brandon429

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    Why does this man talk about peroxide so much? is he insane? why does he hate api test kits?

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  1. I don't use it but for sure I rate it as a potential cyano outcompeter. we had tons of people abandon using peroxide in our peroxide threads and take to MB7 instead and they posted better results. its not 100% or people wouldn't use anything else on cyano, im only going off the repeating patterns from seeing hundreds of peroxide attempts for cyano and the alternates they chose like margarita snails, UV and dosers like mb7 that were marketed to outcompete cyano. based on that ammonia its certainly different than just regular nitrifier liquids and presumably way more active. not surprising knowing it has that much feed it in, never knew that till today.
  2. if they are using raw ammonia in the bottle as a food source for the bac then Id predict mb7 has a much shorter shelf life than other nitrifiers who are just in dormancy in basically clean water/zero smell or cloud. though I don't use mb7 the descriptions so far sound like a very active mix of live and not dormant cells~in loaded water. what I find neat is that we can use mb7 to outcompete cyano, because it must have inclusions beyond just simple nitrifiers though they can also be mixed in with whatever aerobes they are using, but we can't use pure nitrifier strain additives to battle cyano. that mb7 is neat stuff. going off the details it sounds like a neat combo product if people are cycling with it too. I cannot believe the test is accurate for that high of a ppm, though it could be the form of ammonia in question, perhaps this is an unimpactful form of ammonia in that bottle though I don't know what form that would be (need chemists)
  3. its nice to know you simply don't have to test for nitrites and nitrate in the cycling reef tank, consider that option from the thread as well. the reason you may not see nitrate: -offgassing though this is rare -uptake by that algae you mention -test kit limitations for the levels in question -some other ones we may be missing nitrate is only for algae management it doesn't matter in tank cycling as we covered only ammonia matters. once ammonia digestion occurs, nitrate as a rule also occurs but we may not detect it for whatever reason. the only param needed to know in marine tank cycling is ammonia + a known time the system has been underwater which yours meets. im reading that through your chain of command in getting the rocks, its been wet and underwater long before you got it right? The #1 reason we only test for ammonia in that thread above is so that we don't have test results from three different params pulling us in many directions when only one of the params matters, the other two literally do no matter in saltwater cycling though nitrite testing is very important in freshwater. its totally useless info in saltwater settings. anytime we encounter a supposed nitrite issue in reefing, its really just an ammonia issue and in nearly every case it was a nitrite test misread or adulterated test because someone used prime before taking the trite measurement.
  4. Dandelion that was amazing input on the ammonia in the bottle bac I must get a smell report pls!! a quarter of that much true free ammonia will smell like a rotten skunk. per your reported levels it should smell like nuclear death and the water will be cloudy, its impossible for it to be clear with living organisms dying from that high of a level you piqued my interest on non test kit ammonia verification, how bad does that mb7 smell, and how clear is the fluid. api still suspect for me. not for bad reporting, but including various forms of ammonia as red zone when indeed they may not be, pending sniffer results.
  5. what kind of test kit were you using to assess ammonia/trite levels hey your graph does something amazing it corroborates every other cycling graph online, if im reading yours correctly, nitrite followed ammonia behavior by day 30 correct? heck it looks by day 15 they were linked (ammonia and nitrite oxidation) sure it had ups and downs till about day 15+ but being generous wouldn't it be accurate to say that by day 30 your tank fully complied? that's a darn good post above in our cycling thread where we press for ammonia-only measures, we always try and collect proofs of how by day 30 nitrite never fails to comply. we already know its a biological fact, but finding API verifications of it is the real gold... people will hold to what their test kits say long before they'll hold to established rules for bacterial contamination. Dandelions rocks are fully cycled and can filter quite a bit of waste. The generalized readings of 2 ppm API can easily be a real reading of 3-4, so if these barren rocks have trouble digesting several ppm that's not the same as trouble digesting true 1 ppm off a Seneye calibrated ammonia probe or by salifert testing which our cycling thread accepts for measures. API is ballparking and they're better used to identify a dead fish vs any form of low level application for cycling. That doesn't mean all API are problematic, it just means that 100% of every stalled cycle thread ever made is using api and that presents a pattern we can work with by exclusion testing. By excluding API readings in our cycling thread at r2r you can't imagine how streamlined it all became. Id have to see salifert + non-API readings to know we started at true 1 ppm for Dandelions challenge here. what this tank is doing makes sense for API cycling testing more than one param. we got all cycles to streamline in our cycling thread by doing literally the opposite. Smart call above people made about less surface area on this kind of live rock. not very porous agreed but at least a little texturing/better than nothing. can't wait to see how it would do at 1 ppm max using another kit.
  6. and after 24 hours you are saying your api shows no decline in ammonia levels, or does it show some movement just not all the way to zero?
  7. this is api testing correct? so to verify, you are using two api tests? the ppm levels of ammonia you spike to shouldn't be above 1 ppm are you using food or liquid ammonia to assess your ammonia oxidation we need to know how you are spiking ammonia and to what original levels, nothing above 1 ppm for the types of rocks you show. can you post pictures of your verification readings: one set of pictures is two test kits showing 1 ppm ammonia earned in that tank the second set is 24 hours later, both sets of ammonia readings. disregard all others, nitrite and nitrate don't have to be assessed here only what ammonia does matters.
  8. hey this is a fun thread. hunting ammonia is fun isn't it true these rocks have been underwater for months continually, at least a few right? that alone will plate them in bacteria even if you add nothing, filtration bacteria do not require our help to get in, get feed, and increase colonies these are nature bac not aquarium bacteria. they already have transportation into a body of water from natural means, and food gets in that water just the same even if we don't add any. what aquarists do is speed things up by adding more bac and more ammonia. if your tank has been underwater anywhere over sixty days you have testing inaccuracy most likely. once bacteria are set in a system, they do not downscale back to sterility if we withhold feed, they remain in place doing their natural acquisition thing as long as water hangs around, so these rocks never went uncycled unless you have used medications we didn't know about. how have you verified your samples from this tank above regarding ammonia digestion
  9. hey that's sharp that bed is not in bad condition. I bet if you ran a sample on some other type of totally different name brand kit it would be a slightly different reading but even if not, my reco is don't factor nitrate in that system its working great. coralline, good health no algae that's really sharp. on reefcentral theres a huge thread/article showing several SPS reef tanks running 40 to 100+ nitrate (reef, not fish only) yours isn't bad at all. I wouldn't carbon dose or do anything to that system what were you thinking killed the acro? perhaps lighting shock (that pic shows heavier on whites than blues, takes some acclimation for that for some sps nubs) for better referencing see the goog article nitrate in the aquarium part 1 or 2 either one, from Randy H Farley it says in great detail how water changes wont help much due to rebound times and in your case test kit limitations can easily be at play at the same time. nice setup@! https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/tank-parameters-of-some-masters.263/ I can't find the 100 range guy but there was one it may be Paul B's old tank ill have to go find. you can see some 40 nitrates in that series tho. darn nice sps. light bleaching is my biggest suspect for your sps so far
  10. test limitations is one way, and depending on stores in the sandbed (waste proteins if it clouds heavily when disturbed) it simply might be rebounding quickly. your bioloading isn't lite agreed, and you are double skimming which is nice, but if they're literally passing lots of waste into the water perhaps that's as good as it gets in the current setup. adding carbon dosing can help, the suspended bacteria are really fast at stripping it from the water column post a pic of the tank im curious to see sandbed depths, coloration and cross section from the pics to look for staining or pocketing darker colors in the bed section color based test kits are so limiting they're ballparking lots of times compared to the digital calibrated probe readouts curious to see pics here can you test a sample of clean sw with that kit, and get zero?
  11. its true all you needed was hydration, the bacteria don't need our help to get food this is how they takeover puddles in nature without us depositing rotting shrimp in each one if your previous rock didn't dry out, it kept -all- the bac required for the new setup. one confound though can be ammonia leaking from the higher order animals lost just sitting there. it wont ever be a bac loss issue, but with enough rotting worms or sponges if applicable that rock may or may not leak ammonia, you indicated none so g2g. in your case, the dying animals in the bucket if applicable fed the bacteria with their additional rot, just like shrimp rotting. glad its over with, smell it too. our noses beat API any day on detecting faint ammonia.
  12. sounds good and those nitrates still show the metabolic chain wasn't broken that's all good confirmation
  13. the wet pack live sand was a nice boost as well, confers even more bacteria. that type of partial boosting w take about 30 days underwater to cycle, meaning if you added nothing else and just waited your ammonia w show zero because none has been input. you would then spike the ammonia to 1 ppm verified at the end of the submersion time, then test in 24 hours, and the ammonia will be zero because all tanks using any form of boosting will cycle in 30 days submerged. the way people get 2 week cycles is to use liquid ammonia plus that bottle bac you just used. Even if you don't add ammonia, its still getting in anyway, but natural means are slower and that takes a good 30-40 ish days usually quicker. Your test kits now wont help much since we're shy of the submersion date and since no ammonia has been added. the only param you need to worry about in cycling is ammonia, though you can test for nitrate and nitrite only the behavior of ammonia closes out a cycle, the other two aren't needed to know and adding the extra testing makes cycling seem more complicated because those tests can misread in small increments causing mass confusion. Im not saying nitrite and nitrate aren't present in a cycle, im saying that the way we use submersion time frames accounts for them and only ammonia is required in cycling and known submersion times and boosts used. if you aren't in a rush, then wait 30 days and begin light reefing. if you want a little better than 30 days, order liquid ammonium chloride from dr tim's online and input the amount needed to make your tank 1 ppm. hit with bottle bac again, twice now, then do nothing and let the tank run and digest that ammonia down. in two-three weeks you'll be ready. raw ammonia + bottle bac as fast as two weeks bottle bac added only, natural ammonia is 30-40 days you wait the right timeframe for your boosters used then spike the sample to 1 ppm and test in 24 hours, if zero = cycled. that's cycling summary imo and we only use ammonia in giant cycling threads we don't base anything off the other two. submersion time matters because when we add things to the water to reduce ammonia, that's not the same as the surfaces taking on the bacteria which takes time underwater regardless of how action in the water column works on a given test kit.
  14. you have a very easy tank to cycle that was all dry rock correct, maybe wet sand or possibly dry sand? we have to know a duration underwater and what a test kit says to have a hold on your cycle
  15. Albert slipped a hand written note into my book from him a year or two ago and I bragged to my whole family about that and showed them, that I was friends with someone famous and they were happy for me that I got to talk to someone in my hobby field with that much cloudt. I was using google/alta vista in 98 searching for small reef tank inventions/possibilities on the new webverse and his name came up in the old school web formatting ill never forget... it was a single page returned under his name that had thirty blue links to read about aquaria, one was small reefs that's literally my first thought on the matter for pico reefing long before I owned one, Albert influenced.