Sandbed depth - grain size - preferences?

[Jakesaw]

Being I'm on my first Reef tank, I followed advice of LFS and lightly covered bottom of tank to avoid nutrient problems.  For grain size I went middle of the road and chose Special Grade b/c it was a good value for the large bag and I could use the rest later ( I'm a budget reefer )

 

Planning stage of upgrade as I quash the Dinos in my 10 gallon with fish number 2 Bioload.

 

The main issue I've found with my sandbed is there's not deep enough to put frags on the bottom of tank.  Whenever I add a frag I either have to cut off bottom of plug ( which sometimes pops frag off the plug leading to a gloppy double glued bottom ) or pile up some new sand to hold the frag upright.

 

What is the ideal depth you guys use and grain size / depth I want to resolve some of these issues.  

 

Also Pros / cons of prior sand experiences you've had.

Any maintenance with various choices.  I have zero maintenance b/c sandbed is so shallow..  If I go deeper wold I have to clean? 

 

Than;s

[DevilDuck]

I use these frag stations to hold my frags on the sand bed. I like the look of a decent clean sand bed. It also give you more options on live stock with conches, pistol shrimp, burrowing wrasses etc. I have about 2.5 to 3 inch depth.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/254190270774

[Jakesaw]

59 minutes ago, DevilDuck said:

I use these frag stations to hold my frags on the sand bed. I like the look of a decent clean sand bed. It also give you more options on live stock with conches, pistol shrimp, burrowing wrasses etc. I have about 2.5 to 3 inch depth.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/254190270774

Those frag rocks look interesting - May have to pick one up.

 

re: The sand, I think you're using the fine sugar grain.  Have you had any issues with that.  Waste,nitrogen buildup.  Do you have to clean with a siphon ever

 

Thanks

[Murphs_Reef]

I think it's total preference. I have a variance in depth across the bed of very fine sand as shallow as 1 inch, but have a plateau around my mushroom cove of 3 inch where my wrasse sleeps. 

 

A plethora of wrasse, Nass snails, sand sifting star, conch snails, worms and crabs keep the sand turned and clean. 

[DevilDuck]

10 hours ago, Jakesaw said:

Those frag rocks look interesting - May have to pick one up.

 

re: The sand, I think you're using the fine sugar grain.  Have you had any issues with that.  Waste,nitrogen buildup.  Do you have to clean with a siphon ever

 

Thanks

Check out aquarocksdesign.com too. They have magnetic and artificial rock frag holders.
 

No problems thus far. My gobies, pistol shrimps, conch, etc keep the sand turned and clean. The sand shifting goby goes through every inch of the tank daily, shifting the top 1/8th of an inch. 

I guess the only issue is cleaning the glass covered by the sand, which I do occasionally. I believe the dangers of nitrogen build up is over rated unless you have decades old undisturbed sand. 

 

[Jakesaw]

20 hours ago, DevilDuck said:

I use these frag stations to hold my frags on the sand bed. I like the look of a decent clean sand bed. It also give you more options on live stock with conches, pistol shrimp, burrowing wrasses etc. I have about 2.5 to 3 inch depth.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/254190270774

talk about timing.

 

Lights turned on for tank this morning, and what did I see.  My Frogspawn Frag pulled out of the sand with plug stick straight up in the air.  Must've been one cranky crab.

 

Perhaps a sign...?

[Dave21]

I'm new to reef tanks and set my first one up this summer. I was also curious about sand depth/size so researched online and recieved great feedback from everyone here at nano reef. 

 

I ultimately went with a 2inch layer of Fiji Pink because I wanted more of the sand look. I dont typically vacuum the sand, but have a few Nassarius snails and a Florida Conch that do a good job keeping it mixed up. 

 

My tanks been running for about four months now and knock on wood, everythings been going smoothly. 

[righttirefire]

Too drunk will weight in more sober after reading

[righttirefire]

I ran special reef grade about 1.5-2" of sand and believe the diamond goby did all the work in my sandbed. They will require good feedings since they won't be able to source enough food in the sandbed.

 

The princess wouldn't allow frags in the sand, so all my frags got cut off the plugs and glued to the rockwork. I like the earlier mentioned frag station rock. 

[filefishfinatic]

jake, i have dealt with dinos a few times. what i chose was 40 lbs of large grained fiji pink. i chose it because its versatile and gives you a very good substrate for sponges and microfauna. also it is good for aragonite release. when you are fighting dinos you must do the following:
 

1. no water changes or dosing, no chemicals either. it is easy to get sucked into some weird dosing regimine which will just cost you money and it wont work. dinoflagettes are fed by nutrients and the main cause is a low level of nitrate along with a high level of phosphate. another thing to consider is lowering your pumps flow to the minimum required to keep your livestock alive. 

 

2. let things get dirty, you want to encourage growths of complex algae and microalgae along with copepods and phytoplankton, these will take away nutrients from the dinoflagettes and the pods will consume the dinoflagettes. idealistically you want to grow some microalgae or some coralline but that can be difficult and you can settle for any algae as long as it isnt killer caleurpa. Raising nitrate will set this into motion.

 

3. turn up the heat, if you have a adjustable heater, you should run your heater at 82. this is a good precaution, this makes it harder for the dinoflagettes to grow. the theory behind this is that back in the 00s and stuff, people used flourescents and ac pumps which generates heat. people didnt usually get dinos back then because of the heat. 

 

 

[Jakesaw]

2 hours ago, righttirefire said:

I ran special reef grade about 1.5-2" of sand and believe the diamond goby did all the work in my sandbed. They will require good feedings since they won't be able to source enough food in the sandbed.

 

Ever since I got my Talbot's damsel I am lucky if any food gets to the sandbed.  He eats like a champ.  ( I think it's b/c he swims around so much )

 

My clown is having to change his spoiled & lazy eating behavior b/c of it.   He became used to sitting in his cave waiting for pellet food to drop in front of hole to eat.  Will swim after Frozen food though.

 

With the new feeding dynamic - I was looking for my crab cuisine to spot feed the CUC.  It's too big to fit in the Talob's mouth so I know it'll get down there. 

[mcarroll]

Tunze has a couple nice ceramic options to hold frags if you want to look at something a bit different.

 

[mcarroll]

Ok....pasting in my link caused my comment to save.   🤨  And it didn't even save the link.

 

This is the small option:

https://www.tunze.com/US/en/details/0104.800-coral-rack-nano.html

 

[Jakesaw]

39 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

Ok....pasting in my link caused my comment to save.   🤨  And it didn't even save the link.

 

This is the small option:

https://www.tunze.com/US/en/details/0104.800-coral-rack-nano.html

 

Those Tunze racks look nicer than the sandbed racks from ebay, but my budget reefer instinct.

 

 

[Jakesaw]

ok - I'm really liking my new Talbot, but I don't think he likes my Frogspawn at all.  

 

I've had to flip it over 5 times since I got the new fish ( Frag used to be glued to rocks I re-arranged ).  I had it pegged on my Crabs as I've seen them in the area last time my frag flipped. 

 

Today, I added a handful of sand around the frag so it could have a good base of support while I get frag base worked out.  10 minutes later, Frag is upside down again.  I figred a Hermit Crab must have gotten burried in my sand pile - NOPE.  

 

I think the Talbot is swimming into it and knocking it over.  It's right in the front of tank where he likes to swim.  HE's probably like a dog barking at me for dinner time.  

 

Crazy

[mcarroll]

3 hours ago, Jakesaw said:

Those Tunze racks look nicer than the sandbed racks from ebay, but my budget reefer instinct.

DIY may your be your answer then.  Harvest some magnets off a dead powerhead (or make some other arrangement for mounting) and follow the Aragocrete recipe to DIY something very similar for practically no $.

 

2 hours ago, Jakesaw said:

ok - I'm really liking my new Talbot, but I don't think he likes my Frogspawn at all.  

 

I've had to flip it over 5 times since I got the new fish

I could be mistaken, but I think this is characteristic for this genus.  😆😬   But importantly, they are known in the hobby for being mild mannered, not for digging.

 

2 hours ago, Jakesaw said:

I think the Talbot is swimming into it and knocking it over.  It's right in the front of tank where he likes to swim.  HE's probably like a dog barking at me for dinner time.  

 

Crazy

This.

 

I love this hobby.  🙂 

[Jakesaw]

30 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

This.

 

I love this hobby.  🙂 

It's definitely more interesting than FW tanks - FOR SURE!

 

More headaches to learn, but more joy in the end for reward. 

[filefishfinatic]

what you can do is get a plastic circle ice cube tray, place it on some rocks above the sand then take your frags and cut the stick part off the plug so its like a hockey puck then put the frag plug puck in the ice cube hole 

[Jakesaw]

Woke up to my tank being a mess this morning.  The sand is all dug up around my LR up and spit around my corals.  Don't hjave much depth, but I see the glass bottom in a handful of places.

 

My tank lights are still on the past daylight saving time schedule so they turn off early and I missed my PM feed.  Being a heavy eater, I learned today the Damsel " MUST BE FED " multiple times a day.  Between last night and today's lights turned on - the entire base of sand is dug into.  I've got sand push p over my GSP, even caught my fish spitting out a little sand from under his main rock.  

 

I think he was foraging for food in the sand b/c h was hungry.  Just a guess.

 

I got a chuckle out of it.  But I do need to get in there and clean up the mess.

[mcarroll]

Eheim auto-feeder.

[Jakesaw]

1 hour ago, mcarroll said:

Eheim auto-feeder.

Jakesaw auto-feeder 

 

 

 

[Jakesaw]

Just an update on my SANDBED with my newish Talbot's Damselfish. 

 

He's a pretty awesome fish.  His territorial defending of his rock island is pretty strong, and semi-aggressiveness stands out.  But mainly peaceful while actively swimming around all of the tank all day long.   

 

Now to the sand part.   The little guy has literally dug up all the sand ( pretty shallow sandbed ) around both my rock structures.  Waves of exposed glass bottom with mounds of sand waving all over the place.  I'm having to regularly pickup corals and shake the sand out of em, bring them to surface, or blow them with a turkey baster.  

 

I guess the fish wants as many nooks and crannies he can find his way into.  Still not sure where the Talbot sleeps at night, but he does have a place in back of tank that he disappears in for a good part of the night. 

 

Is this sand digging normal behavior for Talbots - or damsels in general.  Was a pretty unexpected funny / interesting / sometimes annoying habit that came with the little guy. 

 

I think he really wanted to be a sandsifting goby but came out a Talbot's damsel.  

 

 

[filefishfinatic]

14 minutes ago, Jakesaw said:

Just an update on my SANDBED with my newish Talbot's Damselfish. 

 

He's a pretty awesome fish.  His territorial defending of his rock island is pretty strong, and semi-aggressiveness stands out.  But mainly peaceful while actively swimming around all of the tank all day long.   

 

Now to the sand part.   The little guy has literally dug up all the sand ( pretty shallow sandbed ) around both my rock structures.  Waves of exposed glass bottom with mounds of sand waving all over the place.  I'm having to regularly pickup corals and shake the sand out of em, bring them to surface, or blow them with a turkey baster.  

 

I guess the fish wants as many nooks and crannies he can find his way into.  Still not sure where the Talbot sleeps at night, but he does have a place in back of tank that he disappears in for a good part of the night. 

 

Is this sand digging normal behavior for Talbots - or damsels in general.  Was a pretty unexpected funny / interesting / sometimes annoying habit that came with the little guy. 

 

I think he really wanted to be a sandsifting goby but came out a Talbot's damsel.  

 

 

my clarkii does the exact same thing i think it is a spawning behavior 

[DevilDuck]

It's a behavior in a lot of damsels. When I had Richard "The Dick" Occelate Damsel he claimed the two major rock structures in the tank and dug out dens under both of them. Initially, it caused one of my rocks to collapse. Luckily there was no damage, but it was irritating. I had to re-home him after he started stressing out some of the other inhabitants.

 

[Jakesaw]

11 minutes ago, DevilDuck said:

It's a behavior in a lot of damsels. When I had Richard "The Dick" Occelate Damsel he claimed the two major rock structures in the tank and dug out dens under both of them. 

The once dominant clown literally never leaves the his rock island except to feed on Frozen food. He's figured out the Talbot's damsel would like to move in if he vacates.  Very little aggresion between the two, only seen em nip twice and it was short lived

 

Of my 2 fish the new guy is my favorite personality wise and open swim in the small tank.  Hopefully with the 20 gallon I move him into he'll be a bit more calm with the territory. 

 

BUT... I reserve the right in my small tank to any time remove all the rock / inhabitants and move things around though. " MY TANK " 

 

He's probably the only damsel I'll ever own though. Read too many horror stories.  Got him b/c he swims alot, and is considedered most peaceful of the damsel family