Is my water safe?

[lbrench]

Set up my 6 gallon tank a week ago, it has 5lbs of LR, 6/7lb of LS and I used 3 gallons of water from the LFS (they said it would help the cycle along) I did a test this morning, everything looks good but surely it can't be cycled after a week?

[bevo5]

What did you use as an ammonia source?

[lbrench]

I haven't, I've just put in live rock, sand and water, thinking about putting in some Dr Tim's ammonium Chloride Solution and testing it again in 2 days

[yomon347]

I would add a small clean up crew, few hermits or snails and feed a little bit everyday for a week and then test again.

 

The API ammonia and nitrate test suck for saltwater use. The nitrite is good though.

 

The live rock needs a food source for the bacteria, so it can build up enough to handle the bioload planned for the tank.

[charnelhouse]

I wouldn't add any CUC or other animals until you are positive your cycle has completed. A week is not enough time if you have never done this before. Add ammonia and/or something dead and wait until you see the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate cycle actually occurring. Test frequently. The API tests are good enough for checking your cycle.

 

Water from the LFS isn't going to help your cycle. Take their advice with a grain of salt if they are selling you "cycle water".

 

Do your research on N-R and other forums.

 

Have you seen any ammonia at all?

[lbrench]

No none at all, I've just added 6 drops of ammonia so will test again in the morning and see what's going on

[charnelhouse]

General consensus is to add ammonia to 2ppm and if the tank can process that in 24 hours you are ready to start SLOWLY adding livestock.

 

I'm not sure where 6 drops puts the level at, but you should test now to see what ammonia level is, then again in the morning to see if it is processing.

 

Ammonia and Nitrites should be zero before adding livestock. Nitrates should be under 20ppm.

[lbrench]

Will do! it says on the bottle 1 drop per gallon, would be nice if it's started the cycle this early! my plan is a small CUC (few snails and a hermit crab) then a fish about 4 weeks after that then a skunk shrimp about 8 weeks after that

[Balix]

I got nitrite reading in 24 hours. Using a bottle of biospira and sand. So it's not out of the question.

 

I would not get a CUC if you don't have anything for them to eat yet. I would add one fish first, get some diatom bloom and algae then add CUC.

[seabass]

The only reason to use live rock (versus dry rock) is for the diversity of life. Adding ammonia to 2ppm is good for prepping dry (devoid of fauna) rock, but may be harmful to the beneficial life (other than bacteria) on the rock.

 

Your tank water shows no ammonia and some nitrate. This indicates that there is enough nitrifying bacteria to support the current ammonia production (current bio-load).

 

You've just overwhelmed the nitrifying bacteria (causing an ammonia spike). I recommend a water change and waiting for ammonia to become undetectable again. Then (after ammonia is undetectable again) slooowly start adding a cleanup crew.

[charnelhouse]

The only reason to use live rock (versus dry rock) is for the diversity of life. Adding ammonia to 2ppm is good for prepping dry (devoid of fauna) rock, but may be harmful to the beneficial life (other than bacteria) on the rock.

 

Your tank water shows no ammonia and some nitrate. This indicates that there is enough nitrifying bacteria to support the current ammonia production (current bio-load).

 

You've just overwhelmed the nitrifying bacteria (causing an ammonia spike). I recommend a water change and waiting for ammonia to become undetectable again. Then (after ammonia is undetectable again) slooowly start adding a cleanup crew.

 

Erk, and now I feel like a dolt. I was operating under the assumption that the LR/LS was cured and had little to nothing other than bacteria. And that any nitrate present was probably from the LFS water.

[lbrench]

I got nitrite reading in 24 hours. Using a bottle of biospira and sand. So it's not out of the question.

 

I would not get a CUC if you don't have anything for them to eat yet. I would add one fish first, get some diatom bloom and algae then add CUC.

 

 

The only reason to use live rock (versus dry rock) is for the diversity of life. Adding ammonia to 2ppm is good for prepping dry (devoid of fauna) rock, but may be harmful to the beneficial life (other than bacteria) on the rock.

 

Your tank water shows no ammonia and some nitrate. This indicates that there is enough nitrifying bacteria to support the current ammonia production (current bio-load).

 

You've just overwhelmed the nitrifying bacteria (causing an ammonia spike). I recommend a water change and waiting for ammonia to become undetectable again. Then (after ammonia is undetectable again) slooowly start adding a cleanup crew.

 

 

 

Erk, and now I feel like a dolt. I was operating under the assumption that the LR/LS was cured and had little to nothing other than bacteria. And that any nitrate present was probably from the LFS water.

 

 

just bought this, i used something similar on my freshwater tank so hoping to add this and be good to go in a few days!

 

http://www.amazon.com/DrTims-Aquatics-Nitrifying-Bacteria-Aquariums/dp/B001LUOB6W/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1435774142&sr=8-4&keywords=dr+tims&pebp=1435774155870&perid=162GVMEF6KGMZDQM3JNH

[lbrench]

Saw a spike in nitrite today when i tested and added that Dr Tim's all in one

[brandon429]

Seabass called it. I have skip cycled every tank ive ever owned fw and sw

 

meaning you prob just did that. your tank prob (pending pics) has the same filtration capacity on day 1 as it will on day 1000, your bacteria w remain in a close steady state (life cycle fluxes) limited only by unoccupied space, which is already occupied if LR, they dont just grow infinitely over the next mos.

 

Your rock is probably as full as its going to ever be with filtration bacteria, key concept here.

 

not by reef anarchy but just xporting totally cured items underwater, for the trip home then setting them in a tank. this is never lethal to bacteria, and they dont require ammonia addition to remain in a steady state, their biofilms and mixed bacteria dying right next to them in normal life cycles are one of twenty ammonia inputs into a tank we could consider.

 

even if you didnt xport your rock home wet, but in a pile in the trunk, thats not antibacterial. air isn't instantly lethal to something housed in wet slime, i leave my whole tank drained for 20 mins at times. what dies in this mode are the worms et al, so the ammonia is overcoming the set bacteria but it doesnt indicate death of them.

 

ammonia gets in, we aren't in control here unless we dose a medicine. nature will proceed slowly or faster depending on our boosts.

 

given normal tank care methods, a seeded source is its own production zone for both fuel and consumption of it. our tanks are constantly input with mixed aerobic bacteria that seed in the millions, die off, rot and produce trace ammonia for the millions of heterotrophs and nitrifiers occupying vital space.

 

we kill off bacteria by using antibiotics, not by briefly altering any aspect of their water including pH temp salinity carbonate balance on and on no matter what the online link from Fritz company says heh

 

thats for isolates in a fluid suspension, our tanks are not as limited.

 

the point of that rant is if you post a full tank shot we can tell where you are at in your cycle. this is fun to debate but lets roll the test again i got five mins lol

 

my whole point is you are at a finite place in cycling, not just about to arrive somewhere, if you used LR per your readouts above

[lbrench]

I kind of understand that haha I'm going to run a test tonight and see what's going on with it, will post a picture of the results and I seem to have some brown algae growing on the rocks too!

[FlowerMama]

Shrimp is something you want to add much later so they have something to eat/clean. CUC, a fish, wait a couple weeks to see how tank takes it, add a coral or 2, wait again, then another fish for example, again wait. It's all about your tank getting accustomed to the bioload slowly. I wouldn't put a shrimp in til 3 mos later.

[lbrench]

Yes once it has cycled I will be adding a small CUC then about 2 weeks after that I will be adding a fish then a month after that a small Frogspawn Coral and then a month or so after that I will add the shrimp

[lbrench]

New test results, thoughts?

[brandon429]

with one full tank shot, we can id your cycle better than any combo of api kit details

if your rocks show any benthic life forms at all, then that nitrite reading is typical api and you are cycled. need pics. if you post bone dry white rocks with no life form of any type, or coloration details of any type, thats different.

 

use of the water conditioner Prime at any step is known to confound api readings and if a reef aquarist never owned a nitrite test kit for all of reefing, that'd be ok too. im like that.

 

the algae helps the pre cycled case. it all hinges on if you were sold real cured rock, im seeing lots of times the lfs sells bone dry white rocks as cured, while a vat of purple, 100% covered in fanworms sponges worms pods small algae crusty bumpy not one spot of white on it goes unpurchased. i could run an api nitrite test kit on my 9 yr old tank and get a mild reading right now. that either means im still mid cycle, or

 

[lbrench]

Yes my rock has small spots of algae, little drifting bits and it even came with a tiny star fish lol I added some of Dr Tim's ammonia and the One and Only to help it come along, some pictures of the tank

FTS

[brandon429]

excellent. the verdict is, cannot be determined by pics

but totally determine-able, nonetheless! lol

the little tidbit about the starfish, that helps the pre cycled case like the algae-- simply because it probably had time to crawl in on the rocks, from the tank they originated from, signifying at least X amnt of time those rocks spent underwater (building up bacteria). if theyd spent more time, fanworms would be stuck to them and growths would be on them that are clearly obvious like this:
https://imageshack.com/i/id90IpCDj



these rocks in your pic might have been totally dry and submerged 1 week, long enough for a star hitchhiker, and not long enough to cycle (which is why we cant determine here off pics but the algae and star does indicate some time underwater) or they might have been under 3 mos--long enough for bacteria but not long enough for coralline given light, nutrient and seeding variations. its not a slam dunk visual ID until we can see living material accreted to that rock surface. color is a dead giveaway when something for sure has nitrifying bacteria in residency, and color is no indicator that it doesnt~

 

how confusing is that lol!

so here's how we know for sure where you are at. search the threads for the exact kind of cleaning ammonia we use to speed cycle a tank. you would add cleaning ammonia in drops to that tank until that api registers a pretty clear impact of free ammonia

then retest in 24 hours

if that api ammonia test kit goes back to what it shows above, you have nitrifiers eating up that raw ammonia and those rocks were underwater long enough to get bacteria, but not coralline

its not about yapping nine pages of type lol its about cycling biology and that takes a little extra to be thorough. this specifically helps you shop for true live rock vs questionable (although you selection brings in less bad hitchhikers)

it allows you to know when your tank will undergo a new cycle or not depending on what you are doing to it

being able to visually inspect things and not rely on API which gives only general indications means you wont chase ghost parameters as often, biology is more reliable than api.

people use dead shrimps to test for ammonia but they can take days to degrade, and smelly. $1.50 at a dollar general store and you'll have your cycling answer in 24 hours. use the raw cleaning ammonia trick, pulled right off a thread where someone used that exact brand w pics and a successful cycle there are 1000 of them searchable. dont use the wrong cleaning ammonia with bubbles and surfactants.

however your kit does appear to register truly low or zero ammonia with that yellow non green reading, so with that you can now spike the true ammonia levels to something greener, test in 24 hours, and if back to yellow this tank is cycled and verified, but not by pics ha!