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steelhealr

Stop!! Do Not Buy A Nano Cube

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sNEIRBO

JMT -

 

Your tank looks AWESOME! Did you build that yourself? Or have it built for you? Tell me more, you've piqued my interest!

 

I think I found my next tank - 30 Gallon SeaClear System II. Acrylic Tank, back wall for hiding the filtration, heater, pumps, etc. You can even fit a protein skimmer in there too - imagine that! You can check out SeaClear's System II info here -

 

http://www.seaclear.com/USFS-seaclear.html

 

Here's a bit of interesting info from SeaClear's website -

 

Acrylic is 17 times stronger than glass, yet weighs only half as much. This not only makes CASCO Aquariums safer and nearly childproof, but easier to carry and setup.

 

Acrylic aquariums flex slightly and are not brittle like glass which makes them virtually breakproof. CASCO Aquariums are 4% clearer and 20% percent better insulated. This means they are better looking and healthier for your fish - less temperature fluctuation means less sick fish.

 

Who else feels like they got fed a load of SHI# by an LFS about the benefits of glass / evils of acrylic?

 

Cheers -

sNEIRBO (last week's CRACK victim)

LOVE the Hobby!

HATE the Cube!

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steelhealr

Hi..thanks for everyone joining in on this thread and SNEIRBO, thanks for the support. I have two AGA tanks, a 10 gallon FW and a 46G BF. Both solid of course. The two cube tanks shown on this thread are super and I may run by a tank design shop and see what it would cost to build one out. Geez...with work, it is just too time consuming to silicone one together. A great project tho'.

 

I rechecked my tank tonite. The crack is about...hmmm...1 1/2 to 2 inches long, extends from the top underneath the frame and inferiorly running along the bend. On the inside is a raised edge. The outside if flat/flush. For others that are following now, good options as submitted by everyone here are :

 

1) Oceanic's 30G cube tank, submitted by lgreen

2) SeaClears acrylic 30G by SNEIRBO

3) 26G AGA Bowfront

4) Garf's DIY tank based on your measurements specifications, submitted by outtafocus

 

I have to agree that AGA and Oceanic are solid glass tanks and SeaClear probably the biggest with acrylic. Personally, I think Oceanics probably has the closest look and a solid build tho' may be on the pricey side for some. I love my FW bow front...like those lines too.

 

I just have to think that even if you order a NC now and it arrives without visible cracks and it leak tests negative, there is just no guarantee that the seamless corners will hold over time and they are now an Achilles heel for a nano-reef owner. JBJ does not give them a long guarantee. Considering that almost eveyone does some 'mod' on it, the warranty technically is voided.

 

The thought of doing 10% weekly water changes now, i.e., constantly removing and replacing almost 24lbs of water provokes some thought, no? Talk about stress tests on a hairline crack.

 

Again..thanks for everyone's support. Please...everyone..check your cubes along the frame edges and the seamless corners. SH

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szesteve

Is this only a problem with the 24G models or have 12G models had a problem too?

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yoshiod9

when i started i had a choice between the eclipse12 and the nanocube12...i'm so happy that i chose the eclipse. no cracks and just as easy to upgrade as the nc.

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RP Beesh
Originally posted by sNEIRBO

SH -

 

Did you swap out your tank yet?  As I was headed to the movies to see "Batman Begins" I thought of something that might help you out - put some clear packing tape over the crack.  I'm not joking!  That should stop the crack from propagating!  It's obviously not going to be a permanent fix, but should give you some time to figure something out.

 

I'm watching the cracks I noticed intensly.  I have them measured.  I'll measure again before hitting the bed tonight, and again in the morning.  I also placed one of  my makeshift "water alerts" on my basement floor by the foot of my JBJ Stand.

 

I checked out that Oceanic 30G Cube as well.  I really want to do something, I'm really afraid this tank is going to POP again.

 

BTW - I'm always up for a good beer, but Long Island is kind of a far drive from Detroit.  Not that I wouldn't drive that far for a good beer, I'm just afraid Cube-2 will POP before I get back!  Hey, things could be worse - we could own MiniBows!  HA!

 

what wrong with a minibow

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necat2

I’ve probably been doing the same as everyone else, trying to find an alternative non-nano cube route. I stumbled across this extremely interesting, all be it technical, web page which talks about “How to Calculate the Glass Thickness for your Aquarium”

http://www.fnzas.org.nz/articles/technical...glass_complete/

 

I also found a wholesale website which gives a lot of nice possible alternatives.

http://www.clearforlife.com/index.html

 

Nadine

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Cable

Oh man steelhealr I am so sorry about your tank. Your excellent 24G Nano Cube DX Setup Manual was what convinced me to go with the NC24. A week ago I spent CAD$369 on an NC24DX and CAD$100 on a matching stand. At the time sNEIRBO's crack (and others) appeared to be shipping problems and not some structural/manufacturing design flaw.

 

I just went over my NC24 carefully and can't find any hairline cracks or other visual defects inside or outside. Next week I'm going on vacation and a friend is watching my place. I really am worried. I am actually considering emptying the tank and leaving my live rock in a plastic bin with a powerhead. If this tank cracks when someone is not here its going cost me thousands in repairs to my condo and the roof of the condo below me.

 

This sucks.

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steelhealr

Cable...understood. Beleve me.....you can tell by my thread that I was sold on it too despite it's weaknesses. However, I've been going over that tank with a MagFloat and photographing it now for over 3 months. This crack was not 'missable'. All of us reading this thread now have a good understanding that glass is not bendable and, like any other material, is subject to the stress of heat and mechanical changes. The corners are a weakness of this tank. Whether shipping contributes to weakening it or not, you still have to fill this tank with about 192 lbs of water,25-30 lbs of rock and then weekly 24lb water changes. I would emphatically add to all owners that weekly maintenance includes glass inspection with particular attention to the seamless areas near the frames. I'm convinced that SNEIRBO's catastrophic failure was NOT due to shipping.

 

To Necat2...great job. I'm impressed with your research. That link DOES have nice tanks. Stay with me here and we'll see how this turns out. Believe me...if I was a 'newbie', and saw this rash of posts, I would think differently AT LEAST until all the answers are in. In principle, I think the idea behind the NC was sound. SH

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sNEIRBO

Idea - sound.

Design - sound.

Material selection - poor.

Manufacturer selection - worse.

Hobby - LOVE it.

Cube - HATE it.

 

I know a little something about what JBJ is going through with their supplier. I work for a company that imports product from Asian manufacturers. It is impossible to get them to make modifications to their product. And worse yet, they tend to run HUGE lots of product without checking quality. It can be really frustrating dealing with that mentality.

 

That doesn't mean I think JBJ is not liable for these problems. There's something called "incoming inspection" they should be conducting. If they're simply repackaging the tanks without inspecting them before they go out, that's a problem. My company is dealing with different product - fasteners - and we 100% inspect everything using laser sorters before we package. That's the only way we can make sure we're not sending out a bad product. If you're going to put your name on the box, you better make damn sure it's a quality product before you do. Because if I end up suing someone over these cracking Cubes, it isn't going to be "Fock Hu Glass" in Hong Kong, it's going to be JBJ Lighting in CA.

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calvin

he, guess this settles the nanocube vs. via aqua debate. make the switch, people!

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steelhealr

Agree with sNEIRBO..I have a buddy whose family owns a huge company on the east coast that manufactures tea and bread crumbs. The amouht of quality assurance that goes into their product is amazing.

 

I'm not an expert in sales by any means, but, wouldn't it make sense to, say....open and inspect/test 'x' amount of tanks per shipment that comes in? Or no? SH

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sNEIRBO

That my friend is what is known as an "incoming inspection audit". You would inspect a set amount of units from every lot / shipment you receive. When you deal with Automotive customers - as my company does - you're expected to do this type of audit. You inspect say 50 parts out of EVERY lot. When you have a quality problem - let's just say that 11 parts CRACKED out of 50,000 - the Automotive customer puts you on a "Quality Hold" and you are expected to inspect 100% of the product you ship them until you either bring your PPM (parts per million) rating to an acceptable level, or they say you have to do a 100% Inspection for X number of days (usually 30 - 90 days).

 

The problem here is, the customer / supplier relationship is reversed. We the customers are small compared to the supplier JBJ. We have no voice. In contrast, Ford, GM and Chrysler are HUGE companies compared to the relative size of my company. So, when Ford, GM or Chrysler says "Jump!", my company only asks "How high?" When we say "Jump!" - JBJ says "Who are you?"

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ccjung

you do have a voice!!! Me!!!

 

My rep got a nice call yesterday warning him that the ###### was going to hit the fan and that they better do something about it (not in those words, well, ok in those words!!)

 

Another note:

 

I think that some of these tanks are coming from a Defective lot of cubes that came in early in the products lifecycle.

 

It began around January, when the first cracks were evident in teh 24 and soon became rampant through the early part of the year.

 

heres the first unlucky customer I had.

 

His first tank arrive roughed up but unbroken. It began leaking at the seams and then cracked. I reimbursed him and he bought a 24g DX from a second vendor. Crack.

 

My LFS had some of the bad batch and had about 4 tanks crack upon setup.

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthread...highlight=crack

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthread...highlight=crack

 

 

If you can, try to think of when you bought it and where you bought it. Was it a NVM model?

 

Most likely it wasnt a 2005 model.

 

Chris

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sNEIRBO

Chris -

 

My Cube-Uno was DEFINITELY NOT a 2005 Model. It was not a DX, just a standard 24G. The tank I got as a replacement WAS a DX, but again I'm doubting that it was a 2005 model unit. The LFS I got mine from said they've had about 6 DXs "in stock" for about 6 months. I will ask him tomorrow if he knows for sure when he got the tank he gave me as a replacement. I know he has the box still for the Nano Cube - he's waiting for the replacement tank from JBJ so he can put the hood and everything back together and sell it. Is there some way of knowing from the box when the unit was made / distributed.

 

Again Chris, I think you're AWESOME and the support you've given everyone, even us who have not purchased our Cubes from you is INCREDIBLE. Please don't take any of this venting / frustration as being directed towards you. I can only speak for myself, but my rants are only directed towards JBJ and the Cube itself. I think so highly of you, if you called me tomorrow to tell me you were moving, I'd consider buying a ticket to CA to help you! :D

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Upright Joe
All of us reading this thread now have a good understanding that glass is not bendable and, like any other material, is subject to the stress of heat and mechanical changes.

 

Hmm... I'm sitting here drinking cola out of a very round glass mug with a very curvy handle on the side of it. When I'm done, I will put it into the diswasher were temperatures will shoot from room temperature up to well over 100 degrees while the thing is being mechanically banged around by high-pressure water. I've had this mug for at least 5 years - no cracks.

 

AGA also sells glass bow front and surfline aquariums.

 

Glass and acrylic are both perfectly adequate materials providing they are used well.

 

Sorry about your cube SH

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ccjung

ouch

6 months??

 

I think thats why they broke. No lie!

 

Heres teh story on the 24s..

 

When i was just starting. I was a JBJ dealer, but the backorder on 24g was substantial.... Once they got here. I bought 2 from Pacific Reef (probably the first store in the United States) to get the 24g.

 

After I got them, I worked a dealer volume discount with a kind dealer, Rainbow Pet Shop (another "premiere" JBJ dealer).

 

of that lot of 12 or so cubes, i think i had a total of 5 or 6 crack shortly after setup or in shipping.

 

I didnt get any 24g until later, around march.

 

I think the warning should be this:

 

IF YOU BOUGHT A NANOCUBE 24g DX, please ask your dealer when they got it. If they got it Nov/Dec be on the lookout.

 

Chris

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ccjung

this doesnt eliminate the problems, but may cite/bring to mind the fact that I feel there was a defective/rough handled batch sent out on the very first 24g.

 

Dealers had been on wait for a long time, and JBJ was out to get them out for the christmas rush.

 

Customs at that time took forever. I wish i could show a video of what goes on at the port of LA, but wouldnt know where to get it.

 

Chris

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steelhealr

Hi..I'm not sure what Upright Joe's implies..the last two lines. But anyway..if this helps anyone:

 

1) My cube was purchased over Ebay in February; it was $100 cheaper than my lfs' price, hence the purchase. Shipping was free.

2) They advertised, I believe, six. The company was called Star Ridge Aquatics, http://starridgeaquatics.com/index.html

3) The model was not the '05, but 24G DX Night Vue Moonlights.

 

I am going to see if I can find the auction number. I don't know if it is retrievable..and see if I can find the others who purchased and see if they had problems. Anyone think I should contact the seller???? SH

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steelhealr

Computers are amazing. Thru PayPal, I was able to find the auction number that was for the NC I purchased. Ebay actually has the page still up. The wonder of computers. I am contacting the other purchasers to see if they had cracks or failures. SH

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sterling18

Wow simply amazing.

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Upright Joe

I'm sorry. I wasn't trying to imply anything SH.

 

I was just saying there's nothing wrong with glass in general - it can be an extremely strong, durable, and long lasting material (as can acrylic).

 

There must be design, manufacturing, or shipping/handling issues causing these cubes to pop. Regardless, what the issue is, hopefully JBJ takes it upon themselves to get to the root of it and make things right.

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Chronicles

son of a....I just looked at mine, right side of the cube, 1 1/2" down from the black , 2" rear of the bend there is a 1" long thing, it better would be a scratch...

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nekomi

I've seen someone ask this question twice now, and no answer... and I'm curious to know too:

 

Is this a problem with only 24 gallon models, or 12 gallons as well? I have a standard (24-watt, not DX) 12 gallon setup that I purchased last August.

 

Any consensus?

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tMoney

From what I've read, this has been a problem with the 6, 12, and 24 gallon nano cubes.

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steelhealr

All of them....however, the 'run' right now is on 24's. Chronicles....get your finger in the tank and see if you can feel a stepoff. SH

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