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Clown sleeps under HOB filter


Jakesaw

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I see a similar about clown by poweread getting blown, but mine is a bit different so making a separate post. Mine sleeps under HOB filter.  Only flow is from Whisper HOB filter.  Basic 10 gal water, "fish-in" live and dead rock cycling 2 1/2 weeks in.

 

Every day my clown fish is swimming around in the tank mostly mid to towards top of water column but basically in open space above the rockwork  He has a healthy appetite and a great personality. 

 

But every morning when the aquarium light turns on, my tank looks fishless.  It used to scare me but I'm starting to accept as my fish's normal personality.  The young clown sleeps under the water flow of Filter when it's dark.  When the light in his tank turns on, a few minutes later he'll swim out from behind filter and spend the day swimming for everybody to see in water column  

 

Does anybody else have this experience.  Is this normalish bahavior for a clown.  I'm not sure if it's a part of the stress from " fish-in" tank cycling with a bit of ammonia or normalish behavior for a clown.  It's my first saltwater fish so I'm learning. 

 

Thanks

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Just now, Xj reefing said:

I do not get why people do fish in cycles

" This people ": did them because it was first Marine tank and Having planned Ammonia but feeling it a bit daunting having never tested water in prior FW aquarium experience.  LFS helped me get started and took away my feet dragging and I thank him for it.  I was able to get started after many years of thinking about Saltwater tank. Ended up doing " some live rock " b/c of budget with dead Marco rock I had picked up in the mail intended for tank.  My Rock arrived mostly too big for my intended tank so I needed rock again and blindly buying online again sight unseen wasn't something I wanted to do. 

 

If you want to harp on the issue I agree with you on, that's fine.  But as far as taking it personally at this point for me, the horse is dead.  I'm already planning second tank and will do my second tank with Ammonia & testing with knowledge from what I've learned during this process. 

 

If I never got started, I'd maybe missed out on ever enjoying the hobby.  Learning new hobby is a process of mistakes and learning experience.  Chalk this up as both for me.  

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Right on @Jakesaw. You’ve come to understand that it’s not the best practice for a fish cycle. Admitted that it’s not the best and have the best intentions in the future.  All you can do. At one point in time is was believed that it  was the best practice. LFS’s can steer you in the wrong direction sometimes because of two reasons. 1- trying to turn a profit. 2- lack of knowledge. Not that I’m a chemist/biologist but I’ve had plenty of retail people try to give me advice or sell me things that have never even owned a tank of any sort. I have a feeling you’ll have some great tanks in the future! Good things to come from you I’m sure👍🏼

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5 minutes ago, Jungle_v_i_p said:

 LFS’s can steer you in the wrong direction sometimes because of two reasons. 1- trying to turn a profit. 2- lack of knowledge.

I will never fault a company for trying to turn a profit.  If all the LFS go out of business b/c they aren't profitable, the aquarium hobby would not be better for it.  

 

Companies have to turn their inventory be it Brick and mortar or Internet special site like Marine Depot, Premium Aquatics, or others.  Otherwise - bye bye business.  Especially during this Covid year.  I try and be an informed shopper and support my LFS whenever I can.  

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20 hours ago, Jakesaw said:

If you want to harp on the issue I agree with you on, that's fine.

As if people who cycle fishless don't have problems and don't kill fish in the process.  (Just look up threads on fishless cycling.  OMG.)

 

The "cruel" remark is an emotional cue.  Not that helpful, but I understand where it comes from.  

 

However, this should be a more mathematical/numerical conversation....a technical problem to understand and solve, not a moral issue.

 

If we were on the ball, there would be recongnition of the role of dilution, folks would mention an actual level (ppm) where ammonia stops being the completely normal part of the ecosystem that it is, and starts being a source of fear and angst like it was hot lava or something.

image.png.78b16b401be8f1a7c9528ebc791edf22.png

 

Ammonia is thankfully not hot lava.  

 

It does not burn on contact, or anything like that.

 

In fact, every animal has mechanisms to deal with excess ammonia.   Some animals (even fish) can deal with incredible amounts of ammonia on a routine basis.  Some animals can deal with less.

 

Also ammonia in the water can be almost non-toxic if pH and temperature are relatively low.

 

When you take into account the control over ammonia toxicity that we have in our control of dilution, pHtemperature and selection of optimal fish (or even selection of non-fish), there is no inherent need for there to be a problem with this.  

 

When you further take into account the ready-to-go bottled and substrate-applied bacterial communities we can seed our tanks with, there's REALLY no need for there to be a problem....even if we do all that other stuff mostly-wrong!

 

Even Dr Tim says there's no reason for fishless cycling right in his FAQ on the One and Only product.

Quote

Can One & Only be used for fishless cycling?

Yes, but there is no real reason to do fishless cycling with One & Only.

 

But that whole message is more complicated to spell out and I think a lot of folks these days are probably just unaware of this info.  

 

It has been well covered territory on web articles and OF COURSE IN BOOKS, such as Moe's "Marine Aquarium Handbook..." though. (...which is something I recommend about ten times a day to folks on here.  👍😉)  

 

Of course there are also some great academic articles on ammonia tolerance and toxicity if you wanna get deeper into it.  Even a whole book on nitrogen excretion in fish.  (BTW, Chapter 4 on "Toxicity, Tolerance, and Excretion" (p 115) it goes into "Why ammonia is toxic."  Many potential effects, but none are acutely lethal.  The next major section of that chapter (p 123) covers ways of reducing, tolerating or avoiding ammonia toxicity.)

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