Livestock Help

[eodmike]

I asked this on another board but they are sort of known for being we'll say super conservative.

I think this tank is a bit bigger than what most would call a nano but I plan on stocking it with nano-fish to give it a cool look here there everywhere vibe.

 

Tank

36x18x21 Acrylic Aquarium with Center Overflow

Substrate
60lbs of Reef Saver from BRS
80lbs of Arag-Alive Caribsea Reef Sand (Around 3-3 1/2" Sand Bed)
Various Sized Empty Shells and Reef Rubble

Equipment
Eshopps PSK-100 (Skimmer)
Sicce Syncra Silent 3.0 (Return)
Sicce Voyager 2 Stream Pump x2 (Powerheads)
Wavemaker
Berlin Systems Sump of approximate same footprint
Enhiem Jager 125 watt x2 (Heaters)
Lighting Current (26 watts Cree LEDS)
Lighting Future (Julyish - 2x Lumina Full Spectrum)

Inverts
Snails (Suggestions Welcome. Clean-up Crew numbers and species would be nice)
Hermits (I know they take the occasional snail. I'm ok with this and will try to curb it with empty shells)
Tiger Tail Sea Cucumber (Holothuria Hilla)
Black Longspine Urchin (Diadema Setosum)
3x Peppermint Shrimp (Lysmata Wurdemanni)
Blood Red Fire Shrimp (Lysmata Debelius)
Red Banded Snapping Shrimp (Alpheus Randalli)
5x Sexy Anemone Shrimp (Thor Amboinensis)
2x Porcelain Crab (Petrolisthes Galathinus)
Ultra Maxima Clam Blue (Tridacna Maxima)

Fish
Yasha Goby (Stongobiops Yasha)
Gold Assessor Basslet (Assessor Favissimus)
2x Pajama Cardinalfish (Sphaeramia Nematoptera)
Green Mandarin (Synchiropus Splendidus)
Blue Dot Jawfish (Opistognathus Rosenblatti)
4x Green Clown Goby (Gobiodon Atrangulatus)
3x Greenbanded Goby (Elacatinus Multifasciatum)
Hectors Goby (Amblygobius Hectori)
Yellow Stripe Clingfish (Diademichthys Lineatus)

Coral
Various Zoanithids and Mushroom species

Notes
I am currently in what I'm anticipating to be a long cycle since I went with dry rock.

I plan on getting some sand from fellow reefers to help get some of the good hitch hikers I may be missing out on once the cycle is over.

I plan on seeding pods once the cycle is over. And possibly several times over the first year.

I don't plan on adding the Mandarin or the Clam until after the tank has been up for a year.

The theory I'm trying to go with is super peaceful fish that are typically kept in nano tanks. I'm hoping by doing this I can have a fair number of fish and inverts in the tank. I like diversity and the joy of finding a fish I may not of seen for a few days and just generally having stuff happen all over the tank.

I am hoping that I could have 1 birdnest in the future as a center piece but am not 100% on that idea. I will have to look at the tank when the time comes.

I am guessing this list is overstocked but not sure. The fish I really want are the Jawfish and the Yasha Goby. The rest are interesting fish that I believe should be peaceful but I will cut them before these two unless cutting one of these fish will greatly increase the other fish I could have.

I've been in and out of saltwater and have had success in the past with 125 gallon reef tank and a 10 gallon nano (both ran for 2+ years but were taken down for various reasons) I have also had failures with other tanks. I've always kept freshwater as long as I can remember. I'd consider my self a newbie though since I've been out of salt long enough to feel that plenty has changed.

[eodmike]

_{37 reads and no comments. I can take a no. Or less of this. Or pick one of these. The site I asked at said the blue spot was a fish that would greatly limit the other fish number wise. That the tank isn't big enough for a mandarin. That you can't put a group of clown gobies in.}

 

_{All that correct?}

[Neebles]

Well in my opinion you have too many clown gobies listed. They will fight. Unless you have a huge tank, which you don't, they won't do well together. For long term success with a blue spotted Jawfish, you need to run the tank at a lower temp then the other fish would like. The mandarin eat a tremendous amount of pods, and since it sounds like this is a new tank, I would leave that out as well. At least for several months to a year to build up your pod population. Even then it may be a struggle to keep up a proper population.

 

I dont have experience with any other fish on your list. I would do some research, find a compatibility chart etc. it sounds like you have a lot of similar gobies on the list. As far as I know some are ok with others but not all.

 

Again, I could be wrong, but your shrimp list sounds a bit ambitious as well. I'm not sure of they all can live peacefully together.

[Juuls]

I'm a noob also therefore not the best to answer.

 

I know whatever you do I would stock it slowly, personally I would not put too many fish and inverts in better to have a smaller population which lives well together then too many of them which kill each other.

 

On another note after losing stock to a crab in my live rock I would advise you to thoroughly check the live rock and also at night so you can have an idea if you happened to get any nasty things in there.

 

I second the waiting for a mandarin as I have heard these can be challenging even in a big well established tank, however there are lots of mandarin owners here who may be able to provide more advice and guidance.

 

Welcome by the way

[eodmike]

I joined 2 years ago but thanks for the welcome!

 

The mandarin will be a 1 year add on.

 

I also am working on a pod tank.
It will be a 10 gallon tank setup to breed pods to seed the display. Not a refigum because they won't be plumbed together but similar concept.

 

The live rock won't be an issue since I'm currently cycling 100% dry rock. I'm trying to avoid nuisance species.

 

The plan is to slowly populate the tank adding a fish then waiting a month. Then adding another. The fish will be QTd of course.

 

I'm working on a reply that is a bit longer but thought I'd share those points up front.

[ajmckay]

Hey don't get too bummed if your thread doesn't have replies after less than a day...

 

I'm probably the minority but IMO you're being too conservative... From what I understand the BRS reef saver is pretty clean. I cycled with BRS pukani and it was loaded with dead stuff so I had to wait a while to cure the rock. I can't imagine that rock taking longer than 2 weeks though. Have you tested the water at all? What are the results?

 

Since the reef saver is much cleaner though you should look into ammonia dosing.

 

Basically you calculate a level of ammonia (http://www.fishforums.net/aquarium-calculator.htm) and add it using pure ammonia, available at stores. This will allow you to cycle much faster and cleaner.

 

Another option is to dose bio-spira or similar bottled bacteria and then add fish in a few days based on the instructions on the bottle. In other words wait for the rock to cure (where the majority of dead organic material in the rock has decomposed) and then get on with the cycle. I'm not saying you can't stick to your plan and add 1 fish per month, but as long as you mature your biofilter properly you can add all your fish at once.

 

As for your stocking list, I think you have some issues. The larger shrimp could eat the smaller shrimp. The cardinal fish will probably eat the tiny gobies (and the tiny shrimp), the BSJ could also eat the smaller fish/shrimp. The shrimp (esp the red banded) could go after the clam.

 

Long-spine urchins get huge... You could probably put one in that size tank for quite a while but be prepared to have your rocks re-arranged ocasionally and corals possibly squashed or knocked over. Also they can clear a rock of coralline algae in a few days.

 

I like the pod cultivation tank! I've thought about using my QT for that - would grow chaeto in the tank and when I want to transfer pods to main tank just grab a handful and shake it off in the water because pods like to hang out in that stuff.

 

I think that being nano fish people keep these in smaller tanks, but in smaller quantities. IMO having a bunch of them in a larger tank is a cool concept but presents some challenges. Feeding is going to be a bit more difficult depending on which fish stay put and which will venture into the water column. You might have to employ a broadcast and direct feeding system. Also like others said even small gobies can be quite territorial toward their own kind - but its usually not an issue since most of the time people only keep single specimens.

[eodmike]

Thanks ajmckay.

 

I haven't tested anything yet. Basically I set up the tank. Then went to mexico for the first week.

 

When I get home I'm going to start using the mature pro kit that red sea makes. I think it adds ammonia but if not I'll dose it per the calculator.

 

I was completely unaware that the red snapping would go after clams. If I put the clam up on my rock work would that help? My understanding are that shrimp is basically blind and will stay on the ground. Or will I be risking the clam even if it is elevated on the rock work?

 

New fish list after taking in the replies and thinking about what I am willing to risk.

 

Basically I halfed the number of clown gobies. I figure 60 gallons should be plenty of water for 2 territories.

Added a Yasha (bonded pair)

Added a Firefish

Removed the cardinals

Removed the Jawfish

 

I'd like more fish if possible? Thoughts or Suggestions on things that will pair with these? They are all super peaceful fish and small. The gobies may be territorial but the list has gobies only of very different niches, shapes, and colors.

 

The only possible predator of the sexy shrimp are the larger shrimp but I am reading many posts of these going ok so I'll continue with them in plan. Add a small group if it works out add more. If not lesson learned but I feel like they should do ok with each other and see anecdotal evidence to support that feeling.

 

Is there an urchin that the clingfish would like that won't present an issue? If not I'll remove both those from my list but will be looking for something to replace the fish.

 

Fish:

Bonded Pair Yasha Goby (Stongobiops Yasha)
Gold Assessor Basslet (Assessor Favissimus)
2x Green Clown Goby (Gobiodon Atrangulatus) half as many as originally thought. 2 should be able to find their own territories.
3x Greenbanded Goby (Elacatinus Multifasciatum)
Hectors Goby (Amblygobius Hectori)
Yellow Stripe Clingfish (Diademichthys Lineatus)

Helfrichi Firefish (Nemateleotris Helfrichi) Added this fish to replace some that are no longer on here

 

Inverts:
Still Looking for Clean-up crew suggestions
Hermits (mixed bag)

Tiger Tail Sea Cucumber (Holothuria Hilla)

3x Peppermint Shrimp (Lysmata Wurdemanni)
Blood Red Fire Shrimp (Lysmata Debelius)
Red Banded Snapping Shrimp (Alpheus Randalli)
5x Sexy Anemone Shrimp (Thor Amboinensis)
2x Porcelain Crab (Petrolisthes Galathinus)

 

After A Year
Green Mandarin (Synchiropus Splendidus)

Ultra Maxima Clam Blue (Tridacna Maxima)

 

I know that there is a certain aspect of OMG that's a lot of stuff. But the tank is 60 gallons. All the fish are different niches and smallish. I think its just out of the norm.

 

I appreciate the feedback and as I get more I'll continue to adjust the list.

[Neebles]

You may be ok with 2 clown gobies in that size tank...not trying to talk you out of it. I have 1 in my 4 ft 75g tank and he is everywhere. He does not stick to one area or another. Now if you have 2 they may establish territories or they may fight. I would try it, but be prepared to take one back to the store if they can't work it out.

[Tamberav]

I have had Greenbanded gobies and they are great fish (very active) and get along with each other They also change sex so you will probably end up with a pair.

 

Larger gobies and jawfish may injure them though so use precaution on tank mates.

[lkoechle]

I think you would like something different then the green clown gobies. I know they're beautiful, but they are incredibly shy. I had one in a pico for 9 months and he hardly ever came out. When I set up my 85, I went with a yellow clown goby and that dude is everywhere, checking out everyone, and is always curious. I love the green colors, but if you're planning on seeing them, the yellow is a better bet in my experience.

 

For CUC, go to reefcleaners.org they are always fantastic.

[ajmckay]

Is this the red banded snapper shrimp you speak of?

 

If so, it seems people get mixed results with them coexisting with other shrimp. They get a bit larger and are more aggressive than other shrimp and they're carnivores as well. They look bad ass though...

 

Or do you mean this shrimp?

 

If the second shrimp then yes I think it's fine with other shrimp.

 

As for the clam nipping, I've never seen one of these go after a clam, but I have seen a peppermint go after a clam - though note that there are 2 species which look basically identical, the other is called a camel shrimp which is considered by most to not be reef safe. Mine could have actually been a camel shrimp. Peppermint shrimp fall in the middle. I've had them sneak polyps on more than 1 occasion. I suppose it depends on the individual shrimp. Just watch them.

 

It's tough to keep shrimp in a bigger tank like this though because obviously a shrimp is pretty low on the food chain and a lot of fish eat shrimp as well as some shrimp eat shrimp.

 

I like the addition of the fire fish. You could try some red spot cardinals, or or possibly a possum wrasse, and a green chromis would be a good fish for that tank size and give the water column some action.

[eodmike]

I mean the second shrimp. I have always heard the first called a coral banded shrimp but that's the issue with trade names. They get confusing.

 

The intent is the second shrimp bought from divers den with a bonded pair of yasha gobies.

 

I think a chromis and possum wrasse would be a fun addition.

 

I know its a ton of fish but for their size I feel like there is a decent amount of space.

I'm working on an Arduino Yun with wifi abilities to be controlled remotely btw. Just saw your thread on a similar concept. COOL!