koden's 32gallon m-tank

[kinetic]

Wow! I have really enjoyed this thread. I just spent more time than I should haver reading it here at work.

 

My wife and I have been freshwater aquarists for a few years and are considering a venture in to saltwater. I too have been looking at the 32 gallon M-Tank. It looks like a good start for a beginner such as myself.

 

Koden, your journal has definitely been an inspiration. I look forward to checking back often. I also look forward to beginning my trek into this awesome hobby.

 

Troy

 

Hi Troy! Glad you enjoyed the thread. I was also inspired by others posting entries of their progress. It gave me great ideas and I really like DIY stuff. The end results feel great. The M-Tank is definately a good setup to work with, only needing mild modifications to suit your needs. It's good to go right off the bat, but some people, like myself, like to make things even better. M-Tank allows a lot of flexibility. Hope to see your tank setup one day!

[shao-lin nano]

Hey Koden, how's the 70W MH working out for you? Not sure if you mentioned this already but it looks like a LampDr fixture with 14k? Seems like the 150W MH would be a good upgrade, maybe even dual 150s. Most people will run the 70W MH on a tank 20g or less so I'm surprised that you feel like it's plenty. Have you thought about VHO T5s if your tank is long enough? Maybe switch out the PC for that?

 

Sorry for all the questions...just very interested in your progress and equipment choice.

[kinetic]

Sorry for all the questions...just very interested in your progress and equipment choice.

 

Hey questions are cool, no worries =)

 

 

Hey Koden, how's the 70W MH working out for you? Not sure if you mentioned this already but it looks like a LampDr fixture with 14k? Seems like the 150W MH would be a good upgrade, maybe even dual 150s. Most people will run the 70W MH on a tank 20g or less so I'm surprised that you feel like it's plenty. Have you thought about VHO T5s if your tank is long enough? Maybe switch out the PC for that?

 

The 70watt MH is really great. It lights up the tank really well, and is brighter than any other light in my house of course. It doesn't distract too much, like my 250 watt HQI did, in fact my 250 watt blinded anyone in the living room. Would be cool if it was a tank only room or something.

 

It is a LampDr. retrofit kit. He has some good stuff. My 250 MH pendant is from him too. It's increadible, but much too powerful for my setup IMO.

 

The 70 watt provides a lot of light, and brings out the color of my Ocellaris. The tank isn't too deep either, so the light is bright even on the floor. I believe SPS will readily thrive under this light in my tank, even if put close to the floor, but I have yet to have first hand experience. But just looking at it, I can say it improved my lighting system by at least 150%.

 

Another reason why I got 70 instead of 150, is because of temperature. The lighting fixture is quite close to the water's surface. (Though the new legs will be coming to raise the fixture). The 70watt doesn't change the temperature considerably at all. I ran it and it didn't heat things up noticably at all even around 1pm. The problem with the 150watt that Ken at finnex told me about was that the heat that close may damage the center brace. The 70 watt is much cooler, keeps the temp from skyrocketing (good for california), and is plenty of light.

 

LampDr.'s reflector setup is also very good, though I believe the one in my pendant is much better. But that one is also larger and semi-spidered.

 

Anyway, it's the best retrofit for my fixture and tank setup IMO. I will definately have to see, though, when I get the SPS. That will be the ultimate test.

 

There was no reason not to get the 150 watt because of price, he still gave us a great price for that buy too. (just to veer you away from thinking I went for 70 watts because of price... shoot I already spent $1400 on my tank, a little more for 150 watt woudln't have mattered).

 

I hope that answered your question. Overall I'm more than satisfied with my lighting. With a chiller, and maybe more height off the water, and if the tank was not in the living room, I would consider a 150watt MH.

 

I can't stress enough how crazy the 250 watt was in my living room. From outside the windows were glowing. It's nuts. That thing was way bright. I had spots in my eyes for hours after looking towards it (not even directly at it). Lol.

[Izzue]

"spots in my eyes"

 

ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Izzue

[kinetic]

yeah, i get blinded for awhile. it sucks! do you guys get that with MH lights?

[shao-lin nano]

I generally try not to look into the light but ya, they can do that. My 10K bulb was much worse though...the 20K is also blinding but not as bad.

[kinetic]

I read in the manual that the Finnex lighting fixture's plastic clear cover over the lights has UV protection. Is that true? Also do these things have 100% uv protection? Or is UV needed for SPS to live? How good are these MH lights for our eyes and skin? I don't want to start going blind for the sake of SPS =(

[Izzue]

Out of my league-- dont know nothing about MH except its bright

Should be plenty of info on the net though

 

Izzue

[kinetic]

I'm considering getting a Paracentropyge multifasciatus, Multibarred angel.

 

It grows to 4.5". $120 from rtchawaii. 21 day guarantee!

 

Think it's a cool fish? I might get that and a flame, both juveniles, though don't know how they'd get along.

 

=P

 

I ordered a reef fanatic level controller with 2 sensors for my topoff, the Tom aqualift, and a maxijet 600 for my spraybar. I don't need too much flow coming from back there, my tank will turn into a tornado if I get more flow going.

 

I'm still trying to figure out my fuge plans... I have a big brick of chaeto sitting in my tank and tons of pods wandering around, waiting for a fuge.

 

I need to make a fuge that's 6"x3.75"x6.5". What materials do I need? Should I go with acrylic? Or should I just get plastic tupperware pieces?

[Quash]

Any idea on the corals yet?

[kidphc]

Here is a lesson I learned. If you are drilling out the return line and putting a Quiet One 3000 pump. The overflow sump can NOT keep up. The return sump emptied in 10 seconds and promptly overflowed the skimmer and tank.

 

You'll need a choke(check valve) if you are going to use a 1/2 PVC return line. So the plumming is absolultely hideous right now. Guess it is time to plan on how to do the SWCD to clean things up.

 

I also ended up ditching the spray bar and hydor combo, since there was too little flow to use the Hydor flow. With the Hydor flow and Seio620 there is plenty of flow, actually probably a bit too much and its pretty random in some places.

 

Currently, the tank is cycling with 35 pounds of live rock..... Oieeee..... forgot to measure the openings on top of the tank and bought too really really large pieces that were tough to fit in.

 

The refuge is going to take some thought now. The overflow is too slow and with the refuge the return sump may run dry. If the refuge stores too much water, when the pumps are off it could cause it to over flow the tank. One idea is to put one of the stock pumps under the bubble trap and force additional flow into the return portion of the sump. Any ideas???????????

[kinetic]

Here is a lesson I learned. If you are drilling out the return line and putting a Quiet One 3000 pump. The overflow sump can NOT keep up. The return sump emptied in 10 seconds and promptly overflowed the skimmer and tank.

 

You'll need a choke(check valve) if you are going to use a 1/2 PVC return line. So the plumming is absolultely hideous right now. Guess it is time to plan on how to do the SWCD to clean things up.

 

I also ended up ditching the spray bar and hydor combo, since there was too little flow to use the Hydor flow. With the Hydor flow and Seio620 there is plenty of flow, actually probably a bit too much and its pretty random in some places.

 

Currently, the tank is cycling with 35 pounds of live rock..... Oieeee..... forgot to measure the openings on top of the tank and bought too really really large pieces that were tough to fit in.

 

The refuge is going to take some thought now. The overflow is too slow and with the refuge the return sump may run dry. If the refuge stores too much water, when the pumps are off it could cause it to over flow the tank. One idea is to put one of the stock pumps under the bubble trap and force additional flow into the return portion of the sump. Any ideas???????????

 

 

That's interesting, I have a quiet one 3000 connected to the 1/2" return line without any problem with the overflow. I know another guy with a m-tank with a 785gph pump without a problem either. Can you explain your return setup again?

 

One suggestion about the return pump: get a t connector and connect to the pump, then one outlet goes to the return line, and the other goes to a ball valve that empties right back into the return chamber. Using the ball valve you can control how much flow is coming out that outlet, thus being able to reduce your flow without needing to put backpressure on the pump. This way extra flow will go right back into the sump without putting excessive strain on the pump.

 

What is your fuge going to look like? Just a box? YOu should put a return pump of some sort in the fuge, or have it pump water into the fuge having it overflow into the sump.

 

Let us know =)

 

Any idea on the corals yet?

 

I have no idea yet =( I'm researching a lot of corals but not sure what I should get. I will have a lot of orange fish, so I want more blue corals so they contrast. Maybe red ones, less green though.

 

any suggestions?

[kidphc]

Can you explain your return setup again?

 

It is 1/2 internal diameter PVC from the pump to the sump wall connected to a hydor flow. So there were two 90 degree bends. With this setup the return sump emptied in 10 seconds, flooded the main tank and the overflow....

 

The spray bar was taking too much pressure for the hydor flow to spin so I removed the spray bar. Wasn't any room with the LR anyways. I placed a ball valve to limit the flow and that helped. The viewing area's water level is real high right now, but its the only way I've been able to get enough flow to keep return sump filled with water. Its about 3 inches higher then the acrylic leg for the rain tray.

 

One suggestion about the return pump: get a t connector and connect to the pump, then one outlet goes to the return line, and the other goes to a ball valve that empties right back into the return chamber. Using the ball valve you can control how much flow is coming out that outlet, thus being able to reduce your flow without needing to put backpressure on the pump. This way extra flow will go right back into the sump without putting excessive strain on the pump.

 

Brilliant, a return to the sump. I had thought about doing something like that but only had thought of a hole in the PVC. But the return to the sump is great. I can use it to give flow to the refuge, without an additional power head or pump. Thanks.

 

What is your fuge going to look like? Just a box? YOu should put a return pump of some sort in the fuge, or have it pump water into the fuge having it overflow into the sump.

 

Still hashing it out. I'm trying to make a picture so you can visualize.

[kinetic]

It is 1/2 internal diameter PVC from the pump to the sump wall connected to a hydor flow. So there were two 90 degree bends. With this setup the return sump emptied in 10 seconds, flooded the main tank and the overflow....

 

The spray bar was taking too much pressure for the hydor flow to spin so I removed the spray bar. Wasn't any room with the LR anyways. I placed a ball valve to limit the flow and that helped. The viewing area's water level is real high right now, but its the only way I've been able to get enough flow to keep return sump filled with water. Its about 3 inches higher then the acrylic leg for the rain tray.

Brilliant, a return to the sump. I had thought about doing something like that but only had thought of a hole in the PVC. But the return to the sump is great. I can use it to give flow to the refuge, without an additional power head or pump. Thanks.

Still hashing it out. I'm trying to make a picture so you can visualize.

 

What's a Hydor flow? Is that the pivoting "nozzle" that connects to the end of the return? I believe those were only rated up to 310 gph? Not sure if that's the source of your problem.

 

I'm guessing I must be constricting my pump somehow since I have a similar setup: quiet one to 3/4" vinyl tube connected to the 1/2" return pipe (the one that came stock) so it'd fit through the hole in the tank. But that's it, and my water leve is really high, an inch from the lip of the tank. Can you take some pix? But definately, a ball valve with the T or something similar would work great, and could power your fuge water movement too =) Sounds great. No need for an extra pump!

 

I'll go look up the hydor to see if it's what I'm thinking. =) keep us updated!

 

10/17/05

My Reef Fanatic level controller with 2 sensors is coming in the mail on Wednesday, along with the aqualifter and a maxijet 600. I'll get some airline tubing from the LFS or hardware store, and have the aqualifter take water out of one of my RO water jugs with the aqualifter (made by Toms).

 

The maxijet 600 will power my spray bar. It'll move about 200gph through the staggered holes to move water over the substrate and behind the rocks.

 

I'm still getting ideas to fabricate the fuge too... I have a big clump of chaeto sitting in my tank, and tons of pods crawling on the acrylic =P it doesn't seem to be a problem, though the chaeto is growing fast.

[kinetic]

Just ordered a convalescent home / specimen container and a small minijet 80gph pump to fabricate a fuge with.

 

Here's the specimen container:

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod...4+113766+113565

 

That will be 7" L x 3-1/4" W x 6" H, which is a perfect fit for my rear sump! The rear iis 4" wide, so the 3.25" will work perfectly. I'll hang that in the sump area, drill a "grill" pattern for water to flow out on one side, and a 1/2" hole on the other for the minijet to push 80gph into. This will provide flow through the fuge.

 

So simple! Ony cost me $20 shipped from drsfostersmith for pump and container.

 

It'll neatly fit with the skimmer etc in the intake chamber.

 

This will be here next monday! Hopefully sooner. I'll update you guys when it gets here =)

[kinetic]

My lady told me she wanted to see more pix of the ocellaris pair and skunk cleaner, so I took some new pix. I need a smaller fstop and a macro lens in the future to take better pix. These are just snapshots:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[c3po]

The darker ocellaris looks hungry... a fat clown is a happy clown

 

I love my crew.. Its never a dull tank when a few clowns are on the move...

[Izzue]

Nice

fisheeesss

 

Izzue

[kidphc]

Tank is looking nice...

It is really comming along nicely.

[kinetic]

The darker ocellaris looks hungry... a fat clown is a happy clown

 

the little guy is definately fat (lighter colored one). The female (darker) ate a lot yesterday, I fed them piece by piece until she stopped eating very vigorously.

 

Should she be fatter?

[kinetic]

It looks like the larger / darker one only eats one or two flakes a day, while the little guy goes after big pieces as long as I'll keep feeding. She does like the frozen food I feed though.

 

I'm going to be installing my spray bar and SCWD today I'll let you guys know how that goes =)

[Cesar]

Those fish pictures are killer man. Nice coloration.

[Babycakes]

do they eat from your hand? i'm training my TR perc to eat flake pieces one by one from me. lol. great pics your lady must be happy with them, she's probably gonna demand a anemone soon

[kinetic]

do they eat from your hand? i'm training my TR perc to eat flake pieces one by one from me. lol. great pics your lady must be happy with them, she's probably gonna demand a anemone soon

 

My Ocellaris are very brave, I think the third day I was feeding them by hand already. When I reach into the water to move a rock, pickup a snail, or clean something, they always swim to my hand looking for flakes or food. So does the shrimp. I feel loved! =)

 

My girlfriend is taking a class right now (she's a senior in college, I just graduated last Spring) called aquatic communities! She's a bio major, and it's a requirement. How fitting huh? We discussed the mutualism / communialism between the clown and anemone, and she definately thinks I should get an anemone when the time is right (at least 6 months or so).

 

Anyway, since she's still in school, she's not around so she always wants pictures. She hasn't even seen the tank in person. Agh I miss her all the time =( BUt she deifnately likes the clowns.

 

 

So back onto the topic of the clown/anemones, do you guys think it's mutualism or communialism?

 

Mutualism seems better to me, since the anemone really doesn't know the clownfish is there, it's not actually doing anything for the clownfish since it protects itself anyway by stinging. Of course it's not symbiosis since the anemone / clown can both survive w/o each other (though commun/mutualism is signs of a beginning of symbiosis in the farrrrr future). THe clown,however, does know what it's doing and it's mucus coat being sugar based instead of protein based keeps the anemone from wanting to eat it. So it's kind of USING the anemone.

 

But then it could be seen another way: the anemone doesn't fight the fact that the clown is there, and doesn't develop into stinging the sugar coated (sounds funny) clown. Which could be a means of saying, OK you can stay, we'll work together. So it just doesn't really have to do anything special, which is why it's hard to see it's more than mutualism.

 

Btw: Mutualism is when it's a one way relationship, Communalism is when they work together, and Symbiosis is when they depend on each other for survival like the zooxanthlia and corals. (i might be wrong, but that's what i gathered from reading some books)

 

=)

[kinetic]

Ok this will be a boring post just because I'm WAAAY too tired to take pictures.

 

I installed my spray bar with a maxijet 600. I have it all the way at the bottom of the tank corner behind the rock. The bottom row of holes puts a good amount of flow over the substrate, it actually kicked a lot of it up but settled down, the second row pushes air through the backs of my live rock, and the third row pushes air up the back of the tank. A lot better flow in the back areas now =) I'm really happy, there's not a dead spot in my tank. For awhile I had a nasty storm, lots of sand and detritus flying everywhere. Will this harm my clown fish? THey were kinda going nuts for awhile.

 

I mounted the maxijet against the back glass with the inlet pointing to the right, outlet pointing down, then with a L pipe connected the spray bar so it is parallel to the inlet pipe (which is covered by a grill, no snails allowed!). The wire is covered all the way to the top of the LR with only about 4 inches showing before going over the top of the tank, and it being black as well totally dissapears. It's great =)

 

I also installed my Reef Fanatic level controller, mounting two sensors inside my return compartment under the trickle trays. If the water level exceeds the bottommost trickle tray, it shuts everything off (in case the other sensor gets stuck etc). The second sensor will turn on when the water drops close to the top of the quiet one, then it'll power on a Tom Aqualifter that gets RO water from a bucket below. The dripping is slow, but it should be good enough. I'll test this tomorrow when the water evaporates a bit more.

 

I also cut 3/4 of my chaeto that's free floating in my tank out, I'll be giving it to a friend.

 

Pictures tomorrow =)