Yamato's LED build, LED resting against acrylic...would anything happen? Options

[Yamato]

My dream to build a LED light for a pico is finally coming true. After reading countless other make this jump, I am excited to give this a go.

I ordered the LEDs from LEDsupply two weeks ago. I was able to purchase two drivers and powersupply from a member on NR. So I am waiting on those, but as I wait, I am going to see what would be the best configuration for my precious LEDs...

So my order from LEDsupply finally came! I am happy to report that the order was correct and that the package was shipped well packed and the transaction was very smooth.

I am still waiting on the Power supply and Buckpuck drivers (hoping he sent potentiameters...).

But since I have to wait, this might be a good thing since I need to configure how to set the LEDs. So I have
2 clear white Q4 Cree XRE LEDs
3 Royal blues

I want pretty good coverage since my display tank measure 6"x9"

Note: the RB LEDs have a faint blue marker on them.

Let's hear what your rational is:

Configure A

This is what I originally felt was the best one. The bottom of the configuration would be the front of the tank. The top, with one RB LED would be for the back side of the tank. Thus the two whites would be more or less in the center.

Config X

This one has the two whites diagonal on the array, and the RB going across like a slash, I don't like this one.

Config Space Invaders

I feel this one would have a good strong mixture of the CW and RB going across, but the light would be focused east west in the tank over the middle...is this too focused? Should it be spread out? The whites all on one side and the RB on the other, is that not a good thing?

Config n

This one is a modified Config A with more focus down the middle, less spread...

Config v

Modified A, I don't know what to say...I can't decide.

It's so important to get it right since I will be epoxying it to the heat sink.

This post has been edited by Yamato: Aug 24 2009, 10:02 PM

[cptbjorn]

You have the right idea with the A/V configuration, you should think of the blue and white lights as separate configurations and try to get the best spread possible of both individually. If you know what I mean. That way you get the most consistent blending. Kinda depends on how big the heatsink is compared to the tank but I think most likely config v will be the best.

[Yamato]

Every time I move the LEDs around, I always come back to the A confirguration.


Question: would it be easier if I soldered the LEDs first or should I epoxy them down before I do any work on the LEDs?

[cptbjorn]

Depends on your soldering iron. The wiring will most likely look cleaner if you solder them after but there is a lot more mass to heat up once they are attached so a small/wimpy iron might not be able to get the joints hot enough. My 50w iron works just fine though even for LEDs screwed down with thermal compound. Also will be harder to overheat/damage the emitters with them attached.

I'm sure you've heard this already but I have to recommend drill + tap and screws over the epoxy. It's super easy and if you ever need to replace one...

[Yamato]

yeah I would love to drill plus Tap, but I dont have the power tools...would a regular hand drill (black and decker) do the job? And tap...how you do that? I would love to be able to save the LEDs for another project, but I already got the epoxy...12.99!

[cptbjorn]

At the tolerances necessary for mounting LEDs you can definitely do it with hand tools. You just need a tap handle, a (couple) 4-40 tap(s), and a #43 size drill, and some WD-40 or some kerosene or light oil. They should have all of that stuff at Lowes/HD/wherever.

First you lay out your holes as accurately as possible, for flat smaller stuff I usually do this by printing a layout and attaching it directly to whatever I'm drilling with just a regular glue stick. Then take a center punch (or a sharp nail works) and pound a small indentation where each hole needs to be. Then you can peel the layout off, just a little warm water and the paper and glue fall right off. Now drill the holes with the #43 drill, you'll find that the bit gets "sucked in" to the indentation and gives much more accurate holes than if you just had sharpie marks or similar. I just do a quick spray of WD-40 on the bit and the aluminum before each hole, makes it much easier. Since this is your first time tapping it would be best if you laid out the holes so they can be drilled all the way through the base of the heatsink. Tapping "blind" holes that don't go all the way through tends to break a lot more taps.

Now chuck up your tap into the tap handle. I recommend practicing tapping holes on some scrap aluminum, preferably until you break a tap, so you know just how much force it can take. In order to make the tap's steel hard enough to cut threads it becomes extremely brittle and for smaller taps it can only take a little torque and it will just shatter. The idea is to get the threads started as straight as possible at first, and then once the tap starts feeding in to the hole on its own focus more on not breaking the bit by rotating forwards a turn, then back 1/4 turn to clear the chips, then forwards 1 turn etc.

If you break a tap in the hole, most of the time you can carefully get it back out with a small pair of vice grips. And sometimes you can't

[Yamato]

Hey, thanks for such a detail description. I will read this over again and see if I feel up to it. I kinda blew my budget for getting stuff for my tank when I went out and got a second hand refractometer. (Milwakee brand)

The lady said it doesn't need to be calibrated, but I think I understand what needs to be done...check maybe with my LFS with their refracto...$60bucks CDN funds, that's not bad right???

plus all this LED stuff, the wife is gonna kill me (haha)

[Yamato]

It was unfortunate but the member here who was suppose to sell me two buckpucks and power supply reported to me that the package was returned to him by fedex because of water damage. Never seen that before where the package didn't even get to the destination, but none the less I had to order new buckpucks and blow my budget for the project.

I got one and it was delivered yesterday, I was very excited, but when I tested the driver, it did nothing, it did not light up the LEDs, nothing.

I used two separate power supplies to test it and nothing, I tested the LEDs in series and LED by itself, nothing. I dialed the dimmer up and down as I was testing, nothing. So I am pretty frustrated and figure it must be a bad buckpuck.

I contacted LEDsupply and they replied promptly and indicated that another buckpuck has been sent out immediately and that if I can send them the defective buckpuck to them for testing.

Anything like this happen to any one else. Am I at fault here and did not do something I am suppose to?

[Yamato]

So, it has been as while. I have had a few set backs like blowing out Buckpucks etc etc.

Now I am finished with alot of help from Deepdvnarg and others on NR. Deep, thanks man. I couldnt have done this with you. He hooked me up with two buckpucks, an awesome powersupply, six LEDs at GB price (which I didn't need but it was such a good price I could not turn down the offer).

I have lots of pictures, so let the show get on the road. I ended up with enough LEDs to not only do a six LED array ( i ordered a sixth to add to my original configuration) but another additional six LED array plus spare parts. I hope this ends up making sense bc I had to redesign and reorder parts...but starting this project three months ago, I finally have something to post.

If you are looking into a PS for your project, this is it:

Deep sent this to me and it is very well suited for LED lighting use. 24V at 6.5amps, two -+ out ports and a way to lower the voltage manually on the PS.

I am just going to go ahead and show the two lights I made. I just wanted to complete the project that I didnt focus on how to take pictures to show the step by step.

The array on the left with the silver HS was my original project. You can see a put a switch on the HS and wired it up to the array. Everythings great, so great in fact I couldn't bear to leave my BioCube 8 without LED lights too. I had made the array on the left for my pico. So I used a few spare parts, a fan I got for a $1, two HS I got for $1 each, hooked them up to my second buckpuck from Deep and glued it all together with the arctic silver adhesive. I know I should polly drill, but I don't have the equipment and this is faster and alittle simpler for me. But the down side is its permanent.


Let me explain the blue HS array. I put three on each, and I figured that the HS may have been too small for three LEDs each, so I had the idea of putting a fan on each heatsink to help dissipate the heat energy. I got a 12V fan that fits on the back of these HS, and at the last minute decided to try to use only one Fan. Using a 9V adaptor, the fan was putting out alot of air and I assumed this was enough...thus...

I glued the two HS to the fan.

With only half of the HS directly under the fan, I was risking over heating...I added the plastic panel so that later on i can put on velcro and the sticky side of the velcro would have something to hold on to. I used Arctic Silver adhesive on all of the gluing jobs...

On the back of a water bottle, I used as a well, I placed one part of each of the compounds I got for the Arctic Silver adhesive, I mixed them and started to apply on things I wanted to glue.


Closer look at the wiring of the LEDs (in series).

I didn't have a box, so I used a plastic battery box and placed the buckpuck in there with the two switches, one for the dimmer and the other for ON/Off...the dimmer for a curious reason does not dim.

Back to the fan, I placed velcro on the back of the Fan, it will be going under the feeding door on the BC8. Yes this velcro will hold very strong, and will not drop the light into the tank. I use this for work and trust me folks, the sticky side will hold onto wall paint before it gives, I have see it happen. The velcro will hold the array over the water.


Under side of the feeding door of the BC8


I can open and close the door with the light on the underside.


When I ran the test run, I found the HS very hot. I suspected that the air was not being pulled from between the fan and the Feeding door...so I decided to cut a hole into the door with the hope that fresh air will help cool the HS, and it did.


This is my Pico with my original LED set up. I cut out the lid of a box to make a temporary housing for it. The LED lights were so strong, the glare was giving me a headache.

The small fan on top of the HS keeps that heat sink cooler, but it is warm to touch. This size HS is much more appropriate for the project, roughly 3.5" by 3". I will soon stock this pico more..it currently has a few frags in it.

This is my pico and BC8 next to each other. The reason I had to put them next to eachother is because I am using the same PS to power the two sets of LEDs. I wire each set of six in SERIES and hooked them both up to the PS in parallel. Its beautiful to see it work and the colour and clarity...ooooh, I am converted to LED lighting.


I am sorry for such a sloppy write up. The project having been drawn out took the patience out of me.

Below is my comparison photos with my stock PC lighting in my BC8 and then with the addition of 2 clear whites and 4 Royal blue leds going full power. I used my manual setting on my canon G9 and kept the setting the same for both photos. The LEDs obviously are brighter, since we are adding an addition of 22V of lighting But what i want to point out is that the coral "pop" a lot more in the pics with the LEDs.



Zoas from a frag trade


FTS



its getting late, I am going to run. My tank shimmers like it has never done before...and its so satisfying to see the light bounce around off my wall. If you want to do it, I say go and do it!

[disaster999]

looks good!

i like your air skimmer =P thats what im running in my tank

[deepdvnarq]

nice Job Dude. clever how you did the bc8. i dont if i missed it or not but try to put sometype of splash guard on the LEDs. the moisture will kill them. also use clear nail polish over the solder point to waterproof it a little more.
really glad you like. i still dont understand why it wont dim though.

[Yamato]

oooh, clear nail polish eh, and a splash guard, so any kind of acrylic cover will do right? Can the acrylic be touching the LED heads? Do they have to seal the LEDs in or is it good enough that they have somehting to ward off drops of water off the front of the LED?

thanks guys.

as for the dimmer, I don't know why, perhaps when I fried the buckpuck they were attached to with the AC power, it blew them out too.

This post has been edited by Yamato: Jul 29 2009, 07:34 AM

[evilc66]

Looks good. Get rid of that switch on the silver heatsink array if it is inline with the LEDs, and not the power to the Buckpuck. The driver supposedly has open circuit protection, but I wouldn't want to test that. If you want to keep the switch, put it between the power supply and the driver, not the driver and the LEDs.

[Yamato]

Hey Evil

Can you explain that alittle bit more. I actually have it between the LEDs and the buckpuck...so I will try to change that.

Does it null the open circuit protection and what can happen as a result? What gauge wire should I use with this kind of stuff?

[deepdvnarq]

what evil is saying about the open circuit protection is that if the buckpuck is getting power but there is no load on it due to your switch powering off the LEDs. thus the circuit being open or "LIVE" if you want to put it that way. if your switch is between the PS and the buckpucks then no problems. that is the way it should be. when you operate the switch to the off position, it turns the power off to the buckpucks and the LEDs.

[Yamato]

alright...thanks.

Is it a big threat, or can it wait til I get new dimmers so I can do all the changes in one shot?
and which line should I be putting it on, the positive or the neutral wire...I am guessing the positive

This post has been edited by Yamato: Jul 29 2009, 07:27 PM

[evilc66]

Doesn't matter, as long as it's between the Buckpuck and the power supply. It's fine there for now, as long as you don't switch it.

The reason I bring this up is because of the nature of these drivers. They use an inductor to average out the current output. When there is a load, everything works fine. When a load is disconnected from a live driver, that inductor could dump a lot of energy and could damage the driver. The unit is supposed to protect against that, but like I said earlier, I'm sure you don't want to test that.

[deepdvnarq]

Well you said the switch is between the PS and the buck. So no problems. If I understood wrong and the switch is betwwen the LEDs and the buck, then sooner or later, move it. Just don't use the swith to turn off the LEDs. Unplug it instead.

[evilc66]

It's between the LEDs and the Buckpuck

[Yamato]

okay then, I will unplug it so that there is no live current running into the Drivers without a load. After I get the dimmers I will put the switch between the PS and the buckpuck. Hmm, so I should put the switch on the positive wire right?

what gauge wire is best to use with this kind of work.

This post has been edited by Yamato: Jul 29 2009, 08:51 PM