to comment

Are you using RO water? My treatment for cyano...siphon...water-change...repeat:) You have some level of consistent nutrients that its feeding off of. List of params?

Link to comment

Using Wal-Mart "drinking" water. Says filtered using r/o. Think that is the problem? Phosphate test is ati. Hard to get accurate results. Not zero but not quite first shade of green. Supposed to have some though right? I read somewhere 0 phosphate is bad too. Salinity only has fluctuation since I don't have ato I just top off in a.m. and when I get home.

Using Wal-Mart "drinking" water. Says filtered using r/o. Think that is the problem? Phosphate test is ati. Hard to get accurate results. Not zero but not quite first shade of green. Supposed to have some though right? I read somewhere 0 phosphate is bad too. Salinity only has fluctuation since I don't have ato I just top off in a.m. and when I get home.

Using Wal-Mart "drinking" water. Says filtered using r/o. Think that is the problem? Phosphate test is ati. Hard to get accurate results. Not zero but not quite first shade of green. Supposed to have some though right? I read somewhere 0 phosphate is bad too. Salinity only has fluctuation since I don't have ato I just top off in a.m. and when I get home.

Link to comment
tanacharison

I'm certainly not an expert but it sounds like your water might be the source. From what I do understand cyano feeds off nutrients including phosphates. If your tank already had high phosphates and your doing water changes or topping off water that has any noticeable amount of phosphates its only feeding the issue.

 

I recently had issues with cyano and I changed all the filters on my RODI unit and swtiched out my membrane. It seemed to be the source for me.

Link to comment

I use the Walmart Water with green cap no problems

That's the one green cap is drinking water. Glad to hear no problems with that

From what I do understand cyano feeds off nutrients including phosphates.

So back to my first question, would extra bio material "use" the extra nutrients?
Link to comment
tanacharison

That's the one green cap is drinking water. Glad to hear no problems with thatSo back to my first question, would extra bio material "use" the extra nutrients?

Not enough to make a noticeable difference. Your best bet would be large water changes. You could also use something like phosguard in addition.

If you need a quick fix a lot of people have used chemiclean and had great results but be aware if directions are not followed it could had negative effects. That won't eliminate the source of your problems so it could come back.

Link to comment
SantaMonica

Only bottled "distilled" water is supposedly truly 0 TDS, like RODI. Regular drinking, or from the machine outside, is only RO and is not 0 TDS.

 

And re-scaping will always kill off some periphyton and make more nutrients for cyano. You are best off not re-doing anything. This might help:

 

What is Periphyton?

 

Periphyton is what turns your rocks different colors. You know... the white rocks you started with in SW, or the grey rocks (or brown wood) you started with in FW. After several months or years, the rocks become a variety of different colors and textures. Why? Because the periphyton that has grown on it is a mix of different living things, of different colors, and thicknesses. And the important part is: It is LIVING.

 

That's right: The colored stuff that has coated your rocks is all living organisms. Sponges, microbes, algae, cyano, biofilms, and of course coralline. After all, "peri" means "around the outside", and "phyto" means "plant". Ever slipped in a slippery puddle? That's probably periphyton that made it slippery. It's a very thin coating on the rocks, sometimes paper thin.

 

There is a lot of photosynthetic organisms in periphyton, and this of course means that they need light; but they need nutrients too (ammonia, nitrate, phosphate). And as you might figure, they will be on the lighted portions of the rocks. And they will grow to intercept food particles in the water, based on the water flow. Just think about how sponges orient their holes for water flow; the micro sponges in periphyton do it too but on a tiny scale.

 

What about under the rocks, in the dark areas? Well these periphyton don't get light, so they are primarily filter feeders. So they REALLY grow and position themselves to be able to intercept food particles. And they don't really need to fight off algae, because algae does not grow in the dark, so they have no need for anti-algae tactics like plants in illuminated areas have.

 

Reef studies have shown that at certain depths, more of the filtering of the water comes from periphyton and benthic algae than comes from the phytoplankton which filters the deeper water. And in streams, almost all the filtering is done by periphyton. So, what you have on rocks that are "mature" or "established" is a well-developed layer of periphyton; and all the things that comes from it.

 

This is why mandarin fish can eat directly off the rocks of an "established" tank (tons of pods grow in the periphyton), but not on the rocks of a new tank. Or why some animals can lay their eggs on established rocks, but not new ones. Or why established tanks seem to "yo-yo" less than new ones. Even tangs can eat periphyton directly when it's thick enough. Yes periphyton can also develop on the sand, but since the sand is moved around so much, the periphyton does not get visible like it does on rocks. So thick periphyton on established rocks is your friend. And totally natural too. Keep in mind though I'm not referring to nuisance algae on rocks; I'm only referring to the very-thin layer of coloring that coats the rocks.

 

But what happens when you "scrape the stuff off your rocks"? Well you remove some of the periphyton, which means you remove some of your natural filter and food producer. What if you take the rocks out and scrub them? Well now you not only remove more of your natural filter and food producer, but the air is going to kill even more of the microscopic sponges in it. And what if you bleach the rocks? Well, goodbye all filtering and food producing for another year. It's an instant reduction of the natural filtering that the periphyton was providing.

 

However, what if you just re-arrange the rocks? Well, some of the periphyton that was in the light, now will be in the dark; so this part will die. And some of the periphyton that was in the dark will now be in the light, so it will not be able to out-compete photosynthetic growth and thus will be covered and die too. And even if the light stays the same, the direction and amount of water flow (and food particles) will change; sponges that were oriented to get food particles from one direction will now starve. So since the light and food supply is cut off, the filtering that the periphyton was providing stops almost immediately, due only to the re-arranging of the rocks.

 

Starvation takes a little longer. The periphyton organisms won't die immediately, since they have some energy saved up; but instead, they will wither away over several weeks. So on top of the instant reduction in filtering that you get by just moving the rocks, you get a somewhat stretched-out period of nutrients going back into the water. And after all this, it takes another long period of time for the periphyton to build up to the levels it was at before: 1 to 2 years. Even changing the direction of a powerhead will affect the food particle supply in the area it used to be pointed at.

 

So a good idea is to try to keep everything the same. Pick your lighting, flow, layout, and try to never move or change anything. It's a different way of thinking, but you should have a stronger natural filter and food producer because of it.

Link to comment

Again, I'd say just siphon and water change it out. Cyano occurs naturally in our tanks. You can have phosphates and no cyano. We all go through it. What works for me is staying on top of the stuff..its tedious work, no doubt, but I dont like using chemicals or tearing apart my whole system. Algae and cyano outbreaks cause us reefers' many, many headaches. But after my experience in the hobby less is more. Stability and balance is what reefkeeping is about..I'm under the impression cyano is ALWAYS in our tanks, its just a matter of creating a good balance between everything inside our fish boxes.

The above post is very informative, and I like what it says about removing the "Natural filters" from your rock. This is assuming your system is mature.

I dont know if this was addressed but how long has this tank been established? If its a young tank...well I'd say thats your answer. Cyano is very common during the "ugly" phases of maturation. Again, I go back to siphoning and water changes. Think of the ocean and the influx of water reefs receive. My way of simulating that is frequent water changes.

Link to comment

This is why I love this site. So many individuals with a cumlative knowledge to help out and share. My current tank has been running since November and usually only go through one cyano outbreak per tank. I have already been through it on this one until I acquired 5 frags in one trip. Which prompted me to re scape and apparently have this outbreak. I don't like chemicals either so I believe I will just change water and rise out the red until it fades. I didnt know distilled was better I will implement this for the future as funding is easier to change 5g a week than buy an ro system at this time.

Link to comment

Remember Cyano has been around for Millions of years, It is SMARTER than us!

Exactly!

In my 40 I had cyano for about 3-4 months. Ugly as hell...but it WILL starve its self out. Dont give up:)

Link to comment

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recommended Discussions

×
×
  • Create New...