afterwinter Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 *Thank you if you actually read this entire thing! I have tried to be thorough with everything I can think of that would be relevant.* Back in May I had my tank lose power for 24 hours while I was gone for the weekend. It got really cold and I lost my goby, pistol shrimp, most snails, sea stars, and my corals took a beating. Since then I have worked on keeping my tank as stable as possible and building in as many fail safes as possible. Unfortunately one by one I continue to lose coral. I have lost: duncans, favia, my favorite acan, purple plume gorgonian, goniapora, and blue anthelia. It has been one at a time, not all at once. More like one slowly dies, a week passes, then another starts. Currently my zoas are angry and not opening well, my other acan, that had previously been growing rapidly, is starting to recede. So far my other gorgs, cloves, star polyps, sponges, feather dusters, euphillia, macroalgae and leather corals all look amazing. I have tons of pods everywhere as well. I have dipped corals in case of pests (but saw nothing but pods fall off), I run GFO and carbon regularly with filter floss for mechanical. I use the Korallen-Zucht nano supplements to help coral color and keep my sponges happy. Tank information: Fluval Evo 13.5, lights are blue for an hour, white for 5 hours, then blue again for 3 (for a total of 9). I have a clownfish, royal gramma, a few dwarf cerith snails, baby chitons, and a scarlet hermit. I feed only once a day, either flake, frozen mysis, or pellets, and about twice a week with either reef roids or benereef. Here are my most recent parameters (they are almost always close to these numbers): Phosphate: 0.1- 0.15 (could this be the problem?) Nitrite: 0 Nitrate: almost zero (could this also be a problem?) PH: 8.2 Alk: 9.2 Mag: 1360 Cal: 430 Salinity: 0.26 Temperature: 78-79 I recently added the Royal Gramma to try to boost the nitrates but I am really at a loss. It breaks my heart to watch corals die with no idea how to stop it. I have a beautiful new tank that has been sitting empty in my living room since May that was supposed to be an upgrade for the Fluval. I worry that is never going to happen at this rate. Ugh. Any ideas? Quote Link to comment
DevilDuck Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 It's possible that the lack of nitrate is starving the coral. You may consider dosing nitrate using a reef supplement like brightwell Neonitrate How often and how large are your water changes? What salt are you using and where do you get your water from? Are you using the stock light on the Fluval? The blues are not that powerful and you may need to run the white+blue combo longer. It would be helpful too to post a full tank shot. 1 Quote Link to comment
NoOneLikesADryTang Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 Your nitrates are low, but I’m not sure that’s the main issue. Especially if they are low, but still detectable. Any chance you have something metal in the tank? A hose clamp? Quote Link to comment
afterwinter Posted September 27, 2021 Author Share Posted September 27, 2021 Thank you for responding! I currently do water changes every 3-4 weeks due to the low nutrients and still normal calcium levels. I currently use the Tropic Marin Bio Actif (with distilled water) because it was the closest one to the parameters I was looking to keep. I am actually planning on switching to their classic formula so that I can store water for emergency changes. I do use the stock lights. I wonder If they are not doing the trick anymore. I have a new Reef Breeders light that is waiting on my new tank for when I switch over. Also I do have a bubble algae explosion going on but since I have macro algae it is a process to get them out. The blue light image is previous to major coral loss, the white light image is currently the state of things. Quite a mess. Quote Link to comment
afterwinter Posted September 27, 2021 Author Share Posted September 27, 2021 Ok, I just took a look at my acan and I see that it has a pink ring on the skeleton underneath. I can't find any good information on what to do about it. It sounds like it is a fatal bacterial infection. Does it affect everything? Only LPS? Ugh. Reef keeping is definitely a hair raising adventure. I managed to beat dinos early on so I certainly hope this thing doesn't wipe out my tank! Anyone have information about pink line disease? Quote Link to comment
Clown79 Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 I don't think its the lights as many have the tank with the same light. Maybe running the blue for longer than 4 hrs wouls be best as the blue spectrum is more preferable to corals. Nitrates and phos are not balanced, that could be an issue. Not that the phos at its level is a huge issue but that the nitrates are low to none existant. Nitrate and phos should be balanced. I would stop using gfo. It should not be used regularly. if using carbon, i would bag your own and use much less. 2 tbsp to just help reduce toxins. Using too much can cause issues Carbon used regularly and changed every couple of weeks is preferable than irregular use but using smaller quantities is better Another consideration with corals, how stable is alk? How much is being used daily by corals and do you dose or just relying on waterchanges? 1 Quote Link to comment
DevilDuck Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 That's a great looking tank! Start by correcting the nitrate imbalance first and see if things improve before looking at upgrading the light. 1 Quote Link to comment
afterwinter Posted October 6, 2021 Author Share Posted October 6, 2021 Thank you to everyone for your help! Sorry for going missing, non-reef related life got busy. I did a large water change, switched out my carbon(I use about 3 tablespoons for my small tank), and removed all affected corals. I will remove the gfo next week so I don't do too much too fast. My dragon soul favia as well as my acan both had pink rings on their skeletons, and my other favia had brown goo. So lots of bacterial issues that took them out quickly. Hopefully my hammer coral will survive, it is my last lps in the tank. Lastly, I checked my reef salt and the alkalinity is supposed to be 8. I didn't have time to check my tank right after the water change so I will do so first thing tomorrow. I will have to begin charting it at different times if it has gone from 8 to 9. I wonder if that could have triggered the infections. Thanks again for the help and kind words! Quote Link to comment
ReefTaco Posted October 6, 2021 Share Posted October 6, 2021 You seem to have a lot soft coral in your tank. Since your having die off and corals are stress I would recomment adding extra actived carbon to your filtration as softies release a lot of toxins when stressed or dying. I don't know how recent those photos are but your tank looks great, sorry for the coral loss. 1 Quote Link to comment
Clown79 Posted October 6, 2021 Share Posted October 6, 2021 If this is effecting only lps, possibly its brown jelly disease which does spread to other lps Quote Link to comment
Murphs_Reef Posted October 6, 2021 Share Posted October 6, 2021 TL;Dr but your tank looks very good despite the issues you are having.. Quote Link to comment
MortalWombat Posted October 6, 2021 Share Posted October 6, 2021 I would remove the GFO immediately and perform at least a 50% water change. I would also trim/pull some of the macro as the nutrient levels are low and could starve the zooxanthellae. After the waterchange I would dose some nitrifying bacteria like Dr. Tims and use about 1/2 cup of well rinsed GAC. Quote Link to comment
afterwinter Posted October 6, 2021 Author Share Posted October 6, 2021 Thanks again for all of the replies! Thanks for the encouraging words about my tank as well 🙂I absolutely love it and spend hours watching the tiny little ecosystem. I did trim a fair amount of macros when I did my big water change on Monday. I trim the caulerpa once a week and pull out some of the red macros maybe once a month. I will remove the gfo. I am so nervous about causing a swing in parameters. I think I am going to purchase some reef nutrition oyster feast and phyto feast for my tank. I have a sponge, a few bivalves (that seem to have shown up out of thin air), and a few red colonial feather dusters that I really want to keep. I am sure my gorgonians and pods will also appreciate it. Quote Link to comment
mcarroll Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: Tank information: Fluval Evo 13.5, lights are blue for an hour, white for 5 hours, then blue again for 3 (for a total of 9). I'm not sure what this means in terms of overall lighting, but you want something like 20,000K "blue" color all day. At no point during the day should the light in the tank "look white". Also, corals in nature have a 12 hour day year-round. On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: I have dipped corals in case of pests (but saw nothing but pods fall off) This is just an added stress, increasing the likelihood of mortality. On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: I run GFO and carbon regularly with filter floss for mechanical. These should be unnecessary in your tank. Stop using all of them. Go easy on the water changes too. On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: I use the Korallen-Zucht nano supplements to help coral color and keep my sponges happy. Unless you know specifically what these are for, stop using them. Corals don't need any special supplements to be colorful, and sponges should be fine with food and basic water changes. Once the tank stabilizes you can choose to start being experimental if you want. Now is not the time. On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: I have a clownfish, royal gramma, a few dwarf cerith snails, baby chitons, and a scarlet hermit. I feed only once a day, either flake, frozen mysis, or pellets, and about twice a week with either reef roids or benereef. Make sure the fish are being fed well enough. Eliminate wasteful foods like reef roids/benereef. (Every time you feed your fish, they in turn feed your corals.) On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: Here are my most recent parameters (they are almost always close to these numbers): Phosphate: 0.1- 0.15 (could this be the problem?) Nitrite: 0 Nitrate: almost zero (could this also be a problem?) PH: 8.2 Alk: 9.2 Mag: 1360 Cal: 430 Salinity: 0.26 Temperature: 78-79 PO4 and NO3 seem fine....room for both to be larger numbers without any problems. Again, quit with GFO, mechanical filtration and other factors being used to reduce nutrients. pH seems quite high...too high for an indoor tank. Are you sure of your testing? Any explanation for such a high number? Indoor tanks tend to be around 7.8...sometimes less. Normal is good. Higher pH is not good....makes ammonia more toxic, among other things. So if you're doing anything to make it that way, I would stop. On 9/27/2021 at 2:01 PM, afterwinter said: I have a beautiful new tank that has been sitting empty in my living room since May that was supposed to be an upgrade for the Fluval. I worry that is never going to happen at this rate. Ugh. Any ideas? If it's a bigger tank, I'd do the move sooner than later.....like sometime yesterday, or even before that! 😉 On 9/27/2021 at 3:22 PM, afterwinter said: I currently use the Tropic Marin Bio Actif (with distilled water) because it was the closest one to the parameters I was looking to keep. Oops!! That's carbon dosing salt. AKA Salt that has plastic in it for bacteria to grow on. (Why isn't this considered to be polluted?? LOL) STOP USING THIS IMMEDIATELY. I'll bet a donut that your losses stop immediately. (BTW this falls into the same category of things to avoid such as GFO.) Last, there's nothing very special about the numbers this salt gives you....switch to something decent like Instant Ocean, or even Tropic Marin's own classic formula like you already mentioned. You don't want anything fancy for your salt. I would sell/give away/throw in the trash the Bioactif stuff you have now. Do not use it up before you switch. Quote Link to comment
rough eye Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 On 10/9/2021 at 12:08 AM, mcarroll said: Make sure the fish are being fed well enough. Eliminate wasteful foods like reef roids/benereef. (Every time you feed your fish, they in turn feed your corals.) hi i have a couple questions for you. first regarding floss: should i stop using it altogether? my tank is consistently about 5 ppm nitrates in fact i'm considering adding a 3rd fish to the EVO. i have a toad leather, colt, couple ricordeas, couple zoa polyps, candy cane, GSP and a purple stylo. secondly, regarding reef roids - i was thinking maybe i should pick some up today. mostly because of the candy cane/trumpet. the first LPS i tried was an acan and that melted pretty quickly. the trumpet seems to be doing fine after nearly 2 weeks but i worry it isn't getting enough to eat. i have been giving scant amounts of amino (aqua vitro). Quote Link to comment
Tired Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 Roids can be good if you feed them directly to corals that do best if fed, like LPS. Scattering it in the tank is useless unless you have a load of tiny filter-feeders you're trying to keep happy, but some corals do best being directly fed. LPS will take frozen foods, often pellets, and often reef roids. I don't know about trumpet corals in particular, but I know my acans shrink up if not fed at least once a week, and do best if fed more often. You don't need specifically the roids to feed them, though, just use whatever you give the fish. 1 Quote Link to comment
banasophia Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 Sorry I don’t have time to read all the comments, but based on your original post I think your lights are not on nearly long enough to feed your corals the light they need with stock lights. I run stock lights on all my tanks… my approach is that with less strong lights, run them longer. I would run the white lights at least 8 hours a day personally. I run my whites in my Evo 5 like 12 - 16 hours/day, and my corals grow really well. I don’t feed my corals at all, the only food they get is pellets that drop into them when I feed my fish… and I didn’t have any fish in this tank for a couple months so all they got was light and they did well and continued to grow well. Also, I only use the blues on this tank at night after I fish feeding the fish, before I turn the lights out to give the fish a sense of bedding down for the night. 1 Quote Link to comment
mcarroll Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 4 hours ago, rough eye said: hi i have a couple questions for you. first regarding floss: should i stop using it altogether? my tank is consistently about 5 ppm nitrates in fact i'm considering adding a 3rd fish to the EVO. i have a toad leather, colt, couple ricordeas, couple zoa polyps, candy cane, GSP and a purple stylo. I would stop using it for the time being at least. IMO mechanical filters rob food particles from your corals. (Nothing in the tank would really qualify as "waste" if you were to ask your corals.) 4 hours ago, rough eye said: secondly, regarding reef roids - i was thinking maybe i should pick some up today. mostly because of the candy cane/trumpet. the first LPS i tried was an acan and that melted pretty quickly. the trumpet seems to be doing fine after nearly 2 weeks but i worry it isn't getting enough to eat. i have been giving scant amounts of amino (aqua vitro). Same applies: If you're feeding your fish, they are already feeding your corals everything they should need. (Unless you're removing this food with a filter....ahem! 😉) Just make sure other related factors are good as well – for example, low flow will put a crimp in all kinds of things for your corals (eg. eating, pooping and breathing!) due to the increase it causes in each coral's boundary layer. Higher flow, on average, will make a coral less dependent on feeding as it brings them more access to whatever nutrients are present. 1 Quote Link to comment
banasophia Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 I wouldn’t run a tank without filter floss personally, just giving a different perspective. I turn off my flow when I’m feeding, then turn it back on when I’m done feeding. When I’m done I want the excess food removed by the floss not to mention other random things that might fall in my tank like pet fur. When I want food to get in my corals from the water column, I run the powerheads without the pump. Quote Link to comment
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